New Track - Hoss Valley | Forums

[rlmergeuser]

Hello all, I just wanted to ask for your help in giving me feedback on my first map. It is an outdoor map with a HARD difficulty rating. The platinum time is set to 6:10.00, so it is a pretty long track. It has a mix of technical areas and big air jumps with lots of decent scenery, but no decorations added yet. I uploaded it last night when the glitch was preventing ratings from showing up, so it fell to the bottom of the pages very fast. It is possible to beat the track on any of the 3 bikes I allowed, but I have only ever managed to 0 fault it on the Scorpion. If anyone would like to try the map it is named Hoss Valley[beta].

I would appreciate any type of feedback at all. Feel free to msg me in game or post here to tell me the things I can work on to become a better builder and to make the final version of Hoss Valley as good as it can be. ANY type of feedback is appreciated, I will not report anyone for swearing or anything if you happen to do so in an in game msg to me. A big thank you in advance to anyone who will try the track and I hope you all enjoy! I have had great reviews from friends that have played the track as well as a 4 star average from the 9 public ratings it got before falling to the bottom of the page.

EDIT: My gamertag is Uncle Randy. Capital U and R with just a space between the two words.

Thanks again! Happy riding and good luck in the valley!

[HoorayItsMike]

Are we assuming your gamertag is UncleRandy? If it's not, be sure to tell us what it is, including all capital letters and what not.

[rlmergeuser]

Thanks mike, sorry about that. I edited my original post to include my gamertag.

[HoorayItsMike]

Randy:

First off, I know that you want to get feedback before you release your final version, but it's always better to try and get friends to try it out before you release it on Track Central. It's never good when you see V1.0, V1.1, V1.2 or beta in the title. It just makes people not want to try it.

Now, as for the actual track...

Your target audience for this type of track is 'm assuming) certainly in the minority. It definitely feels like Gigatrack, and as far as I'm concerned, most people weren't very fond of Gigatrack. At least, in terms of a custom track that people play completely for fun, they don't really want to play a track that's styled just like Gigatrack. It's just really long, and nothing is more annoying than being 4-6 minutes into your good run and then faulting. It's just not nearly as fun as a normal track for most people. No matter how much you perfect your track, I don't think I would ever truly enjoy it from a Trials standpoint. However, from a Gimmick standpoint, a track like this can definitely be fun if done properly. A gimmick is basically a track people play completely for fun where the riders are generally supposed to ignore leaderboards and just enjoy the track for a great theme, or some other "gimmick" that makes the course really fun and/or exciting. Usually gimmick tracks are only fun for about 1 or 2 playthroughs, and then the rider may never play it again, but they did truly enjoy it for those couple runs. I don't mean to get you down right off the bat, but these are just my opinions and may not reflect other people.

Looking at it from a Trials standpoint (which is what I believe you are going for), your track was alright. Most obstacles flowed together well, although the difficulty really varied throughout the whole course. You also used the dirt/hillsides a LOT as an obstacle. A bit too much IMO. You also had too many occasions where if the rider hasn't memorized what obstacle is coming up next, then they are almost guaranteed to fault. I shouldn't have to memorize a 6 minute track just to get 0 faults on it. I should know it fairly well, but not every detail around every corner. You also crossed over the same path way too many times and it just made it look sloppy. The driveline also had a TON of completely unnecessary turns and jolts that the made the rider move in different directions and it also made the track feel sloppier. Most of the obstacles were decent, but nothing really stood out to me AT ALL that made me think "wow, that was a neat obstacle". The fire part at the end would actually annoy the crap out of me since it forces a fault if I'm not going fast enough.

Overall, if you're going to stick with the Trials standpoint, know that most people probably won't be fond of the concept of a track that long. However, there's definitely people that will enjoy it, but there's also a LOT of work that you can do on it before making it the best it can be. Remove anything that is annoying or unnecessary first, THEN work on perfecting the obstacles and/or adding/changing new ones to allow riders to enjoy the course more.

Good luck!

[rlmergeuser]

Mike:

Firstly I want to tank you for taking the time to try out the track. I also want you to know that you aren't getting me down at all with your feedback, just the opposite in fact. A lot of the points you brought up were things that I agree completely with. Particularly the part about needing to know the track to do good on it. While my friends and I seem to do ok on it, I completely understand other folks not wanting that type of gaming experience when they come on to play trials. I feel that this track will be the only one that I make that will be that long.

Thank you for mentioning the part about the track crossing itself as a negative. Believe it or not, I was getting only good feedback from my friends about that aspect of the track, so it is very good to hear that there are folks out there who do not like that style. Had you not said anything about that, I probably would have continued doing that in excess in future maps. As far as releasing it when I did with the [beta] tag on it, I felt like my friends and I had come as far as we could just testing it ourselves. It seemed like the only way for me to see all the problems with it would be to get it up on the track central and see the replays of the other people driving it to see how the different obstacles affected different bikes and driving styles. I also had a buddy who was on my hide to get it on there so he could play it when I wasn't around.

I won't cover all the points you made, but they are all very valid and I appreciate the feedback immensely. I had a conversation with a buddy at work today about the inconsistent difficulties and how there are a lot of folks who don't like that in a map. I also mentioned that players like us are definitely in the minority which is something you also mentioned that I think makes good sense. Were the kind of guys who would play Gigatrack all day if that's what was on the menu and it seems that not many others are in the same boat.

I will work hard to clean up the driving line and also add the animated tire tracks on the ground to show folks where they will be driving. I have also thought about putting up signs to warn people of impending obstacles. Unfortunately, I will not be changing the fire at the end, as it was my intention to cause the rider to have to take that last part quickly and smoothly, but I will most likely be cleaning that area up quite a bit before I get a final out there.

Thanks again for taking the time to play my track and come back here to post detailed feedback! I also appreciate your straightforwardness with your feedback. It is very nice to know what I need to work on in order to make a good solid map. I will be coming back and referencing this thread as well as your other reviews to help keep myself on the right track!

Also a huge thank you to everyone who played and rated the map! Before I posted here the map had 283 downloads and 9 ratings with 5 of them being my friends. Now it has over 3700 DL and 75 ratings and it made it into the highest rated 48hr section where it is easier for the other players to find and try out. This is a great site with a great community and I cannot thank you enough.

[HoorayItsMike]

Thank you for mentioning the part about the track crossing itself as a negative. Believe it or not, I was getting only good feedback from my friends about that aspect of the track, so it is very good to hear that there are folks out there who do not like that style. Had you not said anything about that, I probably would have continued doing that in excess in future maps. As far as releasing it when I did with the [beta] tag on it, I felt like my friends and I had come as far as we could just testing it ourselves. It seemed like the only way for me to see all the problems with it would be to get it up on the track central and see the replays of the other people driving it to see how the different obstacles affected different bikes and driving styles. I also had a buddy who was on my hide to get it on there so he could play it when I wasn't around.

Firstly, I came off a little bit incorrectly with the crossing the track as a negative. It's not a negative if it's done correctly. Way of the Ninja does it correctly. I think the under bridge over bridge crossing section is pretty cool in any given track, and I'm sure there's tons of others that are cool too. However, when there are two checkpoints right next to each other physically, and one is farther along in the track, it just seems dumb that my rider can't just turn a little and go towards the end of the track. Do you understand what I mean by that? It's just not sensible to keep crossing the track randomly on flat ground. I feel like I'm going in circles instead of making progress to the end. In Way of the Ninja, it makes complete sense as to why I need to go all the way around and then up onto the bridge, that's just the way the track was designed and it works well to cross it.

I won't cover all the points you made, but they are all very valid and I appreciate the feedback immensely. I had a conversation with a buddy at work today about the inconsistent difficulties and how there are a lot of folks who don't like that in a map. I also mentioned that players like us are definitely in the minority which is something you also mentioned that I think makes good sense. Were the kind of guys who would play Gigatrack all day if that's what was on the menu and it seems that not many others are in the same boat.

I will work hard to clean up the driving line and also add the animated tire tracks on the ground to show folks where they will be driving. I have also thought about putting up signs to warn people of impending obstacles. Unfortunately, I will not be changing the fire at the end, as it was my intention to cause the rider to have to take that last part quickly and smoothly, but I will most likely be cleaning that area up quite a bit before I get a final out there.

I wouldn't worry too much about the inconsistent difficulty if you are going to leave that fire obstacle, as that's probably the hardest one. The valley in the middle really isn't too bad since you give the rider so much momentum. So I guess that was almost a moot point besides the fire obstacle, which you're leaving in. However, I would definitely still work on smoothing out the driveline a bit and maybe improving the smoothness of some of the obstacles. Most of those were fine, but a couple got super technical, and just really killed the flow. I know I kind of said this before, but REALLY work on smoothing out the turns that you make. I watched your replay and there's like 20 parts in the track where the rider literally gets jerked at a 45 degree angle or more to just slightly turn in a certain direction. There's also some super long stretches of all hill obstacles and absolutely no scenery. Try to add some stuff in there that fits in. Even a fence or something would really make it better, and try to either add obstacles or cut down on a lot of the long hilly areas.

One other thing I forgot. Do NOT adjust the camera angle so that you can see obstacles more easily. Design your track so the default camera will work better instead. Trust me.

Thanks again for taking the time to play my track and come back here to post detailed feedback! I also appreciate your straightforwardness with your feedback. It is very nice to know what I need to work on in order to make a good solid map. I will be coming back and referencing this thread as well as your other reviews to help keep myself on the right track!

Also a huge thank you to everyone who played and rated the map! Before I posted here the map had 283 downloads and 9 ratings with 5 of them being my friends. Now it has over 3700 DL and 75 ratings and it made it into the highest rated 48hr section where it is easier for the other players to find and try out. This is a great site with a great community and I cannot thank you enough.

Cheers man. Glad to know my reviews are worthwhile. Let me know when you think you've improved it and I'll test it privately. I understand wanting to release the beta, and maybe for your first track or two where you're still learning it's the best move, but eventually you'll hopefully be a good enough editor where you'll be able to pretty much perfect your track and not need to release it just for testing.

[rlmergeuser]

Hi all.

Picking up a point from Mike's reply, how do you get to play a track that a friend has designed without them releasing it on Track Central?

Thanks,

Duncan

[emcee]

Hi all.

Picking up a point from Mike's reply, how do you get to play a track that a friend has designed without them releasing it on Track Central?

Thanks,

Duncan

Set up a private multiplayer lobby and put the track in your playlist.

[rlmergeuser]

Hi all.

Picking up a point from Mike's reply, how do you get to play a track that a friend has designed without them releasing it on Track Central?

Thanks,

Duncan

Set up a private multiplayer lobby and put the track in your playlist.

Cheers emcee