Hello warriors!
We’re back with another Testing Grounds! We’ll be opening it up from April 1st to April 8th.
This time around we’re testing changes to seven heroes. They are:
- Shugoki
- Aramusha
- Berserker
- Jiang Jun
- Hitokiri
- Zhanhu
- Gladiator
Shugoki’s changes revolve around making him less frustrating to play against, while giving him ganking tools and better 1v1 pressure.
For Aramusha, we’re looking to improve the viability of Blade Blockade, as well as giving the hero an opener and ways to deal with bashes.
Berserker gets mostly quality of life changes; Dodge Attacks in general are made more effective.
Jiang Jun has changes to his Stamina consumption as well as his Guardbreak punishes and his Heavy Finishers to make him stronger in 1v1.
Hitokiri has changes to improve flowing into chains and ways to deal with bashes.
Zhanhu’s changes revolve around having better neutral pressure, getting more chances to Dodge Cancel recoveries as well as improving the Side Dodge attacks.
Finally, Gladiator gains improved chaining ability and improvements to his Dodge Attacks.
We’ll be going through an overview of the changes per hero. For a more in-depth view of these changes, we’re encouraging you once again to watch the Warrior’s Den.
Shugoki
Demon’s Embrace
- Now performed from neutral with a Back + Guardbreak input
- Total attack duration reduced to 900ms
- Now heals for 20 damage and deals 10 damage
- Now fully restores Stamina to Shugoki’s opponent
- No longer has Armor
Developer’s comment:
These changes are aimed at making Demon’s Embrace the ganking move it should be; its position in chains as a soft feint prevents it from being a thorough ganking move.
Charge of the Oni
- Now accessible from hitting the Sprint button while Sprinting only
- While Charge of the Oni is active, Shugoki gains increased movement speed and his stamina is slowly depleted.
- Removed Armored and Unblockable properties from the move
Developer’s comment:
Shugoki has a difficult time performing his rotations – going from the lane to a side point or from side point to side point; with this, Shugoki gains an ability similar to what Shinobi possesses and is able to move around the battlefield more swiftly.
Dodge Attacks
- New Option: Side Dodge Headbutt
- New Option: Front Dodge Headbutt
- New Option: Forward Dodge Heavy
Developer’s comment:
These new dodge attacks should provide Shugoki with enough options to properly counter opponent bashes as well as opponents who tend to roll away too much. It also gives Shugoki a neutral opener, which should help him flow better into his offense.
Headbutt
- Now deals 10 damage
- No longer stuns, deals Stamina damage and pause stamina regeneration
- 500ms from Front Dodge and in chains, 533ms on Side Dodges
Developer’s comment:
Shugoki’s Headbutt is now used in many more situations, and as such it needs to be more of a threat than previously.
Light Attacks
- No longer Armored
Developer’s comment:
This helps prevent frustration while fighting against Shugoki, who could hit Light on reaction to anything his opponents threw.
Aramusha
Blade Blockade and followups
- Can now cancel the recovery of any attack to Blade Blockade on Hit, Miss and non-interrupted Block
- All Blade Blockade followups are now guaranteed
- Heavy Followup is now a side Unblockable attack with Zone Attack properties
- Light Followup is now a top Unblockable attack
- Push Back Kick Followup is unchanged
- Removed Ring the Bell from Blade Blockade followups
Developer’s comment:
These changes should improve Blade Blockade to where you use the appropriate followup depending on the situation and make Blade Blockade much easier to access.
Dodge Attacks
- Rushing Wind attack can no longer select which side to attack (always top) o Armor now starts at 400ms (up from 100ms)
- New Option: Side Dodge Heavy o 600ms attack
- o Initiates chains
Developer’s comment:
Aramusha should now be able to deal with opponent bashes and initiate his offense better.
Ring the Bell Soft Feints
- Heavy Openers now soft feint to Ring the Bell
- Dodge Forward Heavy now soft feints to Ring the Bell
Developer’s comment:
Aramusha now gains a tool to both open up opponents as well as set up ganks.
Attack Chains
- Aramusha now chains to Finishers when a second attack is performed without switching stances.
Developer’s comment:
This removes the need for Aramusha to do Side -> Top -> Side to continue his infinite chain. This should alleviate some of the predictability and give new options in group fights.
Berserker
Top Light Opener
- Now 500ms (down from 600ms) and deals 12 damage (down from 13)
- After Feint version is now 400ms (down from 500ms) and deals 11 damage (down from 12)
Developer’s comment:
These changes normalize all of Berserker’s neutral light attacks, giving them all the same utility.
Dodge Attacks
- Head Slider attack is now Enhanced and moves forward further
- Spin Chop attacks are now Enhanced
- Head Crusher now moves forward further
Developer’s comment:
Berserker should now be able to use his dodge attacks to both chase and enable his offense more reliably.
Sprint Attack
- Boar Rush now has extra forward movement
Developer’s comment:
- Berserker should now be able to catch up to opponents fleeing fights more easily.
Jiang Jun
Heavy Openers
- Top Heavy Opener is now 800ms (down from 900ms) and deals 24 damage (down from 27)
- Side Heavy Openers are now 900ms (down from 1000ms) and deal 27 damage (down from 32)
Developer’s comment:
- Jiang Jun can now use his Top Heavy opener as a Guardbreak punish and his Side Heavy openers as Light parry punishes for extra damage.
Heavy Finishers
- Heavy Finishers can now be soft feinted to Guardbreak
Developer’s comment:
This lets Jiang Jun catch opponents who could roll away from his Heavy Finishers.
Sifu’s Swirl
- Now Unblockable
Developer’s comment:
This lets Jiang Jun be more effective in group fights by throwing multiple target swapped unblockable attacks and be threatening against external opponents.
Stamina Costs
- All of Jiang Jun’s Heavy attacks now cost 12 stamina
Developer’s comment:
Jiang Jun’s stamina penalty on his Side Heavy Attacks is no longer relevant with the Core Combat Update; they retain their properties but now cost the standard amount of stamina for Heavy attacks.
Forward Dodge Attacks
- New Option: Dodge Forward Shin Kick o Performed by dogdging forward and hitting Guardbreak
- o 500ms bash that chains to Openers
- Mighty Sanction is now 600ms, no longer soft feints to Kick and is no longer feintable
Developer’s comment:
These changes are twofold: Jiang Jun now gets a more reliable opener with his Kick as well as better chase with his Dodge Forward Heavy.
Dou Shi’s Choke
- No longer guarantees damage to the parried opponent
Developer’s comment:
This makes Jiang Jun have to decide which option to perform after a parry; Dou Shi’s Choke is no longer the best option after every single Heavy Parry.
Hitokiri
Chain Flow changes
- Sprint Attack, Dodge Forward Heavy and Zone Attack now initiate chains
Developer’s comment:
This lets Hitokiri chains to his infinite chains more easily and applies more pressure overall.
Kick/Sweep
- Rei Kick has more range and can no longer be countered by perform backstep attacks
- Rei Sweep now guarantees a Chained Heavy attack
Developer’s comment:
- These changes make Hitokiri’s Rei Kick/Sweep mixup more potent and pushes towards the infinite chain in a more consistent manner.
Endless Myriad Attacks
- Now gains Armor when the Heavy Attack button is released
- Now has flatter and larger attack trajectories
- Now moves forward more during the attack
Developer’s comment:
Hitokiri should now be able to use his Infinite Heavy Chain attacks more effectively in group fights.
Side Dodge Attack
- New Option: Side Dodge Heavy o 600ms
- o Hits on opposite side of Dodge
- o Initiates chains
Developer’s comment:
Hitokiri now has tools to handle bashes and can use it to initiate offense more effectively.
Zhanhu
Dodge Cancels
- All attacks now cancel their recoveries into Dodges at 333ms in their recoveries on Hit/Miss/Non-interrupted Block
Developer’s comment:
Zhanhu now can dodge cancel all of their recoveries, including Finisher recoveries, to stay on the move and apply pressure to opponents.
Dodge Attacks
- Violent and Brisk Maneuvers are now Enhanced and count as Heavy parries
- Stinging Maneuver is now 500ms and enhanced
- New option: Dodge Forward Subduing Counterblow
- o Performed by dodging forward and hitting Guardbreak
- o 500ms
- o Chains to Openers
Developer’s comment:
Zhanhu’s Dodge Attacks should now be safer to use, and Zhanhu can now also use his Palm attack to open up opponents.
Superior Block Dodge Followups
- Removed Palm option from Superior Block dodges
- When Superior Blocking while dodging, Light and Heavy attacks now become Unblockable.
- On Front Dodge Superior Block, Light attack is guaranteed
- On Side Dodge Superior Blocks, Light and Heavy attacks are guaranteed
- Front Superior Block Light now deals 22 damage
- Front Superior Block heavy attack now deals 30 damage
- Side Superior Block attacks now deal 22 damage
Developer’s comment:
Zhanhu no longer has Palm on Superior Block dodges but can now guarantee damage when they successfully block.
Other changes
- Zone Attack now hits at 500ms
- Right Heavy Finisher trajectory is now mirrored from Left Heavy Finisher trajectory
Developer’s comment:
These Quality of Life changes should help make Zhanhu be more in-line with other heroes.
Gladiator
Chain Flow changes
- Fusacina Ictus, Zone Attack and Sucker Punches now chain to Heavy Finishers and Skewer.
Developer’s comment:
Gladiator now has more ways to enter chains and initiate Skewer and other types of pressure.
Dodge Attacks
- Bee’s Sting attacks now have invulnerable frames in their startup
- Side Sucker Punches now have extra range and invulnerable frames in their startup.
- Crowd Pleaser now moves forward more
Developer’s comment:
These changes are aimed at making Gladiator more in-line with other heroes in terms of their dodge attacks, while also granting Gladiator more chase.
Fuscina Ictus
- Now deals 10 damage
- No longer prevents executions on bound opponents
Developer’s comment:
Fuscina Ictus now deals a more respectable amount of damage while improving its ganking ability.
Skewer
- Now costs 12 stamina
- No longer guarantees a Dodge Forward Light attack
Developer’s comment:
Skewer should now be much more usable as there are multiple ways to initiate the attack, and as such it is now more in-line with other attacks.
We look forward to seeing you testing out the changes! As usual, we’ll be sending a survey and we will also monitor social media for feedback, so do not hesitate to voice your opinion. If you missed it, Jean-Charles and Stefan, went over all these coming changes in our latest Warriors Den. Clickif you want to check that out.
aramusha is interesting, what I don´t like is the excess of dodge attacks, when asassins like PK have clunky dodge attacks, I think most changes are interesting but dodge attacks for heavies is in my opinion too much, Only zhanhu were in need of better dodge attacks, glad for example is an already good character im not sure if so many changes in flowing are needed for him,in comparison with these changes nobu and pk changes were not that great it seems.
heavies just have everything it appears, asassins are still and will be behind of them in every criteria, even dodge attacks and flowing.
headbutt with damage is too much actually, 2-5 damage would be acceptable but 10? is more than weapon dmage done with lights. I think that change is nuts.
Im pissed off, not because the changes are entirely bad, but because assassins will be even at more disadvantage with some excessive things and numbers you are putting on heavy clasess, if at least stamina and flowing WERE improved in them but NO. For this I consider ara and zhanhu assassins hybrids so in the case of ara a dodge side attack maybe is needed.
NO MORE DAMAGE, LESS HEALTH AND NO BETTER FLOWING NOR DODGE ATTACKS EXCLUSIVE. what else we pure assassins can NOT have? oh yeah static guard...and bashes(except glad an already powerful char but whatever...)
I will leave some feedback here- I guess these changes are universally liked, I might change my mind when I see them in action after paper, but I disagree with some things.
Shugoki: The only thing that is an improvement is the headbutt mixup, and I am really happy with the removal of HA from light. However, it is still just a lesser Warlord, the only working mixup will be light/heavy into either side heavy or headbutt, everything else is going to be easily optionselected. The hug is virtually useless in 1v1, and I don't know why anyone would try to feed revenge for that little lockdown with it. He is just a fatter and clumsier Warlord now. Still an improvement because it will be better to fight, but honestly, he will be a meme kill for any of the S tiers (especially the new S+ tier hero Gladiator).
Aramusha: Looks okay I guess. I am a bit concerned with Blade Blockade though, can he still do it when an attack hit him? Because in that case, it will break chained offense even more than Lawbringer used to.
Berserker: Don't know what made you think this hero needs a straight up buff, he is already one of the strongest duelists, and while these changes really won't affect that since everybody just parries those dodge lights in any serious skill level. The lights from at least those stupid (and now three directional) 400mis softfeint lights should have been removed. Heavy feint into light universally works for many characters without hyperarmor, Berserker has hyperarmor on his heavies, why the f does he need a hyperarmor on his 400ms lights? I know some consider him high skill ceiling, but he really isn't, you just keep your chains going against most opponents, and they won't be able to do ****, just try to predict what you will do next (I guess he struggles against some shield characters, but who cares, everyone else does, because it is a problem on the other end).
Jiang Jun: I am a bit biased here because I really hate this character (usually call him Giant Junk, I really hate how he fights, how he looks, and what he stands for). But can you please remove the 50 or so stamina drain from the ******g choke already? I don't care it does not guarantee damage, it is stupidly unfair. I also guess it will be extremely fun trying to approch him while he is sitting in Sifu, because the forward dodge will be reaction punished by that stupid Sifu heavy (though I don't think that is broken, he was too easy to hit out).
Hitokiri: I am glad you found a way to finally trigger those spoiled and entitled Warden mains a bit more. They would keep crying even if their zone was undodgable, their second lights would be enchanced and the zone would regain 20 stamina. But now with this new hero rework, it will completely boil their head, because it is a Warden, with a faaaaar better kit. Basically the same, but has hyperarmor on the light finisher, chain heavies, and gets a heavy attack from all three options. Plus he has a dodge attack. So, if anyone thought that the new Warden is a bit too strong, not to worry! That is covered. Unless I don't understand something, according to comp reddit and my own evaluation, this will be by far the best charged bash character in the game.
Zhanhu: Guess he is fine. Looks like an S tier, but not in the wrong way.
Gladiator: Wtf? Like Berserker, he was already one of the strongest duelists. Unlike Berserker, he did not receive some qol changes, he received so much fking buffs that we will cry back the Lawbringer meta.
Let's just look at how it will be to fight one:
- ~30 damage deflect. 40ish if there is any wall. Also, available from any situation.
- Safest zone optionselect got an update. It is already totally unpunishable for some heroes like Centurion, it totally had to chain into a ******g finisher or skewer on hit.
- One of the best bash select, the toestab, which is also by far the most oppressive out of stamina move, got a damage buff to be "more respectable". (Spoiler, if he needs respect, he won't have it this way. He would have it by putting on a shirt).
- Side dodge bash got an update- it was totally okay this way. Well, who cares, he will zone os everything anyway.
- By far the best ganking hero created with neutral Toe Stab being buffed and allowing executions, and the Skewer being the Skewer (with even more options to access him now).
So, if anybody is concerned because of Hitokiri or Berserker, don't be. There won't be any other heroes in comp duels but Gladiators. I guess it will make even Conqueror obsolete, and I would say it is stronger than the current Black Prior (who is probably the best character in the game rn).
I think we are in agree that, zhan hu, ara and shugo (I still dont like the damage amount of his new bash) are Ok.
glad, hito are excessive and zerk unneeded, (I can understand the normalization of his top light but still just trying to predict before was hard, now ughhhh ) he is one of the best chars already buffs are somewhat unnecesary AND HE IS MY THIRD MAIN so no bias against him.Homever zerk is not my immediate worry, I can adapt to him. I sense I wont to Glad.
I will try first Zhan hu and maybe a video for my yt channel with an analysis but I can already say hito dodge attack and glad super flow are too much.
Aramusha
There's this problem on Aramusha, with Ring the Bell: it's a broken selection option against any charging attack on neutral. So basically, Cent, Shugo and Hitokiri seem to be screwed in 1v1 by this ability.
Berserker
("Developer’s comment: These changes normalize all of Berserker’s neutral light attacks, giving them all the same utility.") Thank you, you have done well.
Buon lavoro con il Berserker, se ti aiuta ti lascio anche qui questo link da r/CompetitiveForHonor,:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Competitive..._opinion_also/
I disagree with what you wrote for the Berserker, removal of Hyperarmor from Light attacks.Originally Posted by Goat_of_Vermund Go to original post
HA it is essentials for him not to be a punching ball who get interrupted as soon as he try something.
The only ones complaining about this, are the childish people who want to nerf Berseker to get easy wins.
Untrue. The ones complaining are the ones who play lots of duels where Zerk is just too strong.Originally Posted by Wyrd9- Go to original post
He needs to get nerfs to his HA while getting more 4v4 tools.
Zerk doesn't need HA to avoid being interupted. If that were true, every hero would need HA to avoid getting interupted.
Taking HA off of lights may actually help land heavies. People will assume feinted heavies = light attempts and you could just HA heavy through when they try to interupt. It would create better mixup potential since they could be used as bait more easily.
In all honesty though, the way to fix Zerk while not actually changing his HA at all is to make hard feints end the chain. No more heavy opener feinted to heavy or light with HA. If you feint, your next attack does not get HA.
The feint to light is still fast enough to catch people and get back to HA but it also opens up the possibility to shut down his crazy 1v1 offensive pressure.
To say that Berserker is strong is untrue, as he's already not good at trading, consumes a lot of stamina, and his Berserker zone attack is easier to parry on a block. You have two different windows (second and third) to parry making it much easier to deal with. Not to mention it's a terrible start as it only turns on in lights and is useless in team fights as it leaves you vulnerable for seconds!Originally Posted by MrBdur Go to original post
Anyway, maybe I understand what you're trying to say, in essence:
Hyper Armour stays on its normal chains example: light (500ms, HA)> heavy (700ms, HA) > light (500ms, HA) > heavy (700ms, HA) > etc..
As you can see here there is HA in every attack, it would be madness to eliminate HA on the lights as I said before: HA is essential for him not to be a boxer who is interrupted as soon as he tries something.
But, if he makes a feint, Hyper Armour is no longer there on the light attack:
light (500ms, HA) > heavy feint, light (400ms) > heavy (700ms, HA) > etc..
That should do it.