I've just recently started flying PF+FB+AEP online. I've been flying the P-51 Mustang and getting my head kicked in every time I go up. I know there's people that have been flying for years and I'm a noob. But I'm wondering is the Spitfire an all around better plane in here, or do I just need to learn the Mustang? The reason I ask is it seems most people are flying the Spitfire, and it's rare to see a P-51.
It probably won't matter what you tell me, I'm going to stick with the Mustang. lol I'm just curious.
The Spitfire is often referred to as a 'noob plane' because it turns well, climbs well, dives well, doesn't overheat very easily, works well at nearly all altitudes, and, according to some, doesn't lose 'energy' like other aircraft in the game. In other words, it has good all round performance (top performance in some categories) but it has a drawback in that it isn't particularly fast.
As most new players don't know too much about air combat, they instantly assume that shooting planes down involves dogfighting that involves staying on an enemy's 6 whilst shooting away...because that's what they saw in films. This is loosely termed 'turn and burn fighting.'
In reality, 80% of real life pilots didn't know who or what killed them because their attacker came from an unseen position, usually above, at high speed. If their attacker missed, because they dove down and have a higher speed, it's often impossible to shoot back at them. The attacker repeats his attacks whilst being in a position of relative safety...This is known as boom and zoom (bnz).
The P51 is mostly a bnz aircraft requiring pilots with patience and skill to get the most out of it. That's why you won't see too many about. Other planes that require similar skills are the P47 (also unpopular) and the Fw190 (also relatively unpopular)
The Spitfire, on the other hand, often provides instant gratification. Hence lots of them
You're better off sticking with the P51 because you're likely to live longer (virtually) in it.
One on one with good pilots the Mustang will beat the Spitfire. The trick with the Mustang is to avoid getting into a turning fight and just use B and Z tactics. It's faster than most planes above 6000 meters too. Up there, you can dogfight with any German plane except the TA.Originally posted by dwright1971:
I've just recently started flying PF+FB+AEP online. I've been flying the P-51 Mustang and getting my head kicked in every time I go up. I know there's people that have been flying for years and I'm a noob. But I'm wondering is the Spitfire an all around better plane in here, or do I just need to learn the Mustang? The reason I ask is it seems most people are flying the Spitfire, and it's rare to see a P-51.
It probably won't matter what you tell me, I'm going to stick with the Mustang. lol I'm just curious.
Stick with the Mustang, and you'll do well in the long term; but it's not easy, it's not instant gratification and when you finally get it right people won't like you very much because you won't be doing much fighting - you'll just be killing.
Start with the D-20 and learn to use the gyro sight. This will teach you how to shoot. Air combat is all about gunnery - good flying never killed anybody.
Take a light fuel load; most IL2 maps are tiny as far as the Mustang is concerned!
Fly fast. Fly high.
Work on your gunnery offline. Learn to shoot accurately at convergence range.
Fly on "cockpit on" servers so that you stand a decent chance of bouncing your enemy.
Remember that the objective is to kill, not to fight. Having said that, a well flown Mustang can out turn a 190.
Once you've learned to shoot, discard the D and fly the Mustang III. The extra speed is well worth the loss of 2 guns IMHO. It basically makes you untouchable unless you're fighting jets (which are rarely allowed online).
The key to flying the Mustang is to realise that the enemy can only hurt you if you let him. Speed is life.
The key to fighting with the Mustang is to realise that gunnery is key. If you have a 10% gunstat, you're doing well compared with many pilots online, yet you're still missing out on 90% of the destructive power of your guns. If you can score hits, you will eventually start to rack up kills.
Most failures to kill are the direct result of failures to score hits.
Record tracks of your online fights and learn from your mistakes. Being shot down is no different from being subject to a flying accident; there's an error chain, and often it's quite long. Learn to break those error chains. Many of the links in the chain are associated with situational awareness - buy Track IR and use it!
You'll live longer and score more kills if you're on comms. Download teamspeak and buy a microphone.
Finally, remember what JFK said:
We do these things not because they are easy, but because they are hard!
A few after war quotes of former allied pilots. I think this show the relation between the Spit and P51.
Syd Antin enjoyed his Mustang time:
Wonderful airplane. Great airplane. But for our situation there, not as good as the Spitfire. The reason? The Mustang was built for longer range, it was a heavier aircraft - it could not maneuver as tightly as the Spitfire. The Spitfire was designed and built as a short-range fighter. You gotta remember that all it had to was cross the English Channel and it was in a war zone. The Mustang was designed and built to escort long-range bombers and to defend them in the air. Consequently, it had to have more armament and more fuel capacity, so it was heavier and it couldn't maneuver anywhere near as good as the Spitfire.
The Mustang? Great, I loved that airplane. For our job over there, for combat, we only had to fly a few miles to get to it so we didn't need the long range.
Gordon Levett compares the three combat aircraft flown by the 101:
In mock dog-fights, we concluded that the Messerschmitt could out-climb, out-dive and out-zoom the Spitfire and Mustang. The Spitfire could out-turn the Messerschmitt, the most important manoeuvre in air combat, and both could out-turn the Mustang. The Mustang was the fastest, the Messerschmitt the slowest, though there was not much in it. The Mustang had the best visibility, important for a fighter aircraft, the Messerschmitt the worst. The Spitfire cockpit fitted like a glove, the Messerschmitt like a strait-jacket, the Mustang like a too comfortable armchair. The Spitfire had two 20-mm cannon and four .303-in machine guns (sic; actually, the 101 Squadron Spits had two .50s, not four .303s), the Mustang six 12.7-mm machine guns (i.e. .50-calibre), and the Messerschmitt two 20-mm cannon and two 7.92-mm machine guns (sic; actually two 13.1-mm machine guns) synchronised to fire through the arc of the propeller.... Despite the pros and cons the Spitfire was everyone's first choice. (Levett 1994)
Giddy Lichtman, at least, preferred the Mustang, however (Lichtman, pers. comm.). Aaron Finkel told me that he performed a 360-degree roll in the S-199 once - and it scared him so much, he vowed never to do it again.
During his air combat career, George Lichter spent extensive time in the P-47, the P-51D, the S-199, and the Spitfire LF9. He felt the S-199 flew like ****, saying "You really had to fly it all the time." He loved the Thunderbolt's power and armor and preferred it over the P-51 for combat duty. While he felt the P-51 was perhaps more maneuverable, it had an Achilles heel - its inline engine, which if hit would conk out quickly. The P-51's Merlin engine would give you 30 minutes at the absolute most after being hit. The P-47's radial could take enormous damage and still get you home.
Like many other pilots, Lichter loved flying the Spitfire most of all. "It was an absolute dream. The Thunderbolt was like a truck, and the Spitfire was like a Porsche."
Jack Cohen, too, enjoyed the Spitfire.
Well as far as the Spitfire was concerned, she was just the perfect aeroplane to fly. She had no vices - you did something wrong she'd turn around and say, you know, "don't do it again." Not like some of these American planes. I mean, you know they'd turn round and bite you the second you did something wrong. But the Spit really didn't have any faults - it was like flying a Tiger Moth. Very easy to fly. (Hyde 2000)
Cohen recalls that the Spitfire guns were harmonized to converge at 300 or 400 yards. He also had kind words for the Mustang:
She was fast. If anything slightly faster. But I think the Spit had the edge on her as far as manoeuvrability. Of course, the P-51 had the range. So that's why they could do the long trips even with the bomber boys. She was a very nice plane to fly, but that was only after they put a Merlin engine in it. (Hyde 2000)