I do not mean a combat system as in running around a corner into another player and panicking and quickly hitting L3 so as to instantly grapple and knife the guy and kill him. I mean combat as in if I went around that corner and decided I was too close for gunplay, I could quickly pin this guy up to a wall and start throwing punches, of course he would be able to throw punches or escape (Maybe with a button mashing?) such as in RDR when you tackle an enemy to the ground and start throwing punches at his face. But I want close encounters to feel just as real as gunplay. I want my blows to actually land and make his head snap left or right, his nose to bleed or a lip to be busted open. I also had an idea where if you were fighting an NPC if you were able to take him to the ground you would be able to tie his hands with cable ties and get XP for non-lethal actions. But I would really like to be able to finish opponents when they are low on health. Such as if they are pinned down or to a wall, I could take out a knife and each player would have to press a certain button repeatidly to kill or keep from being killed, and the lower your health would be compared to the other player the lower your chances would be of overpowering the other player. I know a lot of people don't like button mashing, but when someone is trying to stab a knife through your chest, button mashing comes closest to the feeling of trying to overpower the other player
As this is an online game, I don't think it would be possible, as the two players grappling would have to enter an "instance". This means you'd either have to lock them out from other players, or take into account other players interactin with them. This would be unfair as you could mob the target, lock them in an "instance", then simplly get one of your allies to shoot him.
Well, from my vast experience in gaming, I can tell you that I would not be impressed with a close quarters combat system that required combinations or repetitive "action button" mashing. With one option I feel like I'm playing a glorified "Simon Says" tournament to the death and the other leaves me feeling helpless against the first ADHD player I bump into who just finished a snickers. Also, the second of those options usually leaves my character dead and me physically feeling as if I just endured a seizure. I hope whatever system they implement rewards players who play tactically and smart over the dreaded, "button mashers". Perhaps they could allow some of the ranged weapons to be swung in melee if the situation arose, as well as introduce some melee use weapons ( i.e. bats, tire-irons, golf clubs ) designed for close-quarters use. I like the idea of well-placed shots on your opponent rewarding the aggressor by granting you with a tactical advantage.
Here is an Example of what I mean:
You are low on ammo, and are on a roof top of a building the rest of your party is trying to gain access to. A sniper has them pinned down and is just around the corner. You draw a police baton you found in the street and move in to strike. You swing - and depending on where you strike the sniper, it effects him differently. Say you hit him in the primary arm he is using to wield his rifle, perhaps the rifle is struck out of his grasp and skids along the ground nearby. Now the tables are turned as you begin pummeling him while he tries to block you fruitlessly without a weapon. Or perhaps you swing and strike him in the head, it could inhibit his ability to aim assuming he wasn't disabled from the blow altogether. No one likes "instant kills" on a character they've invested lengthy-times on and earned hard-to-get equipment with. However, if you have obtained a garrote or combat knife and can sneak up on someone well enough, should the game not reward the player with some sort of devastating boon?
I'm sure whatever close quarters combat system they decide to go with will be just as innovative, balanced, and polished as the rest of the game-play they've released. If I come up with anything on the drawing board, I'll make sure to post it here and submit the idea up.
Yeah personally I think a primarily stealth build (with melee options) would be the most successful as you stated. If I could sneak up on someone completely undetected and get within the range necessary to put a knife in their back or slit their throat I think it should be an instant kill. They have long ranged weapons and especially if they are in a squad if I could penetrate that group undetected with a sharp object the game should be over for them (As in they respawn not die permanently) The game should reward a player who is tactically intelligent enough to reach their target without him noticing should get a massive crit bonus or an instant kill as the reward.
Ubilax, I agree entirely. If you have the necessary smarts, skill, and/or luck to sneak up on an opponent who is unaware of you, and you're armed with the means to, it should be an auto-kill. That is a lot different than the ol' "We bump into each other while running corners, and I happened to hit the knife button first so you die". That stuff drives me nuts. Every "Tom Clancy" game I've played has always rewarded those who thought before acting and played smart over playing hard. I hope whatever system they devise continues the legacy of it's predecessors. I've always preferred the "Tom Clancy" games for their ingenuity and rewarding players who use the environment to their advantage, making keen impromptu decisions. Like the example above, I'd love to see a system that gives advantages to close quarters combat - when executed wisely and efficiently.
Jumping someone into melee when they're armed with automatic rifles sounds scary and risky. However, I'd like to see instances in play where, when executed properly, melee could be advantageous. Perhaps you could be hiding, peeping over the corner and an unsuspecting hostile is approaching with a rifle. You are out of ammo, so you decide to use a melee weapon or go bare-handed. It would be awesome if a well placed swing at his arms or weapon disarms the target, or throws their aim off briefly. Perhaps buying the aggressor just enough time to try to place another melee swing in. Perhaps a good blow to the legs could cause the target to go prone or slow their movement speed down with a limp. A strike to the center of mass could deal some heavy damage, along with a blow to the head. Perhaps if successful contact is made to the target's head and the damage does not finish them, it could blur or impair their vision temporarily, again rewarding the aggressor with more possible opportunities for close quarter strikes.
I don't know if "Sam Fisher" style neck snaps are the way to run, but it would be neat to execute hostile Players and A.I. with special moves, once enough successfully melee shots have made contact. I also like the idea of non-lethal weaponry use. Like in real-life, running in and holding down the trigger until nothing is left standing, isn't always the right option. In fact, you shouldn't have the ability or resources to pull off reckless assaults like that successfully. Making an attack plan and tactical decisions before the encounter should always prove to be more beneficial than running and gunning. Going back to what was said above by zac268, I think some non-lethal use would be cool to throw in. Perhaps you're in the midst of things and don't have time to be trading punches and executing hostile players and A.I. - Maybe you get in a close quarters fight and land enough blows to the victims arm or leg that you can attempt to move in and disable them temporarily ( i.e. handcuffs, zip-ties, para-cord ). So that the victim is still alive and eventually will be able to free themselves, but it buys you time to get to where you need to be going. When it comes to non-lethal ideas and close quarters combat, I also would like to see one time use, rare items that could disable a hostile if used effectively. For example, if you find a X-26 taser with an un-deployed cartridge, you could attempt to disable an unsuspecting hostile in close range with it and keep moving toward your objective, assuming you were short on time and couldn't risk a close quarters confrontation. The taser doesn't have to auto-kill the victim, but it could knock them prone and / or stun them for enough seconds to get past them. Just some ideas. I'd like to see melee combat avoided, unless the aggressor has a tactical advantage that could afford him tremendous superiority over his target.
If stealth and melee would combined it could be a viable style of play. Though the ability to create a tank melee character is something I want to completely avoid. I could see there being a viable melee class with flash bangs and or tasers like you said earlier (there is a dream setup section and I created a tazer build with a machete so I could definitely go for what you were saying about that) It could be done, it would be very difficult but could be done. I could see having a high level perk where you could kill silently and before that each kill you do will alert every other enemy causing you to have to really think how you would go about killing people. I don't it would take some serious consideration but could add a whole new level of depth to the game.
I could see that! A stealth class would be interesting. I can see tasers, and other cool technology being implemented by the class. Although they'd have to be careful. The last thing we need is a melee class in a Tom Clancy game that does more damage than those with firearms. I could see where melee combat combined with stealth would be preferable in situations where one is trying to avoid being detected, but in the end - it should probably be a support class. I'm overwhelmed with nostalgia, thinking back to some of the "Splinter Cell" games that have come out over the years. Above all, as long as the game is balanced and each class has a roll to play, I'm all on.
Ammunition would be precious, especially in New York, where firearms are generally not allowed by legislation. Although I could see melee being a major part in many confrontations and conflicts, I wouldn't want the game to feel like "Mad Max" or "Escape from New York" - where guns are rare and ammunition is even rarer.
I think they have a lot of good directions they could take and I would be interested in seeing what they have in mind.
The problem I see with the whole come from behind backstab instakill situation. (And people do this in Last of Us aswell) If a stab from behind is an instant kill. People will just run up behind other players to stab and kill them without any thought of being stealth whatsoever. And even when confronted face to face, instead of trying to shoot or melee the player, they will instead strafe around you and mash the melee button until they get that cheap instakill from behind when they never snuck up on you in the first place. I'm not saying a stealth backstab isn't possible. I'm just saying don't mess the backstab up like Last of Us did.
But you will have 3 other people with you... depending on how friendly fire works this strafing (happens in dark souls) is an easy kill for the others. I think the tight knit team aspect of this game will prevent it from being abused. I mean if a guy is strafing with me to try and get a back stab and I have a sniper and a heavy machine gunner with me (and say a medic with a light assault rifle or something mostly for self defense) then this strifing guy will easily get picked off first. I think this won't be an issue because most pvp encounters won't be 1v1.