Small tweaks to Peacekeeper and Black Prior | Forums

[Goat_of_Vermund]

I know that the former got a hug update this year, but she needs to be looked at, she is lacking in some places. The latter mainly needs some slight nerfs to be more fair, but after maining him for 46 reps, I found some small places where he could actually use buffs too.


Peacekeeper:

Buffs: The dodge attacks should count as a chain starter, and their recovery should be cut down to 500ms for both block and guardbreak. (It is very unfair that an other hero gets a free guardbreak for dodging it, it already has guardbreak vulnerability at the startup). Also, I think she needs to have 140-150 stamina to play more aggressively. She doesn't have bad stamina management, but you can not use up more than 80 without worrying to run out from being hit by certain moves, and she already has reflexguard and bad hp. Last but not least, let her cancel her own guardbreak throw recoveries by a dodge at 400ms (or at the point where her foot touches the ground again). It is very weird how she recovers so slow from her own throws, this should help with wall punishes.

Nerfs: Guardbreak stab needs a damage nerf. It deals 38 know, which is stupid. She also gets 27 damage from a side heavy+deep gouge. I think the stabs should deal an overall 30, with the first dealing 1+6, the second dealing 1+6, and third dealing 2+14. This could still guarantee more damage on the longrun and place that bleed debuff on the opponent for a longer time for your mixups, but it would be a more fair number, and not always the best possible answer.

Feats: Remove Last Laugh, change it to Nailbomb. It is a better feat, gives a huge advantage over someone running into it, helps with defending zone. Last Laugh also irritates some people, so it should also satisfy them I guess.

P.S.: And for God's sake, remove the bleed cleanse from healing feats!



Black Prior:

Nerfs: Create a special Back+Light move for Prior, like Nobushi, and name it. It doesn't have to get a new animation or any new properties, it can work the same way. However, by doing so, you would remove the superior block properties from the backwalk light, which would make it less oppressive. You could still space with it, but it wouldn't be an almighty counter tool. Also, add 100-200ms for the block recovery after any of the missed bashes. That way, a dodge attack would always connect on a missed bash, which is fair, considering how good the mixups related to them are.

Buffs: Small qol things, and I think only relevant for some very niche time fight/antigank situations. First, I think Black Prior should be able to feint a succesful Bulwark Counter (the attack after the flip). Sometimes you realize you will hit the wall with it and it would be better to not follow through with it, sometimes you realize that its recovery would put you in a very bad position (like a Shaman jumping you), so you want to feint it. I also thing that the running attack and the forward dodge heavy should fastflow into Bulwark Stance- these are already the worst moves in BP's kit.

[MastlyCJ]

I know that the former got a hug update this year, but she needs to be looked at, she is lacking in some places. The latter mainly needs some slight nerfs to be more fair, but after maining him for 46 reps, I found some small places where he could actually use buffs too.


Peacekeeper:

Buffs: The dodge attacks should count as a chain starter, and their recovery should be cut down to 500ms for both block and guardbreak. (It is very unfair that an other hero gets a free guardbreak for dodging it, it already has guardbreak vulnerability at the startup). Also, I think she needs to have 140-150 stamina to play more aggressively. She doesn't have bad stamina management, but you can not use up more than 80 without worrying to run out from being hit by certain moves, and she already has reflexguard and bad hp. Last but not least, let her cancel her own guardbreak throw recoveries by a dodge at 400ms (or at the point where her foot touches the ground again). It is very weird how she recovers so slow from her own throws, this should help with wall punishes.

Nerfs: Guardbreak stab needs a damage nerf. It deals 38 know, which is stupid. She also gets 27 damage from a side heavy+deep gouge. I think the stabs should deal an overall 30, with the first dealing 1+6, the second dealing 1+6, and third dealing 2+14. This could still guarantee more damage on the longrun and place that bleed debuff on the opponent for a longer time for your mixups, but it would be a more fair number, and not always the best possible answer.

Feats: Remove Last Laugh, change it to Nailbomb. It is a better feat, gives a huge advantage over someone running into it, helps with defending zone. Last Laugh also irritates some people, so it should also satisfy them I guess.

P.S.: And for God's sake, remove the bleed cleanse from healing feats!



Black Prior:

Nerfs: Create a special Back+Light move for Prior, like Nobushi, and name it. It doesn't have to get a new animation or any new properties, it can work the same way. However, by doing so, you would remove the superior block properties from the backwalk light, which would make it less oppressive. You could still space with it, but it wouldn't be an almighty counter tool. Also, add 100-200ms for the block recovery after any of the missed bashes. That way, a dodge attack would always connect on a missed bash, which is fair, considering how good the mixups related to them are.

Buffs: Small qol things, and I think only relevant for some very niche time fight/antigank situations. First, I think Black Prior should be able to feint a succesful Bulwark Counter (the attack after the flip). Sometimes you realize you will hit the wall with it and it would be better to not follow through with it, sometimes you realize that its recovery would put you in a very bad position (like a Shaman jumping you), so you want to feint it. I also thing that the running attack and the forward dodge heavy should fastflow into Bulwark Stance- these are already the worst moves in BP's kit.

I respect this but do you think they should buff her physical damage and nerf her bleed. Liker her dodge attacks need more damage 7 is so low for dodge attack and it's a heavy. I think it should go like this:



All heavy dodge attacks should do 18dam with 6bleed. Boom 24 damage

Also her delfect damage should go way up to 20bleed. I mean 12bleed in my opinion is low and I know she attacking with her dagger but come on. Literally all assassins do way more deflect damage then her and shinobi delfect combined.

Don't let someone opinion about last laugh come mind literally there is so much things that are wrong in this game I dislike people who complain about something that can be countered literally just execute them. Even if you want to change the feat it not like it comes due to weak renown Gain for assassins.

PS, can you give out a opinion to my forum
PK Rework I need opinions.

[Goat_of_Vermund]

I respect this but do you think they should buff her physical damage and nerf her bleed. Liker her dodge attacks need more damage 7 is so low for dodge attack and it's a heavy. I think it should go like this:



All heavy dodge attacks should do 18dam with 6bleed. Boom 24 damage

Also her delfect damage should go way up to 20bleed. I mean 12bleed in my opinion is low and I know she attacking with her dagger but come on. Literally all assassins do way more deflect damage then her and shinobi delfect combined.

Don't let someone opinion about last laugh come mind literally there is so much things that are wrong in this game I dislike people who complain about something that can be countered literally just execute them. Even if you want to change the feat it not like it comes due to weak renown Gain for assassins.

PS, can you give out a opinion to my forum
PK Rework I need opinions.

No disrespect, but 24 damage on a dodge attack is stupidly broken. PK deals 18 now, which is already the highest number for any dodge attacks in that category. It used to be a very high number before CCU, which made certain mixups far more risky and unfair. 18 damage+frame advantage with a bleed for 5 seconds is a very generous reward. Compare it to, let's say, Orochi, who deals 16 damage. Even fking Gryphon deals only 16.

The deflect part is untrue. She does the same damage, which can be followed up by two enchanced light attacks and an unblockable heavy. The only deflects dealing more damage are the unfair ones (Gladiator and Berserker). Again, Orochi deals the same damage (with the light), Shaolin deals less damage, Shaman deals lower damage and doesn't even chain (though gives FA). Her deflect is fine as it is. I am unfamiliar with Shinobi numbers, but for what I recall, it is not low damage at all. Pk's deflect is perfect.


Last Laugh is something that crosses with Peacekeeper's game goal, which is letting killstreaks running. It is frustrating to fight, if your opponent knows what he/she is doing, and focuses on not being executed, you will never get an execution with most characters no matter what you do. Also, it is mainly a chance feat: you either get a win with it, or you will never get anything with it. Nailbomb would be a far better one.

[DeeFautBoi34]

No disrespect, but 24 damage on a dodge attack is stupidly broken. PK deals 18 now, which is already the highest number for any dodge attacks in that category. It used to be a very high number before CCU, which made certain mixups far more risky and unfair. 18 damage+frame advantage with a bleed for 5 seconds is a very generous reward. Compare it to, let's say, Orochi, who deals 16 damage. Even fking Gryphon deals only 16.

The deflect part is untrue. She does the same damage, which can be followed up by two enchanced light attacks and an unblockable heavy. The only deflects dealing more damage are the unfair ones (Gladiator and Berserker). Again, Orochi deals the same damage (with the light), Shaolin deals less damage, Shaman deals lower damage and doesn't even chain (though gives FA). Her deflect is fine as it is. I am unfamiliar with Shinobi numbers, but for what I recall, it is not low damage at all. Pk's deflect is perfect.


Last Laugh is something that crosses with Peacekeeper's game goal, which is letting killstreaks running. It is frustrating to fight, if your opponent knows what he/she is doing, and focuses on not being executed, you will never get an execution with most characters no matter what you do. Also, it is mainly a chance feat: you either get a win with it, or you will never get anything with it. Nailbomb would be a far better one.

Pk dodge attack does 10dam not 18dam your talking about her heavys and PK dodge attack should be more like 15dam 6bleed.

[Goat_of_Vermund]

Pk dodge attack does 10dam not 18dam your talking about her heavys and PK dodge attack should be more like 15dam 6bleed.

Just the Deep Gouge in itself deals 11 damage, and it is guaranteed after every heavy, including dodge attacks. 7+11 is 18. There is literally no reason to not followup a succesful dodge attack with the light (excluding maybe if you are very close to run OOS, but in that case, you should not dodge attack in the first place).

As long as it comes to damage only, Pk is a top tier dodge attacker. The problem is not the damage, it is how open she makes herself by using it.

[King_of_Xibalba]

her dodge heavy is so clunky and with a bad recovery...

I can accept 19 damage on her dodge cause the others can have 16 but they are instant...3 more for the waiting I can find acceptable.
but yeah her dodge attack is a problem, cent can return to his guard even if I do the correct read to his light in the best timing possible, Idk if only against her but I thought this was corrected.
It feels clunky and slow even if the time is the same as others, her recovery is absurd and unfair.

also if others can chain from dodge attacks, why an assassin that is agile can´t?

she is still limited after the rework, it´s a shame we could wait for this rework so maybe she would be totally corrected.

stamina is a must, not because she is totally bad, but because without an opener (no a 400 light is not an opener) she must rely on a lot of feints and cancels, she cant make pressure to hardcore turtles, and well without bashes is a always a match in where to open them you need to loss 80-90 percent of your stamina. It really is counterintuitive.

they can add 20-30 stam or make her feint/cancels cost a little less. 4vs 4 is still a pain in the ***.

[DeeFautBoi34]

Just the Deep Gouge in itself deals 11 damage, and it is guaranteed after every heavy, including dodge attacks. 7+11 is 18. There is literally no reason to not followup a succesful dodge attack with the light (excluding maybe if you are very close to run OOS, but in that case, you should not dodge attack in the first place).

As long as it comes to damage only, Pk is a top tier dodge attacker. The problem is not the damage, it is how open she makes herself by using it.

Ok PK dodge attack should do more damage because it is kinda weak and on top of that it is very poor. Her hitbox is terrible on her dodge attack and she can get punish very easily because it has very poor recovery time. It's like almost shoguki missing his demon embrace except that is longer. Overall PK does not have the best dodge attack. It's slow predictable, no range, barely damage, and very Punishable.

[Goat_of_Vermund]

Ok PK dodge attack should do more damage because it is kinda weak and on top of that it is very poor. Her hitbox is terrible on her dodge attack and she can get punish very easily because it has very poor recovery time. It's like almost shoguki missing his demon embrace except that is longer. Overall PK does not have the best dodge attack. It's slow predictable, no range, barely damage, and very Punishable.

I suppose you did not read what I wrote.

[DeeFautBoi34]

I suppose you did not read what I wrote.

Guess not please explain in better details because your just saying that the problem she has is when it misses the dodge attack. Even so it still needs better physical damage then bleed. What I'm saying is rework the dodge attack and give up more physical damage then bleed. Also make the hitbox bigger.

Also doing a heavy finisher after any dodge attack sounds amazing in my opinion. But her stamina needs improvement since she can barely give out options when attacking her opponents.

[Goat_of_Vermund]

Guess not please explain in better details because your just saying that the problem she has is when it misses the dodge attack. Even so it still needs better physical damage then bleed. What I'm saying is rework the dodge attack and give up more physical damage then bleed. Also make the hitbox bigger.

Also doing a heavy finisher after any dodge attack sounds amazing in my opinion. But her stamina needs improvement since she can barely give out options when attacking her opponents.

I would buff her stamina, too. To 140 from 120 or so.

Pk's succesful dodge attack+deep gouge grants FA, plus a bleed debuff, with an overavarage damage. If you look into only that, it is one of the best dodge attacks. On top of all, it is a heavy parry. The damage is absolutely fine.
However, it has extreme weaknesses too:

- Don't beat an early gb (fair enough in exchange for the above)
- Bad range and hitbox (I understand she is a duelist with a short weapon, but not too fair. Still, acceptable).
- Brutal miss recovery, or even block/hit recovery. She is unable to cgb for like 700ms (easy gb on miss), or even block (a failed parry attempt usually hits her).
- Can not chain-very bad mobility in 4v4