Revert Shinobi back to release state | Forums

[MCBooma16]

Try to be more civil next time. The thread is about Shinobi and Goat talked about Shugoki. I just pointed it out to him because he often do not read posts carefully. But if you also think as him that Shinobi has superarmor, than you should visit FH wiki first. Just a little advice (without sarcasm).

Everyone else has been more than civil with you the first time around, but you're in no position to talk about anything in this game if you don't understand Goat's sarcasm. You're very stubborn and need to understand you aren't a very good player to pretty much everybody here. I won't be civil with you any more if you want to keep playing these antics. The first thing you do is complain and the last thing you do is try and prove you're somehow right amidst all of these experienced players after admitting you rage quit 9/10 matches against pretty much every viable and balanced mechanic.

So, yes. Stfu. That's about as civil as I'm going to be if you're going to continue to be stubborn and not take the effort to actually learn how to play at a better level than what you're at currently.

You can go and read Goat's post again and try to understand it a little bit better. That's all I'm going to tell you because I doubt you'll take it from me, or anyone else on this forum for that matter.

@Mr.Bdur It's true Shinobi had HA and more GB vulnerability a while back. It was unhealthy. The OP suggests a rework and Goat responds with something along the lines of giving Shinobi some qualities akin to Shugoki or whatever since Shinobi's current state is so abysmal, but the qualities of the others are 'not as bad.' He also stated that a full on rework isn't even possible with Shinobi's current state. All of the aforementioned stuffs was more sarcastic since Shinobi's kit is so bleh.

If something is so bad, a solution of making something only a little less bad is more humorous, and I would think Goat was being sarcastic. That's all.

[FAT_GUTS]

Everyone else has been more than civil with you the first time around, but you're in no position to talk about anything in this game if you don't understand Goat's sarcasm. You're very stubborn and need to understand you aren't a very good player to pretty much everybody here. I won't be civil with you any more if you want to keep playing these antics. The first thing you do is complain and the last thing you do is try and prove you're somehow right amidst all of these experienced players after admitting you rage quit 9/10 matches against pretty much every viable and balanced mechanic.

So, yes. Stfu. That's about as civil as I'm going to be if you're going to continue to be stubborn and not take the effort to actually learn how to play at a better level than what you're at currently.

You can go and read Goat's post again and try to understand it a little bit better. That's all I'm going to tell you because I doubt you'll take it from me, or anyone else on this forum for that matter.

@Mr.Bdur It's true Shinobi had HA and more GB vulnerability a while back. It was unhealthy. The OP suggests a rework and Goat responds with something along the lines of giving Shinobi some qualities akin to Shugoki or whatever since Shinobi's current state is so abysmal, but the qualities of the others are 'not as bad.' He also stated that a full on rework isn't even possible with Shinobi's current state. All of the aforementioned stuffs was more sarcastic since Shinobi's kit is so bleh.

If something is so bad, a solution of making something only a little less bad is more humorous, and I would think Goat was being sarcastic. That's all.

I do not believe that it was sarcasm. Compare Shugoki with Shinobi especially 3y ago ... quite a diameetric difference.

[Goat_of_Vermund]

To Fat Noob: you are already on my ignore list, I literally won't read a single letter from you again. Just this last time: I made a camparsion, you stupid moron. Google up what it is.

[FAT_GUTS]

To Fat Noob: you are already on my ignore list, I literally won't read a single letter from you again. Just this last time: I made a camparsion, you stupid moron. Google up what it is.

If yes than why are you so rude? I just pointed out that post is about Shinobi and not Shugoki. The thread creator has also Shugoki in the name so I thought you were wrong. If not than just ignore my posts. I didn't mean it wrong, but I probably hit your ego. Sorry if yes.

[MrBdur]

Shinobi never had a superarmor. Looks like you mistaken the Heroes.

For f sakes. I said I'd ignore you from now on but my god I can't...

You say you just pointed out that you were trying to politely correct goat or something (which is BS) but what I just quoted is your first comment on this thread, that Shinobi never had any hyper armor which is incorrect.

Looks like YOU have mistaken the heroes.

This is exactly why you are being treated poorly in the forums. You make incorrect statements and then pretend like you know for a fact you're correct even though we all know better and then when you finally piss people off enough to react poorly to you, you cry and claim everyone is attacking you.

If I walk into a room of physicists and state incorrect things about physics, they will most likely tell me I'm wrong. If I continue to argue and tell them that they are wrong, eventually they will get annoyed and start calling me aj idiot. If I stand there crying "you're attacking me" at that point, what do you think is going to happen? Most likely, they will only think I'm an idiot even more.

This is called reality.

I suggest you check it out.

[Porch-]

Shinobi honestly just needs the glass cannon back. He needs his high damage again. There are too many heroes that are stronger and faster than him and he's the assassin.

Edit: He's the assassin with the lowest HP and no damage to compensate for it.

[Goat_of_Vermund]

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To the no superarmor bs. The noob will probably still think it is somehow a statement that it is right, but if someone wants some character history, check how this bs worked before the nerfs. And yes, those were harsh which put the character to the absolute bottom, but they were also necessary, because the hero had tools that totally countered many things (similar example is Shugoki's hyperarmored lights, though not on the same extent, that at least can be parried).

Shin is extremely hard to balance, the entire kit is built on wrong decisions. The identity is just wrong, range+superdodge in a game where people don't have long range moves to catch the dodge or effectively close the gaps.

[GayForShugoki]

I am not watching that garbage freeze video and you would do well to not link his useless content on my threads again. His less than credible opinion matters not and puts a major dent in your argument. You have someone who actually has no idea what he is talking about, has no real opinion of his own, and gets all his opinions for Competitive For Honor and For Honor Rants, which are both awful places. He will defend a hero one week and then attack that same hero, despite no nerfs, the following week when his fanbase or the public opinion of that hero changes.

Now, because these children decided to fill up my genuine thread with garbage spam because they argue, everything is ruined.

Either way, Shinobi is not hard to balance. It is due to the constant nerfs that the hero is forced into the ‘off screen ranged attack’ playstyle we see. Shinobi has nothing that allows for the hero to excel in actual melee combat. Light attacks are atrocious, zero combos, everyone and their dog can guard break during the double dash. Shinobi is not a hard hero to counter and you are actually punished for trying to play the hero in a different manner rather than ranged attack spam or light > light > run.

Revert Shinobi back to previous state, gather data from people who have actually played the hero, and then buff/nerf from there. I theory crafted a rework for the hero in fifteen damn minutes. Want to see a tl;dr version of it? I doubt anyone would actually care. I altered entire combos, entire playstyles, even the feats in a matter of minutes with ease. This nonsense about balancing Shinobi is a joke.

The last three heroes released have moves, quite easily accessible, to track dashes. Shinobi has no kit that works, honestly. The fact can willingly sit there and defend it is asinine.

[Goat_of_Vermund]

I am not watching that garbage freeze video and you would do well to not link his useless content on my threads again. His less than credible opinion matters not and puts a major dent in your argument. You have someone who actually has no idea what he is talking about, has no real opinion of his own, and gets all his opinions for Competitive For Honor and For Honor Rants, which are both awful places. He will defend a hero one week and then attack that same hero, despite no nerfs, the following week when his fanbase or the public opinion of that hero changes.

Now, because these children decided to fill up my genuine thread with garbage spam because they argue, everything is ruined.

Either way, Shinobi is not hard to balance. It is due to the constant nerfs that the hero is forced into the ‘off screen ranged attack’ playstyle we see. Shinobi has nothing that allows for the hero to excel in actual melee combat. Light attacks are atrocious, zero combos, everyone and their dog can guard break during the double dash. Shinobi is not a hard hero to counter and you are actually punished for trying to play the hero in a different manner rather than ranged attack spam or light > light > run.

Revert Shinobi back to previous state, gather data from people who have actually played the hero, and then buff/nerf from there. I theory crafted a rework for the hero in fifteen damn minutes. Want to see a tl;dr version of it? I doubt anyone would actually care. I altered entire combos, entire playstyles, even the feats in a matter of minutes with ease. This nonsense about balancing Shinobi is a joke.

The last three heroes released have moves, quite easily accessible, to track dashes. Shinobi has no kit that works, honestly. The fact can willingly sit there and defend it is asinine.

Freeze is a credible source. I do not care about your conspiration theories or feelings, if he has valid points about a topic, I will link that video. By the way, it was for the noob, I have enough trust in you to think you actually know he had superarmor if you want to revert it.

You did not really say anything new about this topic, you basically repeated your opening post, but I will still write it down: Shinobi was extremely toxic the way he was designed. He can run away any time. He could always go for the kick, which was almost unpunishable for anyone, even on read. The superarmor allowed him to ignore bash mixups (I assume you know how he could optionselect zone Shugo's main mixup easily), or pretty much everything, a mechanic that was toxic from the start. Fighting him was extremely frustrating, be it a 1v1 or 4v4. Just like with PK when she had absurd damage and a very safe 400ms zone, a good one knew how to abuse the game's flaws. So no, thank you, nobody who takes balance at least a little seriously doesn't want it back (I am sure some people maining him would be happy, but then again, other people would be happy if we would let them play with 100 to 0 Cent, guardbreak on block Conqueror, or season 1 PK. It would still ruin the game).

If you really have a good idea, write it down, because this idea is terrible. And you are wrong, I am very curious how would you fix Shinobi, because I tried, and I think I failed. If that counts for anything, parts of my PK rework ideas were put into the TG, so that is a proof we are listened to (to an extent).

[Gaser.]

I am not watching that garbage freeze video and you would do well to not link his useless content on my threads again. His less than credible opinion matters not and puts a major dent in your argument. You have someone who actually has no idea what he is talking about, has no real opinion of his own, and gets all his opinions for Competitive For Honor and For Honor Rants, which are both awful places. He will defend a hero one week and then attack that same hero, despite no nerfs, the following week when his fanbase or the public opinion of that hero changes.

Now, because these children decided to fill up my genuine thread with garbage spam because they argue, everything is ruined.

Either way, Shinobi is not hard to balance. It is due to the constant nerfs that the hero is forced into the ‘off screen ranged attack’ playstyle we see. Shinobi has nothing that allows for the hero to excel in actual melee combat. Light attacks are atrocious, zero combos, everyone and their dog can guard break during the double dash. Shinobi is not a hard hero to counter and you are actually punished for trying to play the hero in a different manner rather than ranged attack spam or light > light > run.

Revert Shinobi back to previous state, gather data from people who have actually played the hero, and then buff/nerf from there. I theory crafted a rework for the hero in fifteen damn minutes. Want to see a tl;dr version of it? I doubt anyone would actually care. I altered entire combos, entire playstyles, even the feats in a matter of minutes with ease. This nonsense about balancing Shinobi is a joke.

The last three heroes released have moves, quite easily accessible, to track dashes. Shinobi has no kit that works, honestly. The fact can willingly sit there and defend it is asinine.

I actually played shinobi back then and still do sometimes (Rep 20) we don’t need to bring old shinobi back, that’s just bring the dumpster fire of design back.


I rather wait even if he is the last hero to be reworked then getting this game braking mess back.

Also just stop down taking freeze only because you don’t like his opinions.