1. #1

    On the Quality of Naval Vessels

    Before I start, I would like to state that I am fully qualified to speak on this matter. I am crew on a replica 1830's hide brig out of Dana Point California. I have served as a yard captain on multiple occasions and have assisted in the training of new crew members. I am intimately familiar with ship's rigging, having nearly fallen asleep in it several times.

    I know much of this has been brought up before, so I would like to recap as well as add my own suggestions to the mix.
    1. Sailing vessels are not power boats. The vessels of the era would have sailed at an average speed of seven or so knotts in the conditions shown in the E3 video. I disagree with the criticism that the main player's ship could not be faster than the other vessels. The speed of a ship would have depended more on the shape of the underwater hull and the way the vessel was sailed rather than the sail area.
    2. A square-rigged ship can sail an average of six points (approximately 70 degrees) off of the wind. (To clarify, zero degrees off the wind means facing directly into the wind, while 180 degrees would indicate sailing with the ind directly astern.) When the ship is not sailing directly downwind, the yards that the square sails are suspended from are braced around (turned) so that the win will always be as close to perpendicular to the sails and yards as possible. The same is also partially true of the fore-and aft sails. THat would take another paragraph or two to explain.
    3. Ships did not explode after receiving a single broadside. Naval actions between two vessels could drag on for hours.
    4. The rigging in the latest trailer that the player climbs into is mostly inaccurate, and could be vastly improved without altering any game mechanics. The lowest yard should come to right under the tops. (the platform he climbs up to) There should also be futtock shrouds, which would dramatically enhance the visuals of climbing, and are present on all vessels of that era. These photographs and links illustrate the positioning of futtock shrouds:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Futtock_shrouds
    This picture was copyright protected, so I am linking to it:
    http://www.flickr.com/photos/27417638@N07/4126469638/

    These were vital structurally, as well as for use in climbing. They are also the most entertaining part of a climb.
    Most of the stays also seem to be missing. See my thread here:
    http://www.piratesahoy.net/threads/p...-a-ship.18554/
    5. All the ships' hulls are completely inaccurate, along with the decks, guns, crews, etc. I can elaborate further, if requested.

    Overall, I feel that the developers have worked hard to create a strong authentic atmosphere on land. I find it very disappointing that the same was not done for the game's maritime aspect.

    If anyone has any questions, or would like me to elaborate on any of the points I made above, please do not hesitate to ask.
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  2. #2
    To be fair, it IS just a game. Realism is sometimes good, but sacrificing gameplay for it is a terrible mistake any developer could make. This is very nitpicky.
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  3. #3
    Assassin_M's Avatar AC Expert
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    Its nit-picky, but an Interesting read, Nonetheless.

    Although I do agree with you regarding the rigging, it is inaccurate, but part of a design can sometimes be compromise, which means that sometimes things have to be semi-realistic to put more time into more important things..

    And welcome to the Forums
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  4. #4
    I do not want to wait that long for the ship to move and turn, because in the end it's about gameplay and believeability over realism, it's not a simulator.
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  5. #5
    OriginalMiles's Avatar Senior Member
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    tl:dr

    In all seriousness.
    So what? It's a game.
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  6. #6
    I do agree with the above points regarding gameplay vs. realism, but I personally think that what we've seen so far has been overdone. Take, for example, games like the Gentlemen of Fortune mod for CoAS. They remain arcade-like, but to a very small extent. The gameplay is still very entertaining. Realism does not necessarily mean sacrificed gameplay.

    I realize that the developers are focused on other aspects of the game, but small changes such as futtock shrouds, stays, and proper hulls could have been implemented from the begging without increasing the workload too much. Now, of course, it would take much more work to fix. Small changes, like a set of futtock shrouds, could make the entire vessel exponentially more realistic even without the inclusion of small details.

    Originally Posted by OriginalMiles Go to original post
    tl:dr

    In all seriousness.
    So what? It's a game.
    Well, one could say that it ruins the immersion for some people, such as myself, and several other individuals I know. They did a beautiful job creating Boston from period maps, and apparently did some very good research. Why can't they do the same for ships?
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  7. #7
    Assassin_M's Avatar AC Expert
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    Originally Posted by Post_Captain Go to original post
    I do agree with the above points regarding gameplay vs. realism, but I personally think that what we've seen so far has been overdone. Take, for example, games like the Gentlemen of Fortune mod for CoAS. They remain arcade-like, but to a very small extent. The gameplay is still very entertaining. Realism does not necessarily mean sacrificed gameplay.

    I realize that the developers are focused on other aspects of the game, but small changes such as futtock shrouds, stays, and proper hulls could have been implemented from the begging without increasing the workload too much. Now, of course, it would take much more work to fix. Small changes, like a set of futtock shrouds, could make the entire vessel exponentially more realistic even without the inclusion of small details.
    Small or minor detail on the outside can be VERY hard work on the inside..
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  8. #8
    Maybe they changed the design of the ship to make it more interesting to climb?
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  9. #9
    Without futtock shrouds and stays, It's far less interesting to climb. Unfortunately, I think it was just a lack of research.
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  10. #10
    Assassin_M's Avatar AC Expert
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    Originally Posted by Post_Captain Go to original post
    Without futtock shrouds and stays, It's far less interesting to climb. Unfortunately, I think it was just a lack of research.
    We may never know whether it was that or whether it was just a trivial detail that they thought wont make any difference , but on experts such as yourself seeing as it is not solely a sailing game.
    but as you said if you nitpick too much, you might risk not fully enjoying the game..
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