1. #1
    Hans684's Avatar Senior Member
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    Controversial Future AC Games

    No this is not a racist/sexist thread, leave such outside this discussion. The question is how far are any of you willing to push the historical protagonists stories?

    Here is one of my ideas.

    "I support such ideas highly, thing is it might be to "controversial" among fans. People are already screaming against Rogue because they won't kill their "brothers" and play the "bad guy". This series should have so much grayness that people would be confused about what side to choose. Equal treatment of both orders is my proposal, the Templars have been show in black and white view because of the Ezio trilogy. So why not have something like "Mafia's Creed"(because that's what people would call it if Ubisoft did even with the AC name, same case with Pirates(BF)). Obviously the name of the game won't the "Mafia's Creed", it will be AC [number or not and or subtitle related to theme/focus]. An AC during times where Mafias had creat influence and fought agains each other. Now let's say each Mafia order is a broken part of a big disagreement in the entire Assassin Order. Because of that the Assassins split up but all their goal still collide so they fight each other "for a better future"(their usual main goal). That's something I'd love to explore and in such a game the Templars will be the authority hunting the Mafia.

    Or we can turn that idea on it's head, the order still split up and fight but we are a Templar Agent(and cop) hunting the Mafia(Assassins/criminals). It can be considered an Assassin Civil War from both perspectives but in one we are in the middle of it and in the other we try to stop it." - My reply to the AC Civil War thread.

    Now it's your turn, how far would you push it? Do you scream "WE NEED MORE GRAYNESS!!" yet turn around and call Assassins "good guys"? I don't care either way, I just want to know your limit. It's not from a gameplay perspective. This is further story ideas that might be to "controversial" for fans like playing the corrupt Mentor of a corrupt Assassin Order. It's about pushing the limits and inspire the writers. If they do push more limits like with Rogue(from story perspective) I'll enjoy the Assassin/Templar war even more. It's boring to always be "good". Like with AC3, we played Haytham, he saved slaves, killed he slaver and Edward Braddock. He gave the Templars a good side, a human side.
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  2. #2
    RinoTheBouncer's Avatar Senior Member
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    I like your idea. I’m interesting in seeing the Assassins going through dark times and corruption and I’m totally WITH moral grayness cause that’s what ACI was. Yes, some of the villains were bad in an exaggerated way, but the speeches we had with them made the differences become gray rather than black and white and that’s what I loved about it. ACII, AC:B and AC:R are my favorites but those mainly had the typical “bad” villains, most of the time and there wasn’t much debate about who’s right. I loved how ACIII got that feeling back with Haytham and it faded away again with ACIV:BF.

    I’ll be really happy to see such stuff happening, linking the Assassins to the Mafia, and then having this whole civil war between them. It’s interesting and perhaps you can be Templar agent who ends up allying with the “good Assassins” for one reason or another and ends up respecting what they stand for and help them against the corrupt ones..etc. I’d also love to see a game about the Illuminati, perhaps. I mean so many conspiracy theories talk about the Freemasons or the Bavarian Illuminati existing before and vanishing and others say they exist until now and they just control everything from behind the scenes. From one look, they appear to be the Templars who seek control and are known for wealth and power.

    I remember a member here long ago saying something interesting about them which is that “they’re the illuminated/enlightened ones, the ones who work in the darkness to serve the light” so that makes them more like Assassins. So who knows? I believe this topic itself is worthy of discussion and it’s a real life conspiracy theory and a large part of it is a fact regarding their origins in back in the 13th century.
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  3. #3
    Layer_13's Avatar Senior Member
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    Originally Posted by RinoTheBouncer Go to original post
    I like your idea. I’m interesting in seeing the Assassins going through dark times and corruption and I’m totally WITH moral grayness cause that’s what ACI was. Yes, some of the villains were bad in an exaggerated way, but the speeches we had with them made the differences become gray rather than black and white and that’s what I loved about it. ACII, AC:B and AC:R are my favorites but those mainly had the typical “bad” villains, most of the time and there wasn’t much debate about who’s right. I loved how ACIII got that feeling back with Haytham and it faded away again with ACIV:BF.
    AC:IV was not black and white. It was morally grey like AC:3.
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  4. #4
    aL_____eX's Avatar Senior Member
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    Sorry, but where was ACIII 'morally grey'? Templars are bad, Assassins are good (okay, maybe that's not entirely true) but the game had much black-white thinking in it. Although Connor started being skeptical about everything, the roles were still clear.
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  5. #5
    I-Like-Pie45's Avatar Senior Member
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    A World War II game where you play as an Assassins on the side of the Axis

    Ultimate Moral Ambiguity
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  6. #6
    RinoTheBouncer's Avatar Senior Member
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    Originally Posted by Fatal-Feit Go to original post
    AC:IV was not black and white. It was morally grey like AC:3.
    For Edward it was, yeah since he basically didn’t belong here or there and he was just doing missions for both sides not knowing who’s good and who’s bad but I kinda felt like the Templars were obviously bad guys. There wasn’t much to debate about them. While for example Haytham really convinced me of a lot of things and same for Al Mualim.
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  7. #7
    Layer_13's Avatar Senior Member
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    Originally Posted by RinoTheBouncer Go to original post
    For Edward it was, yeah since he basically didn’t belong here or there and he was just doing missions for both sides not knowing who’s good and who’s bad but I kinda felt like the Templars were obviously bad guys. There wasn’t much to debate about them. While for example Haytham really convinced me of a lot of things and same for Al Mualim.
    I agree with that to end extent. The Templars did get more screen time, and arguably more charming characters in AC:3, but they weren't the bad guys. They have sympathetic morals and goals that are arguably more justified than Edward and the Assassins. For example, the west indies Templars were also tired of the crown. Tired of all the taxes, false promises, and lies. That is why they wanted the crystal skull to blackmail. Compare that to, well... What did the pirates do with all the freedom for the past two years? Literally nothing. They pissed it all away. Ben Hornigold, Burgess, and Cockram all had a point.

    Originally Posted by Daniela425 Go to original post
    Sorry, but where was ACIII 'morally grey'? Templars are bad, Assassins are good (okay, maybe that's not entirely true) but the game had much black-white thinking in it. Although Connor started being skeptical about everything, the roles were still clear.
    The Templars' actions were considered bad, but their goals weren't. They wanted freedom, but not the way the rebels or Connor wanted. And if anything, their methods would have caused a whole lot less bloodshed. For example, if Johnson bought the natives' lands, it would be his property and in theory, no one can disturb the natives as long as he's in control.
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  8. #8
    Well in previous games except ACBF we saw the story purely from the assasins POV, we saw what he was seeing and got connected with him. If he has the commitment to kill these people because he truly believes they are evil, we will too. Altair doubted his targets intentions, thats why we see doubtful character kills as well. These upcoming games are products prepared or delivered by Abstergo with possible hacked versions. We will see stories much more from the templars side, instead of morally gray.


    I just hope it doesn't end in happy cohesion with templassins fighting to save the world.


    Don't ship that mayrice, don't.


















    I'm dead serious... don't.
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  9. #9
    ze_topazio's Avatar Senior Member
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    Everything is morally grey provided you agree with them to an extent, even Rodrigo and Cesare, Rodrigo never explained why he so desperately wanted to open the vault, one can assume it was for the greatness of the order, Cesare wanted to unite Italy to put an end to the constant conflicts as explained by Lucrecia.

    However the Templars are black to me, because I can't possibly agree with them, the only Templars who truly explained their methods and purposes were the ones from the first game, no matter how good their intentions were, they sounded like crazy men, same for Haytham, he spoke of peace but like all the other Templars his final goal was a dictatorship.

    The Templars speak of peace and good intentions all the time but their methods and final objectives are clearly evil, and they have always been portrayed as evil, sometimes more subtly than others but always as being the ones in the wrong.
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  10. #10
    Helforsite's Avatar Member
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    @ze_topzio:
    What the hell are you talking about? The Templar's goal is peace through control. They are however prepared to do anything to gain that control and peace which often involves violence. Does that make them bad? Maybe.
    The Assassin's goal is also peace, but contrary to the Templars, they want the people to be free even if that means destruction, war, murder etc. Does that make them good? Maybe.
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