WTF!! hurricane blast REMOVAL | Forums

[Knight_Raime]

So I agree orochi_chan. Yes wind gust in the testing grounds is objectively better in every way. It is guaranteed, has good damage, and it stuns the opponent. The changes to wind gust are fantastic. The point the orochi_chan is making is valid tho. Hurricane blast is something that is part of orochi's identity, it is a crowd pleaser. Watch any deflect montage with orochi and people love watching the mechanics of hurricane blast. The ability to start hurricane blast, and then cancel it into a dodge or wind gust or a guard break is very satisfying. I think wind gust in the testing grounds is great but hurricane blast is a move that does not harm the community, does not increase his viability, and is a move that every orochi player loves. I see this move remaining in orochi's kit as an absolute bonus. Its not meant to be viable, its just something that makes orochi players happy. Orochis in my opinion are not complaining about the loss of a strategically helpful move, they just wanna keep doing that cool move. Orochi has been one of the flashiest and stylish heroes since the launch of this game. This move has a lot to do with that fame and satisfaction. Let me give an example. Imagine if BP lost his bulwark counter and it was replaced with an animation that does not flip but has the same hitbox and damage as the counter. People would be unhappy. There is an amount of satisfaction with the way the move already is. As far as functionality goes sure its just as good, but it loses something. Imagine if cents full charge punch stunned someone for the same amount of time but did not knock them on their back. Sure its just as good but its not the same. Moves that feel good and are not harmful for the games health should stay in the game. I have more examples but I believe this makes my point clear.

While I understand the gist of the point you're making I don't believe either examples you gave are good comparisons. Because both flip and punch mechanically hold their kits together. Hurricane blast did not. Now if Hurricane blast had the ability to interrupt armor (say like toe stab,) and they didn't keep that property when they axed the move your comparison would be more accurate. But all hurricane blast did was exist as extra steps for a mix up.

Wind gust on TG forces a mix up of it's own because it retains the forced hitstun animation. Meaning instead of Orochi going for hurricane blast and having to react to his opponent to maybe get something out of it he now always gets something out of it and forces the opponent to react to him instead. Orochi was one of my most played characters next to Cent and warden in the early days. And I have two friends who are dedicated Orochi mains. None of us are sad about it's loss and really enjoy the way Orochi is now.

It's fine and good if you want to say "it's not meant to be viable" however the devs do not enjoy having dead moves. Nor do they like having aspects to a kit that might be confusing. The entire goal of the devs is to have easy to understand and simplified kits. This has historically meant characters when reworked lose some flavor of their kit and while that sucks and shouldn't have to happen the game's base mechanics force it to happen. Because of how the game plays at a mechanical level hero design that is truly unique and stands out on it's own has never flourished and never will.

I would go as far to argue that Orochi had zero identity before this rework and now he actually has one. As i've mentioned in another thread the "iconic" aspects around Orochi was his double tap/guard top stance, his back dodge input with riptide/SR, and his unique deflect. The devs leaned into the double tap nature by giving that combo guaranteed light in every situation but his kick. The top UB he got last rework is important because of how important top stance has generally been for orochi. They improved both back dodge tools with this rework, and they retained the uniqueness of his deflect by keeping the same stun animation. And that's all topped off with given mobility through the flow buffs he got.

I won't argue that hurricane blast wasn't iconic. I'm arguing that the important aspect about it has been retained.

[Dha_Beast]

One thing I would like to add to my previous post is that there is some viability the hurricane blast provides which wind gust will not. Lets say you deflect someone near a ledge or when they are out of stamina. Maybe it is more beneficial to the orochi to feint hurricane blast into a gb and then ledge the opponent, or if they are out of stamina the orochi could put them on the ground and continue pressure, maybe use side heavies to hit other nearby targets. There is a small amount of viability that hurricane blast has even though it may be in very specific situations. So it is not just 100% of the time better than the reworked wind gust.

[deathtocakl]

Or you can remove convoluted, heavily situational, never used moves from the game.

[Csodaszarvas_G]

Just a thought, but it's "interesting" to see that Orochi now has so many guaranteed double attacks and 500 ms lights from every direction yet Warden is still rocking his 600ms side light finishers. This a bit weird especially after the devs sped up Raiders top light attacks and they said in the warriors den that having those attacks slower "did not make any sense" .

[Knight_Raime]

Just a thought, but it's "interesting" to see that Orochi now has so many guaranteed double attacks and 500 ms lights from every direction yet Warden is still rocking his 600ms side light finishers. This a bit weird especially after the devs sped up Raiders top light attacks and they said in the warriors den that having those attacks slower "did not make any sense" .

Probably thanks to some new tech. The extra light input wise feels very different compared to both Wardens double lights and shinobi double lights.

[Dha_Beast]

You could remove remove convoluted, heavily situational, highly used moves from the game, but it is loved by nearly every orochi player. So why remove it? It is already in the game and is already liked by every player that plays orochi. There is no logical reason to remove the move as it is not an over powered move and its simply a move that makes people using it happy. It offers little to no extra benefit. Moves that make people happy and are not toxic, op, annoying or any of those things should remain in the game just to be satisfying. How would you feel if every execution was replaced with a idle animation of the same amount of time and same hp amount. It would never be the same. Satisfaction for people is important and this move comes with literally no cons to the balance of the game. Nobody has given any valid reason for this move to be removed, it is not broken, we are not asking for a brand new move to be created. The only argument people are giving is that the move is worthless compared to the new wind gust. If that is the case just do not use hurricane blast. Let people that want it have it and people that see no point of it can just always use wind gust. There is no downside to that stand point

[Dha_Beast]

Knight_rame I see the point you are making. I think that arguing the identity of Orochi is a difficult topic as it is more opinion than facts. I will agree with you that removing the move makes his moveset simpler and the devs want simple movesets with no dead moves. But imagine if they removed all cosmetic items all together. There is an amount of style, personality, and expression that hurricane blast provides and I think it is in no way harmful to the game and is only a benefit to the Orochi players that want it. I understand that the devs do not want dead moves, but this move is a move that is satisfying to hit and this allows for players to show off a little bit. To be clear I am specifically talking about how Orochi can deflect, start the hurricane blast animation, and choose to dodge again, swap to wind gust, swap to a gb, or let the hurricane blast go. Having those options feels really good as getting like 4 deflects on raider and starting the hurricane blast animation feels amazing. It is not bad in any way and is just satisfying. I get it the move is useless, the move may not be used a lot, the devs do not want dead moves. But not a single one of these reasons is a factual statement that should make the move disappear. The move may not be used by a lot of Orochis, But I know Orochi players that like to go for that specific move in nearly every fight. I also know that what the devs want is also for the game to be fun and satisfying for their player base. Adding 1 move onto the hero in addition to the rest of the testing grounds moveset is like icing on the cake.

short answer:
If it feels good and is not toxic, op or annoying why not just leave it alone?

[Knight_Raime]

To be clear I don't care if it stays or goes. I get why people like it. I can only explain why the devs are doing what they're doing.

Personally I like how wind gust is on TG and would rather not lose that in favor of keeping his old deflect. But if that's what they choose to do I wouldn't stop playing orochi either. He's far too fun now.

[Dha_Beast]

I see the point you are making Knight_Raime. I understand why the devs are choosing to rework Orochi the way they have. I just want to create enough noise about it so that they may leave my favorite move in the game alone lol.

[MrBdur]

You could remove remove convoluted, heavily situational, highly used moves from the game, but it is loved by nearly every orochi player. So why remove it? It is already in the game and is already liked by every player that plays orochi. There is no logical reason to remove the move as it is not an over powered move and its simply a move that makes people using it happy. It offers little to no extra benefit. Moves that make people happy and are not toxic, op, annoying or any of those things should remain in the game just to be satisfying. How would you feel if every execution was replaced with a idle animation of the same amount of time and same hp amount. It would never be the same. Satisfaction for people is important and this move comes with literally no cons to the balance of the game. Nobody has given any valid reason for this move to be removed, it is not broken, we are not asking for a brand new move to be created. The only argument people are giving is that the move is worthless compared to the new wind gust. If that is the case just do not use hurricane blast. Let people that want it have it and people that see no point of it can just always use wind gust. There is no downside to that stand point

I was an Orochi main in my early days. Got 34 reps on him now.

I never cared for the it. Lol