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  1. #41
    Originally Posted by Sircowdog1 Go to original post
    So you're the expert here? And no one else could possibly know what they're talking about? Flawless logic, my dude.
    I am sure there are others here who work in a dev environment and understand the process, so it is not that I think no one else could possibly know what they are talking about, it's that I know you don't. Would you give the head nurse an equal seat in the brain surgeons' table to discuss how the brain surgery should proceed? Would you give the head of flight attendants an equal seat in the pilots' table to discuss how to fly the plane?
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  2. #42
    Originally Posted by tcarlisle2012 Go to original post
    I think my comments were misunderstood, and I'll take responsibility for that. To me, when I see "developers" referred to, I take that as meaning the entire development studio -- not just the contracted code bangers, junior crunchers, etc.who may not even really be gamers or have passion towards the title being developed/supported.

    I can't see one being in the role of product manager, producer, etc. who isn't an active gamer, passionate about gaming, and specifically passionate about THAT game. And yes, they should take time to experience the game as it is experienced by the customers. Not sandboxed, etc.

    This isn't a replacement for QA testers, or play testers, focus groups, etc. If the ones who manage the roadmap of this game and/or make decisions on balance, etc. don 't play it, then I'd say that is a recipe for mis-steering the product.
    That sounds like a nice sentiment, albeit misguided.
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  3. #43
    Sircowdog1's Avatar Senior Member
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    Originally Posted by III_Hammer_III Go to original post
    I am sure there are others here who work in a dev environment and understand the process, so it is not that I think no one else could possibly know what they are talking about, it's that I know you don't. Would you give the head nurse an equal seat in the brain surgeons' table to discuss how the brain surgery should proceed? Would you give the head of flight attendants an equal seat in the pilots' table to discuss how to fly the plane?
    That's a bad analogy. Especially considering there are nurse positions that actually do have veto power over surgeons in some situations. My best friend's GF is such a person, and has shut down entire operations based on the condition of tools.

    And flight attendants have much more authority than you seem to think, and are a vital part of the operation of the airplane.

    Look, you seem to have the wrong idea here. I'm not saying that QA should take over roles they're not qualified for, as your analogies seem to suggest. I'm saying that they need to be given the attention and recognition in the development process that their job entails. Every position on the team has a function, and it seems pretty god damned obvious that QA has been sacrificed in the gaming industry for a long time.

    So let me throw your own analogies back at you:

    Would you let a brain surgeon perform an operation with rusty tools and poor hygiene because he decided that it was fine?

    Would you let an airplane take off with all the doors unsealed, or with everyone constantly on their mobile devices disrupting the airplane's equipment, because the pilot said "screw it"?
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  4. #44
    In what is apparently going to be a surprise to you. Your priorities are not necessarily the same as the developers. Factor in budgets of time, resources, personell and cash, and the situation is in no way as simple as your comment would suggest.
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  5. #45
    Aced_100's Avatar Senior Member
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    Someone at UbiSoft must be playing the game and telling the Devs what they think and about any bugs they find, mustn't they?

    Or maybe the bean counters have sacked most of the Devs and play testers, as they just want to eek more cash out of it?
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  6. #46
    Sircowdog1's Avatar Senior Member
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    Originally Posted by Adam_Sanderson Go to original post
    In what is apparently going to be a surprise to you. Your priorities are not necessarily the same as the developers. Factor in budgets of time, resources, personell and cash, and the situation is in no way as simple as your comment would suggest.
    You should use the quote function so people know who you're actually talking to.
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  7. #47
    dagrommit's Avatar Senior Member
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    Originally Posted by Sircowdog1 Go to original post
    You should use the quote function so people know who you're actually talking to.
    He's right though. Different stakeholders will have different priorities, and managements are rarely the same as consumers. This is particularly true of any public corporation where hitting your quarterly revenue and profit forecast drives much decision making. And not just in the games industry.
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