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  1. #11
    Jesus saves... passes to Moses, SCOOOOORE!

    (I know that's sacrilegious, but it's just so funny! No offence to any Christians...)

    "Stuff your eyes with wonder... live as if you'd drop dead in ten seconds. See the world. It's more fantastic than any dream made or paid for in factories." - Ray Bradbury
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  2. #12
    eek. i hope my previous post didn't lead anyone to beleive that i derive pleasure from the sort of things that occur in grand theft auto!!! i must assure you that i do not! i agree that games like that are MUCH different from something like doom, or farcry, or some sort of situation where you are the "good guy" trying to save earth/humanity/a girl/etc.

    i do take issue with the way games like gta are made, but i still enjoy them, not because of the mindless killing, but because, unlike the games i just mentioned, it's never the same twice. you can go anywhere and do anything, and even after you ocmplete all of the missions, the game isn't "over" you can continure to drive around, try new things, explore, etc. in my mind, the killing and destruction is secondary. i hate violence and death (especially the senseless kind) just as much as you, and when i play any video gme that involves vioulence, no matter what the ultimate point of the game is, i keep the fact that it's a game in the back of my mind. i try to avioud doing things that would be against my faith (like randomly shooting a passerby or some such act), because i take my faith very seriously.

    i also agree with what minihack said; that Jesus probably wouldn't sit down and play one of these games with me. that leads me to question whether i should be playing these games as well.

    i think i'm gonna sit back for a while and think long and hard about all of this--it really is an important question, and the various outcomes/answers, IMO, reflect on where our society is today. so props to you guys (and the millions of outher out there who are just like you) for sticking to your guns and not flinching back from what you believe
    in.

    EDIT: Just a thought, but as long as the issue of killing for "pleasure" vs. killing to achieve a goal or as the "good guy" has been raised...what about MultiPlayer, specifically DeathMatch or FFA? Wouldn't those fall under the category of "senseless" killing or something similar? Again, just a thought, not trying to start any fights or anything of the sort.

    God Bless America!

    "Those who have long enjoyed such priveleges as we enjoy forget in time that men have died to win them." --Franklin D. Roosevelt

    [This message was edited by spike_the_punch on Tue June 01 2004 at 02:10 PM.]
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  3. #13
    I would agree with you spike that games can be very interesting in that they have great "replay" value. I liked Deus Ex because you could play it different and use stealth instead of violence. But to be honest I liked the sniper option a bit too much.

    But this whole discussion on "reality vs. fantasy" is not thought out too well. Jesus says if you hate your brother even *in your heart* you have committed *murder*! It could be argued that hating someone in your heart is okay, because you didn't actually kill them; it was a "fantasy" but I think Jesus was accurate when he said those words. I wonder a lot how desensitized we really are to so many things of this culture (myself included).

    Anyways, I appreciate everyone's views here. And yes, that whole deathmatch thing does fall into that "senseless" killing category (I never really thought about that before, good point spike/punch guy).

    I still holding on to the viewpoint that certain games are ok but the more I think about it the more I really wonder.
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  4. #14
    as far as deathmatch and such, although the game style is deathmatch it is essentially just a 'tiny' part of a bigger battle' the concept is derived from 'getting focused narrowly' and a part of a battle. for example, a deathmatch in bf1942, would in reality be a skirmish between germans and americans. follow my point?

    as far as FFA... i would lean more towards an anarchy in which all are vying for control... trying to attain some semblance of order.

    ==================================================

    Community Manager | 2D Artist for Renegade X: The Dead 6
    Web Developer for RenEvo Software and Designs
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  5. #15
    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by minihack:
    I still holding on to the viewpoint that certain games are ok but the more I think about it the more I really wonder.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    indeed...i feel the same way. i have a lot of thinking to do...

    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by DreamWraith:
    as far as deathmatch and such, although the game style is deathmatch it is essentially just a 'tiny' part of a bigger battle' the concept is derived from 'getting focused narrowly' and a part of a battle. for example, a deathmatch in bf1942, would in reality be a skirmish between germans and americans. follow my point?

    as far as FFA... i would lean more towards an anarchy in which all are vying for control... trying to attain some semblance of order.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    I don't know about that--thinking that deeply into it might be taking it a little too far; by that I mean you might be trying too hard to justify something that you just can't/shouldn't be doing that to. But that's just my opinion at the moment--please don't take offense to it.

    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    God Bless America!

    "Those who have long enjoyed such priveleges as we enjoy forget in time that men have died to win them." --Franklin D. Roosevelt
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  6. #16
    none taken. im just rationalizing thought here. in the end it comes down to the following:

    what is in your mind when your doing what your doing?

    ==================================================

    Community Manager | 2D Artist for Renegade X: The Dead 6
    Web Developer for RenEvo Software and Designs
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  7. #17
    Your actions go along with your thoughts as well. The two can't be seperated. For example, "I'm sure it's possible to watch porn and think about writing your next sermon." You see how silly that last statement was. I know it's an extreme but it states a point.
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  8. #18
    Ultimately it depends on your close relationship with God. I don't mean that as a slam to anyone. I know that is what I seek but being human I fail everyday. I'm lucky that there is a litlle something called "Grace" because somedays I feel like the biggest sinner out there.
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  9. #19
    This is a real valid subject... I also restle with my values on this one.. I am a man of faith, But not really a practicing man of faith, therefore I play these Violent FPS's.. But Deep down, I don't think God appreciates any kind advocation to Violence.. Will it make people go out and Joint the forces?, I don't know, Will it desensitize people to be constantly in murderous competition?, I don't know, Cause it doesn't make me want to do anything of the sort, and I loath War and murder.. But I don't feel that God is all that Enthuzed about me playing a game that virtually re-creates what has pained god this whole time.. But man, Do I ever love my wargames... As someone said, It's really a matter of your relationship with god, and what you know to be in accordance with his will.. Remember, I am not aiming this at anyone, I am fully addicted to BF/DC and Farcry even though I despise war... But all in all, It's good to see someone raise this subject.. It's kinda like, If you went to Iraq, and watched your buddies, and enemies dying right and left, Blood and guts all over the place, Nightmares etc, And then came home, Would you play a wargame like BF or FC? Or, If you had a relative that has died in a horrible manner, would you still be able to look at Rotten.com in the same light? Food for thought..
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  10. #20
    Often we don't realize that we are accountable for all our actions...regardless of what they may be. But the good news is that God desires a living/daily relationship with every one of us. We don't have to be perfect since nobody is anyways (here I go preaching again). It is true though. God actively seeks us out. We just have to respond to Him.

    Anyways, I will continue to think about this. I do agree with you Steelhed in that I love FC and many other pc games (including Joint Operations!). These games are fun in that they look very cool (graphic wise) and you can play against others (Joint Opps - over 150 people at a time with hardly any lag!). Thanks again for all your responses to this topic (even BuddhaGamer...I don't think your joke was sacrilegious...just a bit silly.)

    I am amazed that nobody mocked this whole discussion though (Maybe some 13 year olds will prove me wrong).
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