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Assuming that you can't back light/heavy her chain mix up anymore I would still have to disagree because I don't think she has a good match up against Conq who's currently #1.Originally Posted by Goat_of_Vermund Go to original post
Hito is probably in a favorable match up against warmonger now. It's probably close to even with Warden. And I'm leaning on BP hito match up being in favor for BP if only slightly. As BP can still back light safely and I dont think her dodge attack can punish BP bash super well. But more time will tell on that.
In short I can see her replacing warmonger to be in the top with Warden Conq and BP. But I don't think she can take #1 from Conq. Glad could potentially depending on how well his skewer mix ups end up playing out since glad is even better defensively now and glad is one of the only heros that actually can be argued to have near favorable match ups against the S tier heros.
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Considering the full extent of Conqueror options for defense, it is very hard to tell how their battle would be. Both are broken against OOS opponents, but Gladiator has more stamina and stamina damage, and I am unsure if his zone bash is punishable for conqueror at all. It is for certain a hard read for bp, I think it is at least that for Conqueror. Meanwhile, glad can easily get in hits against conqueror bashes. Considering their punished, it is clear who has favorable odds. Even the current one is S tier easily.Originally Posted by Knight_Raime Go to original post
On paper, Hito looks stronger than WM, or even Warden. I think he might be an equal to BP now. About conqueror, I am unsure.
P.s.: I am a bit sad Pk was not held back until this TG. She might have a useful dodge attack now.
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Main reason why I put hito above WM is because of her chains. WM is already below Warden primarily because she doesn't have chains. The reason why I'm unsure about Warden is because Warden still has spacing as an option. Hitos heavies are pretty nasty for range but too predictable. Plus imo his chain bash is still better than hitos. I could see hito being better than Warden. But it's not night and day clear for me like it is hito vs WM.Originally Posted by Goat_of_Vermund Go to original post
And I feel you. It was part of the feedback I left about her. I guess enough people didn't complain about how bad her dodge attacks feel.
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Heavies should not have dodge attacks. Especially when their as good as Hito.Originally Posted by KoboldHonor Go to original post
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If you don't have a dodge attack, the character is thrash against anyone who has bashes. You need a punish against them, since they are the best offense in the game. Hitokiri absolutely needs this, the real question is, does she really need to get a heavy on all levels of her bash? Warden is a top 3 character for years without it, so I assume the answer is no.
The "Heavies this, while Assassins that" argument should be thrown out for good. These archetypes don't matter anymore, there is nothing similar in how Jiang Jun and Black Prior plays, and nothing similar between the playstyles of Gladiator and Peacekeeper either. There are similarities, but Hitokiri has more in common with Warden and Warmonger than with Jörmungandr, and I would say Peacekeeper is more similar to Raider than Berserker (not similar, just a bit more). Every hero should be looked at individually.
Right now, the only class differences that remain are the perk availability and renown gain, both are quite unfavourable for assassins, and both should be standardized. Well, you can say assassins run faster and have reflexguard (along with shaolin), that can be fixed with a bit longer reflexguard that can be refreshed manually.
Some assassins are weak. Gladiator and Berserker (especially after TG) are among the top 5 duelists easily, with Gladiator probably being a metapick for 4v4. Some are thrash, but that is an individual problem in their kit.
