You get what you pay for.![]()
Just a point to bring up the emotion engine is from the ps2 not the ps3!
Exclusives on the ps3 are considerably more impressive than anything on xbox 360, this is not just subjective. Only people who deny this are xbox only onwers who have never played a ps3 for more than 5 minutes.
This time around ps4 is a much more developer friendly platform. Unless xbox one's optimisations are miraculous and that edram can give the xbone bandwidth to match the ps4, I don't see how it will make up for having half the fill rates of the ps4 gpu and 4 less shaders. In the absolute worst case scenario we are looking at 17% better gpu performance from ps4 at the very minimum IMHO. This article is M$ PR BS in my opinion.
Bottom line is identical games where the xbox is struggling to maintain fps, the ps4 is likely to run smooth. D2' predictions only.
I'm not expecting a dramatic differnece between the two platforms, but am expecting the ps4 to edge out the one much the way the original xbox did the ps2.
Either way I don't see the point of these silly comparisons. Both systems will be capable of delivering great games and in the end that's all that matters.
Disclaimer: The above are D2's predictions only.
P.S I love you all![]()
Originally Posted by Barrybarfly
Yeah i agree, i guess the exclusives will run fine because that's the only console their programming it for, but i couldn't imagine playing any multi consoles games on the ps4 when the generation is near the end cause of the past experience with other games on the ps3, like bf3 on ps3, terrible optimization
They're very different platforms (PS3 and PS4), PS4 seems to have been designed with these issues in mind and is far easier for developers to work on from what a lot of developers have said. So I doubt we'll see any issues with either platform for cross platform games.Originally Posted by snipen108
"There are things about our system architecture not fully understood" Quoted from Albert Penello of Microsoft. Funnily enough the only person to claim this is from Microsoft. Plus love the hint that it will get more powerful over the years from its likely underpowered beginning. It will be powerful enough to push out great next gen games, but it clearly WONT be more powerful than PS4 due to both raw stats & any early reports from unbiased devs. Also the more powerful cpu/gpu of ps4 that AMD have custom built to be further utilized down the line is what m$ should be concerned with. Never mind the 8gigs of gddr5 unified memory.
However, only Microsoft is going to lock apps behind its Xbox Live paywall. Sony has confirmed that streaming video content like Netflix, Hulu Plus and MLB.TV on PS4 won't require a PlayStation Plus subscription.
Next-generation console buyers who don't plan on paying the yearly fee and do plan on using the system for entertainment purposes may want to weigh that into their final decision.
If no one understood what they were trying to do, it was because their explanation was **** poor. There were rumours on just about everything and they clarified very few of them. Here is a few stats.
Microsoft XBox One vs Sony Playstation 4
Console Hardware Specification Comparison
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Using the information that is available as of June 15th, 2013, this is a fact based comparison between the 2 consoles to help highlight the differences.
No comparisons will be made of the peripherals, games or external services, since those items are a moving target.
To simplify this comparison, all references to Microsoft XBox One will be shortened to XB1 and Sony PlayStation 4 will be shortened to PS4
Launch Price:
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PS4 = $400 USD
XB1 = $500 USD, the Kinnect Peripheral is included at this price (and possibly the IR blasters needed for the Cable Box function)
APU: (Accelerated Processing Unit - CPU with embedded GPU)
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PS4 = AMD 8 Core "Jaguar" Sony Custom APU
XB1 = AMD 8 Core "Jaguar" MS Custom APU
- Both are custom chips from AMD, but the Microsoft Chip has a high speed 32MB cache(ESRAM) and associated logic to compensate for using slower memory. Cache usage complicates the chip design and adds expense, but will improves overall performance.Benchmarks will be needed to see if the PS4's faster memory and CPU combination versus XB1's slower memory and high speed on die cache combination prevail.
(For example, data fetch that misses cache have significant performance penalties.)
XB1 Dev notes also indicates the MAX reserved system resources allocated for running games is 6 cores out of the 8.
Unified Memory:
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PS4 = 8GB GDDR5, 5500Mhz (176GB/s Memory Bandwidth)
XB1 = 8GB DDR3, 2133Mhz (68.3GB/s Memory Bandwidth)
- Memory is "shared" between the CPU and GPU on both systems. Over Simplification: GDDR (also synonymous with vRAM or Video RAM) is expensive, is high bandwidth, has a higher latency, but can read AND write within the same cycle. DDR has lower latency, but can only read OR write within the same cycle. DDR is good at moving small amounts of data. GDDR = Extremely Fast, Streams based data moves. DDR = Slower, but good at Random read /write. In this application, gaming consoles tend to be video centric so the use of GDDR will greatly benefit the PS4 GPU. (Higher performance GPUs use GDDR.)
Also important to note, the OS foot print between PS4 and XB1 is significant. PS4 will occupy roughly 1GB for the OS versus XB1, which will occupy roughly 3GB.
PS4 = 7GB available for game / GPU memory.
XB1 = 5GB available for game / GPU memory.
GPU:
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PS4 = Approximation: AMD Radeon HD 7870, 1152 GPU Cores, 1.84 TF
XB1 = Approximation: AMD Radeon HD 7790, 768 GPU Cores, 1.23 TF
- PS4's graphic processing unit combined with the GDDR5 onboard memory will be approximately 50 - 60% more powerful for running games than XB1. (XB1 Dev note also indicates that MAX reserved system resources allocated for running games is 90% of the GPU's capacity.) Anecdotal evidence has shown that using GDDR5 vs DDR3 on equivalent GPUs can increase a game's frame rate performance by over 80% depending on the game type.
HDD:
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PS4 = 500GB, upgradeable, swappable
XB1 = 500GB, non-removable, not user replaceable
- In terms of storage, the PS4 has the advantage in multiple ways. 1.) Investment is future proof in the sense that it can be replaced and upgraded. The probability, but not confirmed is the ability to replace the traditional mechanical HDD with an SSD for speed and reliability or just replace the existing storage with a larger HDD without having to resort to an external USB drive - which for many becomes an aesthetics issue. 2.) Since MS has moved to a Digital Content Only licensing scheme, which means ALL games must be loaded into the HDD, free space will be rapidly reduced as your library grows. Consider the following: the average current generation video games occupy roughly 3-5 GB of space (without DLC) and as much as 18GB for games like Final Fantasy XIII, HD Movies range from 6 - 15GB for 2 hours at 1080p (with no clear indication of file size for the up and coming 4K HD video file size) and lastly the DVR function will also place a strain on free space. I know many are thinking of how the "Cloud" will off-lay some of these concerns, but based on the current information, Sony's implementation of the "Gaikai + Cloud" will have less of an impact on local storage demands.
Optical Drive:
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PS4 = Blu-ray / DVD optical Drive, Games Region Free, Game Support
XB1 = Blu-ray / DVD optical Drive, Games Region Locked
- PS4 has several distinct advantage. 1.) You can play the game directly from the Blu-ray disc. (XB1 Blu-ray media are only used to install games on the HDD.) 2.) Region Free means you can get other games from other Countries and play them on the system. For example, on the PS3 there is a large selection of games made in Japan that do not make it to the American Shores. You can still purchase Japanese games from specialty providers and they will play on and American system without issue.
Network Connectivity / Ports:
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PS4 = Gigabit Ethernet, WiFi (802.11 b/g/n), Bluetooth 2.1 (EDR), USB 3.0
XB1 = Gigabit Ethernet, WiFi (802.11 b/g/n), WiFi Direct, USB 3.0
- The major difference between the two platforms is Bluetooth vs WiFi direct. XB1 uses WiFi Direct, a new connectivity standard that boasts ease of use, higher security and speed. Since Wifi Direct is used for communicating to the hand held controller, there is a question of battery drain. It is a new standard, so finding peripherals using WiFi Direct is nonexistent. PS4 with Bluetooth will still be able to capitalize on the vast amount of bluetooth peripherals currently on the market. (Keyboards, Mice, Headphones, etc.) For example, the Microsoft Elite Bluetooth Wireless Keyboard will work fine on the PS4, but will not work on the XB1. Until WiFi Direct is adopted by the market, XB1 will have to use a wired keyboard.
Audio / Video Ports:
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PS4 = HDMI 1.4 Out, Digital Optical Out, AUX
XB1 = HDMI 1.4 In & Out, Digital Optical Out
- Both platforms claim 4k video support, but how that will be implemented is yet to be seen. The XB1 has an HDMI In for overlay support to be used in conjunction with a cable/satellite box system. XB1 adds Xbox OneGuide - TV Guide - to manage cable box programming. - The following is my personal opinion based on my own extensive home theater/entertainment knowledge. If you only have a TV, cable box (or satellite box) and the XBox One, then this may be a pleasant experience - if the cable/satellite guide system is inferior to the Xbox OneGuide. If your home entertainment system is a bit more complex, e.g. / Dedicated Surround Sound System, Additional Sources like other gaming systems (most people I know have at least 2, if not 3) and other inputs (VCR, security camera feed, etc.), then this proposition may not work out so well. In a home theater setup, the Audio Receiver is often used as the video switching system. Going from the cable box, then to the XB1, then to the Audio Receiver (then possibly to an outboard video processor) and finally to the TV / Projector introduces complexity, noise and audio lag. We could expand on this extensively and talk about various configuration options, but it's enough to say I have doubts on this feature.
Commentary:
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- Licensing Changes (subject to change)
For generation 8 consoles, Microsoft has adopted a new games licensing model, which is a digital content only model - which will end the use of physical media as a medium for where games reside. This means the Blu-ray "game" disc being sold at retail for XB1 will only contain the game installer. It is merely a shortcut from having to download the full game from XBL. Once installed onto the HDD, there is a requirement to activate the game and associate it with an XBL online account. The installation disc is now useless for resale, unless you wish to go through the process of "unlicensing" the game from your system.
Because of the new licensing model, DRM will have to be in place. Technically speaking, "Used" games do not exist in this model. There is significant controversy on the new licensing model and associated DRM. One of the requirements to enforce the new DRM policies is to have the XB1 "check in" every 24 hours with a licensing server. The requirements are even more stringent if you play a purchased game on a console not registered to your XBL account. [If you want to "lend" a game to play on your friend's XB1 (who you must have friended for at least 30 days), the "check in" requirement is every hour.] If the 24 hour "check in" is missed, the gaming functionality is disabled until it can re-establish a connection to the licensing server. There are other limitations, but you can read more online.
Because of how far the XB1 is into its production cycle and knowing how much supporting infrastructure had to be deployed to support the new licensing model, I have serious doubts that this can be changed or reversed in the future.
Opinion wise, I would whole heartedly support this new model if there is a significant cost advantage (since MS and the publishers would get more revenue from cutting out piracy and eradicating the "used" games market) and if they would provide some type of secure license caching mechanism that would allow for extended offline play. - Taking the XB1 to the cabin with you for the "rainy" days would be useless.
Also, keep in mind that outside of in-house studios, both XB1 and PS4 will allow devs / studios to determine their own DRM scheme.
- Adoption of APU
Both platforms have adopted an x86 (CISC) based processor versus their previous generation which is RISC based. (PowerPC 970 for the Xbox 360 and Cell Processor for PS3). This means that native backward compatibility does not exist between the next gen platform and the previous gen platform. Having said that, Sony intends to pull a "rabbit out of a hat" and provide the PS4 access to the top games from the PS3 library through Gaikai. Details are forthcoming; but if true, the PS4 will have access to a larger library in 2014 than XB1.
- XB1 controller vs PS4 controller
These are peripherals and will not be discussed.
- Kinnect vs Eye
- Microsoft Mirror vs Sony Vita
- OS
There are vast differences between the OS's in the 2 system. MS focused on general functionality and multimedia (3GB Footprint), whereas PS4 seems to focus on a simpler OS (1GB Footprint) to keep more resources available for game development. MS uses 3 operating systems to manage their endeavor for the XB1: A Hypervisor (which boots the system; manages the hardware through a hardware abstraction layer that VMs talk to and manages the Virtual Machines), an XBox OS (for playing the games) and Windows OS for all the other multimedia applications. Hypervisors are very minimal, but having the XBox OS and Windows operating systems on one box gives additional attack vectors for hackers and virii. I think the memory space consumption and the penalties involved for VM's are self evident.
- Cloud
Not enough details at present from either platform to discuss. The "Cloud" will be the way forward for all devices, whether it is for remote computational power (distributed processing), remote storage, streaming, remote application services or accessing large persistent worlds that would not be available locally.
- PS+ vs XBL (Playstation Plus vs Xbox Live)
Both are evolving, both add value to their respective platforms and whether you agree or disagree, both will be mandatory for multiplayer online play. (caveat - PS4 does not require PSN+ to access Netflix, Hulu+, Amazon, Crunchyroll, Music Unlimited, Video Unlimited and MORE… whereas XB1 requires XBL to access any commercial online media service.)
- Other considerations
Multi-platform development systems tend to be written for the lowest common denominator. In the case of XB1 vs PS4, the XB1 seem to be the lowest common denominator between the two consoles. In other words, the PS4 will most likely have overhead which will not be tapped by multi-platform games. Games that are written exclusively for the PS4 will most likely offer greater capabilities, but because of its exclusivity, comparisons cannot be drawn between the XB1 and PS4.
- Looking forward
- If the PS4 is outed as the superior hardware platform and if it turns out that the XB1 is merely running virtual machines via a hypervisor, then I would say that it is a matter of time before someone is able to run the XB1 hypervisor and associated OS's on the PS4. Why would they do this? Because they can. (MS would lead in such a cause because there is no profit to be made on the hardware side.)
- MS will eventually open up the XB1 to Windows Applications via the "Cloud" (and the same will probably occur for the PS4.)
- Sony has many divisions and will probably offer a "tie in" to the PS4 that could bring about some very interesting propositions.
- The bottom line
On paper, the PS4 hardware seems to be superior in every way, shape and form, but until benchmarks are run and production boxes are put through their paces, the stats are just that - stats.
Real World Performance tends to vary greatly depending on the circumstance.
The bottom line is to vote with your dollars. The differences between these platforms might be marginal or could be significant, but the greatest hardware means nothing without software to run them. In other words, each and every one of us are different. We don't buy these consoles because of the hardware specifications. We buy them for the software and services that drive them. Both systems have great software coming to them. But… Because Sony may have the superior hardware platform, its staying power within the gen 8 cycle may be greater than the XB1.
I hate my 360 (that's my Xbox and not my mopar engine)....
Its already been stated that the PS4 OS will occupy 3.5gb with the possibility that up 1gb can be recovered by the developers in some instances, while the MS OS will take up 3gb and isnt flexible..
I am fairly sure M$ will be flexible if over time they if have no use for the extra reserved space - after all they were once inflexible with requiring Kinect.
Something I didn't mention earlier. I am personally disappointed with the specs in both "next gen" systems. I understand why they are the way they are, but was expecting more given the long wait.
Just remember to keep your initial expectations in check. Most of the demos of "next gen" games have been shown on high end PCs. BF4, Watchdogs and alot of other games (though they will be far better than ps3/360) won't be as shiny as the demos we've seen. That being said i am begging for them to exceed my expectations![]()
Some of those information above 2 posts are incorrect.
Xbox One:
It's isn't region locked now. You CAN trade your Xbox One games now. It doesn't require internet connection, only once is needed for day one update. There is UNLIMITED cloud storage (yes, MS confirmed it, probably Gold is required)
Playstation 4:
Developers can decide whenever the original PS4 game purchaser can or not lend games to others, and Xbox One isn't, but devs can do online passes for games to play MP, but SP can still be played even with the online passes affected.
Other word is, what is Microsoft Mirror? Do you mean the second screens, Smartglass and PS Vita on Xbox One and PS4? What do mean PS4 will be the overhead of mulitplaform games? PC is still the most powerful platform. The shape and form of PS4 isn't superior. It is skewed, so it means it wastes more space for nothing. Also, it doesn't look like a smart console from shape, while Xbox One is shaped boxed, which is great, and it is shiny professional black.
In my opition, I wish games were still locked on account because I don't want to put the disc every time in when I play for retail games, also I can easily download these on other consoles with my account and I DON'T want to trade games or want to buy used games. Only my dad buys me used games, but any those games are not my favorites.
I wish at least I have an option that I want the used game policy so I don't need to get through the 7th generation disc pain again. At least the downloadable versions of any game will be available at launch, also special editions, so that means I don't need to run into the city and buy a disc version again!
Also, people don't just decide because of the devices and hardware of the console, the are mainly buying consoles for GAMES AND EXCLUSIVES, also the price, but when there are games like Titanfall or Dead Rising, people would still buy Xbox One no matter anything else.
@Blaster you misread what he was written. It meant the extra power on the ps4 may not be used by third parties, but we'll see how that pans out over time. If one system can reach critical mass faster than the other, then that will impact how developers approach development as well.
As you said, it's about games and it's not wrong to choose the system that suits you most whether that be xbox one or ps4.
Obviously it is superior as it has more power available in a much smaller console, even with that wasted space! Its not purely functional in its design shape.Originally Posted by Blastergamer
But frankly, who gives a crap about the actual look of either console? I barely notice either of my consoles, I'm more interested in what they put on the screen!![]()