Member
Originally posted by bogusheadbox:
Can you tell me what exactly are you bored of?
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Well since you asked....
Don't get me wrong, I feel that as a piece of programming and as a simulation, SH3 is about as good as it could be, stunning really. One major source of boredom is the long long time spent in getting to the killing grounds and back (even with time compression) but I accepted that as part of U-boat life. So I played about 60 missions in career mode and sunk lots of ships. What really caused me to become bored with SH3, as a pastime, is that it lacks an overall sense of purpose somehow. Yes, I know that at the operational level, my purpose is to find and sink as much tonnage as possible and not be killed myself. And at a higher level, all this carnage is supposed to be choking England's war effort. But that 'big picture' is a distant abstraction in SH3. My contribution, and the general performance of the U-boat fleet in closing down Britain's war effort, is not reflected in any engaging sort of way. The most we get are lists of our own totals after each mission. It's like a junior accountant's view of the war.
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Member
I have to agree there, Nitrotoluene.
I started a career with the 1st flottilla at the beginning of the war, and played 11 patrols on my own "iron man rules" (i.e. not reloading saves if I mess up, except for this one time when there was a glitch with the hydrophone)
It was pretty fun, watching my tonnage rack up, knowing it was on 100% difficulty and that if I died, I was dead (I refused to reload and try again) I finally bought the farm tonight trying to attack a convoy off of N. Ireland (October 1940), and there was a genuine sense of regret, sadness, and anger when it happened, yet also accomplishment and satisfaction, as this has been my very first career and I managed to beat out Prien in tonnage(though historically he would outlive me by another 6 months)and survive some very close calls. Yep, nothing like going straight to 100% realism eh? lol.
No other game I have played, whether sim or not, console or PC, has given me this emotional range, this sense of attachment to an artificial reality. Yet despite the immersiveness and involvement, I did find myself becoming bored with fact that all I had done in those 11 patrols was go to a grid coordinate for 24 hours, and that no matter how good my performance, the game world keeps moving exactly the same. Also, attacking the convoy would have been a lot more interesting if there was cooperation with other u-boats.
I am going to start another hard-core career, this time in 1942 with the 11th flotilla, and while I will experience new threats, technology etc, it will still come down to patrolling X grid for 24 hours.
The developers should leave what SH3 does well, which is immersing you in the technical aspects of u-boat warfare, but they should add variation such as special assignments (perhaps that coincide with historical occurences, such as operating in support of the Norway invasion forces). These could be implemented and still retain a dynamic nature for the campaign. In other words, an historical operation or situation *can* be scripted, and the player's career still be dynamic, so long as the player is allowed to approach the situation as he chooses, and if small variables (such as ship postions, escort dispostion, etc.) are kept somewhat randomized.
Member
It's hard to say what the game needs to round it out, I'm not a game designer, but yes scripted campaigns may be one solution.
I found myself wondering if a simple in-built economic model of Britain's war effort might help keep a player's interest. It might track Britain's "health" in terms of some key things which need to be imported by sea (eg. oil, troops, military hardware, food etc). Depending on the damage inflicted by U-boats (using your U-boat as the lead example for its calculations) you would see the stocks of these things going up or down over time. This would be a function of your success at sinking tonnage and the number and size of convoys attempting the passage into Britain (reflecting historical records or just the program's own rate of convoy-spawning). The grand purpose of course would be to force the stocks of these items below some critical value for a long enough time to cripple Britain's war machine and/or starve the population into surrender.
The critical values could vary differently for each commodity over time, depending on what Britain was doing militarily at the various stages of the war. So, if you chose to concentrate on sinking tankers at a stage when oil wasn't the most vital thing, you would find it harder to achieve your grand purpose, but then again, it might end up being the wisest road to follow in the long term. Those kind of strategic challenges might help to give it an edge.
I know this could lead to non-historical outcomes. The chance that you could actually win the war of the Atlantic is implicit in this.
Interested in your (anyone's) thoughts .
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Member
There is a site (www.wolvesatwar.com) which seems to have a nice idea regarding team-effort and contribution to the overall war effort. I've tried to contact the site and register, but have had no reply yet (I'll wait a few more days though). This might be what some of you are looking for.
I've not grown bored of the game. I only get to play on weekends, so I spend the week looking forward to a patrol or two - that novelty hasn't worn off. I agree about the emotional immersion and the tension.
However, obviously we are all different, and some people will tire of the game well before others will. Horses for courses, really.
Banned
its boring after you have done and seen it all, sank everything there is to sink, been to nearly every port and you find more convoys and task forces on accident than on purpose. Plot your course and head out, set up your TDC and post your watch. Wait...........a full beer later, dive, sink ships, surface then report, repeat. My entire crew has the cross in gold and knights cross down to the sailors included, everyones rank is maxed out and the only thing you look forward to is getting back to port.
2.5 million tons sank and counting, and I find it more like a job to play than fun. When I finally drag myself to the end of the game, Ill uninstall it, put it all back in the box, then toss it in another box filled with beaten, out of date, impulse or gift bought games never to be seen again.
Senior Member
Tottaly agree with you!Originally posted by stinkhammer6:
its boring after you have done and seen it all, sank everything there is to sink, been to nearly every port and you find more convoys and task forces on accident than on purpose. Plot your course and head out, set up your TDC and post your watch. Wait...........a full beer later, dive, sink ships, surface then report, repeat. My entire crew has the cross in gold and knights cross down to the sailors included, everyones rank is maxed out and the only thing you look forward to is getting back to port.
2.5 million tons sank and counting, and I find it more like a job to play than fun. When I finally drag myself to the end of the game, Ill uninstall it, put it all back in the box, then toss it in another box filled with beaten, out of date, impulse or gift bought games never to be seen again.
Just to think of having single scripted missions on this game instead a DYNAMIC CAMPAIGN makes me feel sick enough to walk naked on the streets every Monday morning with a banana stuck on my *ss, wearing Terminator 2 like sun-glasses, a large VII-C tattoo on my back, my hands behind my neck, with a used condom on my nose and singing James Brown's: "WOAH! I FEEL GOOD!"Originally posted by AVGWarhawk:
What has bored me is the fact that there are no real missions to accomplish when you are in career mode. They need to add campaigns in career mode.
You don't have to go to grid X for 24 hours as described on the patrol's objective and then returning immediately to base. You can travel where ever you want. DYNAMIC CAMPAIGN translates in allowing the player to decide what to do during the patrol. You see, the higher the choices you have during a game, the longer will take the "boring" to come. But, if you're the: "Tell-me-what-to-do-next-or-I-will-just-sit-here-and-scratch-my-lowers" style person with no free will at all then this game is definately not for you...Just going to one spot on the grid for 24 hours gets old.
I guess you will love SH2 then, since it plays with scripted missions and there is nothing else on the ocean besisdes the ship(s) you have to destroy and you (basically). Now that is fun, an ocean just for both you, can you imagine that? And if you miss the ship HQ told you to destroy don't worry, it will be there at the same place at the same hour next time you try the mission again. (now that is fun!)
PS: I've see people complaining about many things about SH3, most of them I actually agree with, but, having someone complaning about SH3 having dynamic campaign... I guess I will just have to increase the naked runnings to Mondays and Tuesdays... Heck! Make it all week!
Senior Member
People (loads of us) asked for Dynamic Campaign because they hate scripted ones (go figure). There is nothing to be ashamed about desiring something, or these words of yours could be used against your desire of having a scripted campaign too...Originally posted by AVGWarhawk:
Thats a shame at best.
Member
Banned
This is a decent series but when you have played since the first one came out and its all the same then youll feel how I feel. As for best game, surely you are kidding, any of the Thief series are excellent games because there are so many ways of doing things and you can do things out of order in alot of cases.
As for best game, you sound as if you havent played alot of games, I can list 20 games off the top of my head that are better than this one.
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