Individual checkpoints | Forums

[Inquisitor_FIN]

If you've never played them...then why are you arguing for something that you have no experience in.

I've never had learning wheels on my bike either but I can still discuss the value of them being available. I'm discussing, not arguing. I've also never owned a phone with buttons the size of my fist but that's also good to have available for people who need that stuff.

Look at it this way, imagine ridge tracer, easy right? well if people uploaded individual checkpoints of hills, you'd go..uhhhh what the duck, but...a lot of people would still finish it, and the same reasoning applies, to help learn a technique/throttle control etc.

The same reasoning actually does not apply since I can't imagine anyone spending 27 minutes and 490 faults to get to the last hill of Ridge Tracer.

Individual checkpoints that aren't good/aren't designed to help people, basically trash should not be near the top of highest rated, since other people have put hours and hours into their tracks, opposed to a 1 minute individual checkpoint which shouldn't even be on there.

Again, "good" and "trash" are subjective. And what makes you say that it only took the person uploading an individual CP 1 minute to come up with the obstacle? Are they not part of a larger picture that may have also taken hours and hours upon hours to build? A single CP from a difficult track is always helpful for practise and it's pretty hard to dispute that.

[IImayneII]

If I wanted to get better at the last CP of Maborosi Lite, I wouldn't even dream of going through the whole thing again just to have no faults or time left for proper practise. THAT is the appeal and use for the single-cp uploads. Them being good or not is highly subjective and kind of besides the point.

Why would you even want to get better at the last CP if you can't even do the other checkpoints? (this is debatable but still)

You don't see people releasing checkpoints from extreme tracks for people to practice on, wich would probably help alot more people then releasing checkpoints from a ninja track that 98% of the community will never even try. Releasing like 10 checkpoints from one track (mostly all in a few days) is ridiculous no matter what, and rating them 5* is as ridiculous. 90% of the ninja's don't even deserve 5*, but they are clearly held by another standard then other difficulty tracks. Why? I have no idea... My problem with these cp releases is they clog up the feeds, and will be only played by max 2% of the community (probably even less). It's not because it's a ninja track "riders" deserve special attention. Probably 30% of the community can't even do the extreme ones, don't they then deserve CP releases for extremes so they can practice them? You see how ridiculous this would get if everybody wanted seperate checkpoints to practice obstacles? The only way this would be acceptable is if there was a whole seperate feed for it, but since there is not I am not a fan of this.

[Camzarcar]

If I wanted to get better at the last CP of Maborosi Lite, I wouldn't even dream of going through the whole thing again just to have no faults or time left for proper practise. THAT is the appeal and use for the single-cp uploads. Them being good or not is highly subjective and kind of besides the point.

Why would you even want to get better at the last CP if you can't even do the other checkpoints? (this is debatable but still)

You don't see people releasing checkpoints from extreme tracks for people to practice on, wich would probably help alot more people then releasing checkpoints from a ninja track that 98% of the community will never even try. Releasing like 10 checkpoints from one track (mostly all in a few days) is ridiculous no matter what, and rating them 5* is as ridiculous. 90% of the ninja's don't even deserve 5*, but they are clearly held by another standard then other difficulty tracks. Why? I have no idea... My problem with these cp releases is they clog up the feeds, and will be only played by max 2% of the community (probably even less). It's not because it's a ninja track "riders" deserve special attention. Probably 30% of the community can't even do the extreme ones, don't they then deserve CP releases for extremes so they can practice them? You see how ridiculous this would get if everybody wanted seperate checkpoints to practice obstacles? The only way this would be acceptable is if there was a whole seperate feed for it, but since there is not I am not a fan of this.

I completely agree ^

and...inquisitor, you can tell if people put in the effort....and if they spent hours doing a crappy obstacle, then that's their problem...people who do crappy full tracks, well their tracks are usually looked past, so why should individual cp's be any different.

[Inquisitor_FIN]

Why would you even want to get better at the last CP if you can't even do the other checkpoints? (this is debatable but still)

Point being that I can practise the last CP which (in this hypothetical example) is the only one I can not complete with plenty of time to work. I can just keep going at it without spending the time to get back to it every time.

You don't see people releasing checkpoints from extreme tracks for people to practice on, wich would probably help alot more people then releasing checkpoints from a ninja track that 98% of the community will never even try.

True, a lot of people will never try let alone complete a ninja track. But the difference in difficulty is potentially insane when it comes to ninjas vs. extremes. You can most likely complete an extreme track even without fine-tuned techniques and wild, consistent maneuvers even if it took you a lot of time. I can't say that for ninjas.

Releasing like 10 checkpoints from one track (mostly all in a few days) is ridiculous no matter what, and rating them 5* is as ridiculous. 90% of the ninja's don't even deserve 5*, but they are clearly held by another standard then other difficulty tracks. Why? I have no idea... My problem with these cp releases is they clog up the feeds, and will be only played by max 2% of the community (probably even less).

I do agree that people should consider releasing the checkpoints at a slow pace to avoid filling up the feeds. I'd guess people rate ninjas highly because they get a rush from the sense of accomplishment when they finish the track / cp. That's bad rating practise but sadly not something that can be changed if the rating system stays as is.

It's not because it's a ninja track "riders" deserve special attention. Probably 30% of the community can't even do the extreme ones, don't they then deserve CP releases for extremes so they can practice them? You see how ridiculous this would get if everybody wanted seperate checkpoints to practice obstacles? The only way this would be acceptable is if there was a whole seperate feed for it, but since there is not I am not a fan of this.

No one deserves special attention, all riders are equal. That said, all difficulties are not equal. As I noted before, an extreme track is likely passable even without fine-tuning your runs on a single obstacle while timing / faulting out. It most likely won't take you an enormous amount of time either to get to that pesky one obstacle that might be giving you trouble.
That's why I appreciate the potential value in the ninja CP-uploads.

This is just my opinion though and everyone is entitled to theirs.

[Fernanjoe]

The whole rating system is flawed, id like to have a few categories to rate on, line/deco/theme etc.

[Inquisitor_FIN]

I would also support an individual feed for cp's, but It's not going to happen.

Not necessarily just for CPs but all Ninja stuff. I'm keeping my fingers crossed for that!

[IImayneII]

No one deserves special attention, all riders are equal. That said, all difficulties are not equal. As I noted before, an extreme track is likely passable even without fine-tuning your runs on a single obstacle while timing / faulting out. It most likely won't take you an enormous amount of time either to get to that pesky one obstacle that might be giving you trouble.
That's why I appreciate the potential value in the ninja CP-uploads.

This is just my opinion though and everyone is entitled to theirs.

True. Maybe it does for a small amount of people (probably <20 people), but at the end it affects alot more people by dominating feeds. If you want to perfect a ninja, you will have to practice all the checkpoints, not one. If you have to go trough half of the track to get to the cp you want to practice, you will get better on the ones before that, so I don't see the need why you should be able to practice the last one before all the others, but ofcourse I can see why it helps.


And this problem can even be solved pretty easily. Put a trigger in the ninja (like Rb) so people can switch to the next checkpoint, but when they use it they can't finish the track anymore. It's as easy as that.

[Inquisitor_FIN]

And to be honest, this problem can even be solved pretty easily. Put a trigger in the ninja (like Rb) so people can switch to the next checkpoint, but when they use it they can't finish the track anymore. It's as easy as that.

If this idea was to be adopted by the ninja-builder community... Just beautiful. Hell, I'll do this if I build that level 1 I've been wanting to. Great idea, absolutely love it!

[IImayneII]

And to be honest, this problem can even be solved pretty easily. Put a trigger in the ninja (like Rb) so people can switch to the next checkpoint, but when they use it they can't finish the track anymore. It's as easy as that.

If this idea was to be adopted by the ninja-builder community... Just beautiful. Hell, I'll do this if I build that level 1 I've been wanting to. Great idea, absolutely love it!

spread the word

[TeriXeri]

And this problem can even be solved pretty easily. Put a trigger in the ninja (like Rb) so people can switch to the next checkpoint, but when they use it they can't finish the track anymore. It's as easy as that. I don't even know why they aren't even using that to be honest.

Completely agree this should be done for Evo in upcoming tracks made by people. Great idea.

I really dislike checkpoint tracks for practice taking over 48/week/all-time feed slots due to the rating system.

I'm not a huge ninja rider, but I respect the ninja community however. And I'm all for giving them opportunity to practice in a way that doesn't obstruct the normal feeds.

Same as I really don't like seeing 2-4 of the same track shared in short time unless it has clear description of fixes and a new name so you can tell which one is the right one, I can understand a re-release in extreme broken cases, but more then 2 in a row just means not tested enough, applies to all track types.

I hope Fusion will have a seperate ninja feed.

A short-term solution could be a simple tutorial for how to code in the checkpoint mechanic in a tutorial, so at least the forum-going builders for Evo and Evo gold can adapt