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  1. #11
    Kean_1's Avatar Senior Member
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    Originally Posted by jmagnum50 Go to original post
    Concerning bullet sponges, ground drones, vehicles from past iterations would make sense. Heavy armored enemies could work if you hit them from behind (tell your teammates to draw their fire).
    This is the kind of mechanic I absolutely would hate in GR personally. It was one of things I despised about Breakpoint. I don't like the idea of bullet sponge enemies, bosses, etc. .....not in a squad based, military, tactical shooter at least. It's reminiscent of The Division with the RPG mechanics which is what lot of people criticized the game for. .....and why they tried to correct that but there is only so much you can do when these elements are so tightly woven into it's core.

    Originally Posted by jmagnum50 Go to original post
    As for training them, I don't know how that might work game wise. I know you said instead of leveling up, but do you mean like keep using weapons and tactics for training to increase their stats or what? Because it sounds like nothing changes about your soldier, and you just keep trying out weapons and tactics in training. I don't mean to diss, just wondering. Also, instead of leveling up GR1 had stat progression as well. Thanks for the feedback.
    Did you play CoD:MW (2019) or see how they designed that game? Essentially, the whole game was centered around the new gunsmith. There were no classes in the main game and weapons were each leveled up by using them. New accessories would become available at certain levels. The interesting thing about it was that it encouraged players to try new weapons and create their own variants based on their own playstyle, etc. ....no classes, special abilities, etc. aside from the "perks" you chose which is basically a CoD thing. I still didn;t like certain aspects of the game but thought the move to center the focus on the gunsmith was refreshing.

    Personally, I don't really care for the idea of unlocking special abilities or "skills" in a game like this. I think it can be handled in a different way with equipment and so on. These guys are already the best at what they do and experts in these things. I get the need for mechanics like these but I just think there are better ways to go about it. In regard to the focus on a gunsmith, this is an opportunity to help bring something to the community they've wanted (a better, more in-depth gunsmith) but also help with Ubi's struggle to get players more interested in trying out other weapons without tricking or forcing them to. ....which is one of the reasons they said they introduced their weapon tier idea.


    Originally Posted by jmagnum50 Go to original post
    I don't know kean. I know that this was originally about armor, but with R6 Vegas 2 weight was just applied to armor. However, I know you're trying to make players think before they act, but forcing the players' gear to make them too slow would just make them an easy target. Easily get them killed. Start taking out gear, it reduces their tactical capabilities and they couldn't do much. It sounds like making it more of a survival game than a tactical one.
    During Red Storm's time with the series, you didn't carry much, but they gave you a few slots to manage. With their games, you just selected a somewhat realistic, or a versatile loadout and survival elements weren't bothering you. Now managing stamina before you run again, I'm okay with. If you want, for getting shot in certain areas to bother the player, maybe have a different game mode or setting for more hardcore players. COD infinite warfare had something like this in their specialist mode. Just my thought, but thanks for the input.
    I believe part of the problem is that you're thinking in extremes. Weight doesn't need to slow down a player to a crawl but it can affect your mobility to a point that it gives pause to loading up on everything including the kitchen sink every time. This idea that someone can carry all this stuff is ridiculous in itself in my opinion but it also makes the gameplay less fun and interesting. There needs to be gameplay balance with pros and cons.


    Things like a weight system, damage model, team AI commands, etc. don't have to feel like a burden or overwhelming to players. .....or a system that feels like it's necessarily penalizing you. In fact I'd argue such mechanics would enhance the gameplay and add depth that (quite frankly) has been missing as of late. .....instead of relying on things like RPG mechanics, tiered loot ,etc.
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  2. #12
    All up for you having to think about what your wear and equipment you take fo sure. I hate my Mary Poppins bag, even moreso when I don't have a backpack equipped AND that I can search my belongings at the speed of The Flash in that it effectively pauses time! Haha.

    Let me decide on backpack to take which in turn affects amount of equipment I can carry with me AND that load affects weight which affects my ghost! Also allow said backpack to be dropped should the need arise and in doing so you move quicker but of course have limited equipment on you (e.g. vest items) but can go and pick it back up.
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  3. #13
    About weight and gear, yeah, I just don't want the risks to far outweigh the rewards. I just didn't want the next to be so frustrating to enjoy, personally. Which, in terms of weapons and items, I suggested using gear loadouts in the games before Wildlands. Now, if you'd prefer, some weapons (not ammo capacity) could weigh a bit heavier than others, so perhaps for balancing issues, get a secondary that's lighter and travel with that, until things get heavy. A good example would be to travel with your pistol for better mobility (not BP-wise) until you need your assault rifle. It's not really like WL or BP, but something a bit more manageable. Didn't mean to be argumentive. Hopefully, what you mentioned could work for a wide player base. If what I mentioned seemed like copying or repeating, didn't mean to. Just trying to come up with ideas.
    Yes I have played MW 2019, though I don't play with other people. I just play campaign, and bot mode, just to play with guns. Personally, this game did update guns better than Cold War.
    About machines, that tactic was in the franchise before BP and WL. In FS, BTRs and Hinds would require GL rounds to destroy or just shoot them 'til they're done (Tanks need airstrikes, though). Pretty much goes for APCs, and/or choppers in GRAW 2 and Predator. For heavies, I just thought about a tactic in the first two Army of Two games, one draws attention and the other flanks. Thought it be better than just riflemen with bigger mags, personally.
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  4. #14
    If they make it so that you are limited in what you can carry at any given time, based on backpack you are using, I would like the ability to stash the pack, before entering a compound. That way, you can carry more gear with you into the field, while still being able to reduce and specialize your load out depending on your current objective.. For example, I would always carry come C4 in my backpack, but If my current objective is only grab some intel off a computer, I 'm not going to need demolitions. So I could leave the backback, with the C4 and other non essential gear somewhere close to the compound, and only carry enough equipment to complete the mission, and fight my way out if required.
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  5. #15
    Virtual-Chris's Avatar Senior Member
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    Originally Posted by Megalodon26 Go to original post
    If they make it so that you are limited in what you can carry at any given time, based on backpack you are using, I would like the ability to stash the pack, before entering a compound. That way, you can carry more gear with you into the field, while still being able to reduce and specialize your load out depending on your current objective.. For example, I would always carry come C4 in my backpack, but If my current objective is only grab some intel off a computer, I 'm not going to need demolitions. So I could leave the backback, with the C4 and other non essential gear somewhere close to the compound, and only carry enough equipment to complete the mission, and fight my way out if required.
    Exactly. I long wished for my vehicle to act as a locker and ammo box. All my gear and guns were in my vehicle… so I could change load outs and resupply consumables (within reason) at my vehicle. Combine that with your idea of a smaller version based on your pack that you could ditch would offer the ultimate in flexibility and realism.

    You could effectively have four levels of gear storage, ammo and consumables from more to less…
    - Base of operations
    - Vehicle
    - Pack
    - Person (chest rig/belt)

    You can have a full selection of consumables in your vehicle, a couple in your pack, and one on your person.
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  6. #16
    I think a simpler version to al this would be the slots system. I can imagine Ubisoft going with that as it’s nice and simple. Each clothing item (vest, belt, backpack) has a certain number of slots and items take up a a slot.

    Although if you can only carry a realistic amount of ammo we need to remove the thousand enemies that are bullet sponges and pre programmed helo or enemy reinforcements.
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  7. #17
    Originally Posted by rugby_dog Go to original post
    I think a simpler version to al this would be the slots system. I can imagine Ubisoft going with that as it’s nice and simple. Each clothing item (vest, belt, backpack) has a certain number of slots and items take up a a slot.

    Although if you can only carry a realistic amount of ammo we need to remove the thousand enemies that are bullet sponges and pre programmed helo or enemy reinforcements.
    Well, if they adopted something along the lines of what I and Chris were saying, you could limit it based on how many magazines you can fit on your vest and belt, plus a full mag in your weapon.You could also carry a few extra magazines in the backpack. And then you could be able to refill them all at your vehicle, since it would make sense for them to carry a few ammo boxes onboard.
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  8. #18
    Originally Posted by rugby_dog Go to original post
    I think a simpler version to al this would be the slots system. I can imagine Ubisoft going with that as it’s nice and simple. Each clothing item (vest, belt, backpack) has a certain number of slots and items take up a a slot.

    Although if you can only carry a realistic amount of ammo we need to remove the thousand enemies that are bullet sponges and pre programmed helo or enemy reinforcements.
    Yeah I like what Escape from Tarkov provides in that respect. Haven't been able to play the game mind to see how it actually plays with that as I don't game on PC unfortunately, but looks like a great game.
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  9. #19
    Agree we need realistic load outs

    First we need game that supports realistic ammo carried

    Ubi
    One more time
    Lose the bullet sponge bs

    Raid boss should NOT soak up 500 rnds

    Then again why am I fighting a tank with a M16?

    Ubi still don’t get it
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  10. #20
    Armor should be modeled so that if you hit the actual armor piece on the character, you deal reduced damage. If you shoot not the armor, you get full damage, give the armor a health bar of its own, and once its depleted, it no longer offers any protection at all.

    So, if you go up to a guy and unload into his chest, your going to be hitting his vest, dealing reduced damage, until his vest is depleted. Where if you went up and shot their leg, or some exposed portion of the body, you deal more damage.

    It should be a give and trade type system.

    The less armor you wear, the faster you move, the sneakier you are, the quicker you reload, things like that. However, you get hit just a couple of times, your toast.

    However, if you decide to clad yourself in North Hollywood shootout armor and go into battle lookin like a modern day Knight in full plate, then you will have very noticeable protection

    From there, you can mix and match how much protection you feel you need on each given location. Soooo, yes, I would have an inventory system not unlike Everquest, where you have Arms, head, vest, legs, boots, where you can wear more or less armor in each location. If you wear full armor, you have very few exposed locations, meaning your likely to get damage reduction on every bullet. If you decide to wear like, a vest, helmet and leg armor, then your lower legs and arms would be exposed and more vulnerable.

    I would complete it with having different grades of the armor. You wanna get full protection, but only lighter armor, then you can, but the reduction wouldnt be as high.

    One could really mix and match for a perfect coverage for their own playstyle.
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