2 Drive line to different path questions. | Forums

[rlmergeuser]

I just don't see how you can have 2 checkpoints occupying the same point in the map and the game tell the difference which checkpoint you are passing through.

We'll know for sure in a couple days, but my thinking is this:
The game tracks your "progress" along the driveline (let's call that variable P for progress) as well as the (x, y, z) position in the physical world. If you think about this, it MUST do this, or the game would get confused when the driveline looped around and intersected itself.

Now if you look back at Tutorial 2: Spline points and Checkpoints, you can see a clear visual connection between the checkpoint and the matching point on the driveline. This means that checkpoints must also have a "driveline position" C as well as a physical world location (x, y, z). You trigger a checkpoint when your rider's position P = C.

So two different checkpoints, even if they have identical (x, y, z) coordinates, could have different C1 and C2 "driveline positions" (if C1 is from the "first lap", and C2 is from the "second lap").

Just my theory at this point, but I think it makes sense. In fact, you can imagine a tracking method like this becomes necessary as soon as you allow curved drivelines (because you can no longer just use the x coordinate of the warehouse).

[rlmergeuser]

But I for one can not wait to see what's possible as far as getting two paths, maybe even three (or more?!) in a track. It would be interesting to see a varying difficulty track. Imagine if you could start one track, and through a sort of selecting at the beginning you would choose Easy - Extreme. The major fault I see in this would be the timing of making a longer easy track and a shorter extreme track (for the racing time factor.

All of what we are talking about here is without seeing the advanced checkpoint/spline tute video to come.

If you wanted say 5 different paths, you just need to 'loop' back to the common checkpoint after the trigger event on the first lap, 5 times. Realistically, with the right path layout, you should be able to make multiple paths, within multiple paths, within multiple paths. You could go so far that you'd need a NavMan to get your way back!!

I'd also guess that you will be able to make any checkpoint an 'End' point. I can't see why not - maybe it will be one of those 'advanced' features later.

[rlmergeuser]

I've had another look at the Bike and Rider editor video. I can see an issue with the 'looping track' idea. It appears that when the bike and rider 'transport', they entirely disappear then reappear. It's not like in the game portal where you walk in one hole and out another - I.e. if the front wheel passes the transport, it won't appear at the destination before the entire bake passes through.

Strategic hiding of the rider behind explosions, objects etc could overcome this.

A bit if Dev input here would help me speculate further... Hint, Hint, Hint...

[rlmergeuser]

Wouldn't matter if the checkpoint and the trigger were placed at exactly the same location, would it? You'd just .. be there.

[rlmergeuser]

I've had another look at the Bike and Rider editor video. I can see an issue with the 'looping track' idea. It appears that when the bike and rider 'transport', they entirely disappear then reappear. It's not like in the game portal where you walk in one hole and out another - I.e. if the front wheel passes the transport, it won't appear at the destination before the entire bake passes through.

Strategic hiding of the rider behind explosions, objects etc could overcome this.

A bit if Dev input here would help me speculate further... Hint, Hint, Hint...

Yes, the whole bike will warp at once. But as you said, you can hide it with objects or something.

So this idea should work, although you might have to save the bikes velocity at the moment it enters the portal and then according to that set a force at the portal exit in order to keep the bike moving.

[rlmergeuser]

Yes, the whole bike will warp at once. But as you said, you can hide it with objects or something.

So this idea should work, although you might have to save the bikes velocity at the moment it enters the portal and then according to that set a force at the portal exit in order to keep the bike moving.

Thanks for jumping in on the thread pahapertti.

From what I saw though, if you have Physics enabled, the bike should just continue on the same trajectory/pace/etc as before? I see what you mean from all the logic gates, timers and force items though. It realistically shouldn't be that hard. If you did have to use the 'save velocity' feature, I'd guess you would have to do the 'disable damage' thing because if the rider was going at full pace and leaning backward, that amount of force applied would most likely be enough to rag doll the poor bastard.

Also, the thing that people had mentioned regarding the appearance of multiple checkpoints in one location is easily fixed with use of the Visibility modifier.

Hey pahapertti, quick question - has this idea (or version of it) been used on any of the tracks that ship with the game?

[rlmergeuser]

Thanks for jumping in on the thread pahapertti.

From what I saw though, if you have Physics enabled, the bike should just continue on the same trajectory/pace/etc as before? I see what you mean from all the logic gates, timers and force items though. It realistically shouldn't be that hard. If you did have to use the 'save velocity' feature, I'd guess you would have to do the 'disable damage' thing because if the rider was going at full pace and leaning backward, that amount of force applied would most likely be enough to rag doll the poor bastard.

Also, the thing that people had mentioned regarding the appearance of multiple checkpoints in one location is easily fixed with use of the Visibility modifier.

Hey pahapertti, quick question - has this idea (or version of it) been used on any of the tracks that ship with the game?

The bike actually loses it's velocity when you reset it to a point on the driving line. So you'll have to set your bike's speed to a data source at the moment you hit the spawn trigger and then use it to determine the amount of force you need in the exit portal. Getting the force to feel "natural" will probably be quite challenging, but otherwise there should be no problems. And yes, the invulnerability is probably good to be switched on for that moment when the force kicks in.

We did some tests with this sort of idea a while back, but it was a bit too late to add it to any of the in-game tracks.

[RetiredRonin]

Would it be possible to use an event/trigger that moves the physical location of a checkpoint/spline point?

It so, it could make it easier to fake branching lines while only using the original amount of cp/splines.

[Euphoric Fusion]

Wasn't there somewhere that you could set the bike's speed AS the source?
If there is then you only need to use that dynamic data as the velocity at the spawn point.
That way whatever speed you had before will just continue after.

[rlmergeuser]

The bike actually loses it's velocity when you reset it to a point on the driving line. So you'll have to set your bike's speed to a data source at the moment you hit the spawn trigger and then use it to determine the amount of force you need in the exit portal. Getting the force to feel "natural" will probably be quite challenging, but otherwise there should be no problems. And yes, the invulnerability is probably good to be switched on for that moment when the force kicks in.

We did some tests with this sort of idea a while back, but it was a bit too late to add it to any of the in-game tracks.

Okay. I was hoping the velocity would not be an issue because the rider did appear to continue on his trajectory in that tute vid. However he was 'bailing out' and not riding.

Wasn't there somewhere that you could set the bike's speed AS the source?
If there is then you only need to use that dynamic data as the velocity at the spawn point.
That way whatever speed you had before will just continue after.

I think it will be a bit more complex than that - mainly because of the time delay between recording the bikes speed then teleporting, then trying to instantly bring the bike and rider up to speed again. You would need to take into account riders lean, speed, braking forces, bike rotation etc to make the transition feel natural and so that the whole thing goes on without the player even being aware in the least. Some but not all of these could be overcome with strategically placed objects, 'blurring' of the cameras, smart use of light (or lack of) or just plain old explosions! Really the idea wont be that hard to implement. It will just be very freaking difficult to make it feel natural.


And even Shifty is in on this...