Push the Envelope. Raise the Bar. Set the Standard. | Forums

[Keltimus]

There is a market for it I'm sure. The early GR and SOCOM style of accessible, tactical team work, with a controllable AI team.

I was following the Zero Six: Behind Enemy Lines on twitter and latest articles, but sadly news and updates just stopped halfway through the first COVID lockdown. If the studio closed down, I'll be heartbroken. I feel like that's what Ubisoft needs is healthy competition in the squad based tactical shooter genre to get both GR and RS back to what made those games exciting.

[xxFratosxx]

You know what. If another company make the game we want, I’ll happily play it. I’ll be sad it’s not part of the GR world, but it’s the type of game we want that’s more important.

Honestly only time will tell. Games are getting close to the actual playstyle of past GR TPS. I honestly have a feeling one of these days military shooters like Cod will have an open world. Thats the one biggest thing thats missing besides deep character customization and Warzone is only a start. They have the mechanics, visuals, features, and visuals down pack, so why not use next gen hardware for an open world experience.

As for Ubisoft I lost all confidence as a whole. Its becoming way too arcade to be taken seriously. They drunk to much open world rpg juice to the point they forgot what made they games great. If anything they need to get the gameplay back to what it was. The guns don't feel like guns with terrible handling. The movement is ridiculous. The camera angle distant, the camera not being locked is my main issue, and so much more. You can have the best story or graphics but if your gameplay is poop it's not going to stand out.

Besides the gameplay they need better engines and servers built from the ground up thats more advanced than their using right now. Features need to be considered like 6 player co-op and 16 player(8v8) pvp. If they don't make these type of changes we will still get the same poop we been getting for the next decade until someone finally buy them out and may do much better. They way I see Ubisoft is a studio that conference hype videos leading gamers to poor gameplay. There's a lot of work for them to do to makeup the consumers they lost and want to gain. At this point each of they games is feeding off some other studio that innovate those ideas already. I don't see any game from Ubisoft that has innovation of the overall game.

[Kean_1]

I was following the Zero Six: Behind Enemy Lines on twitter and latest articles, but sadly news and updates just stopped halfway through the first COVID lockdown. If the studio closed down, I'll be heartbroken. I feel like that's what Ubisoft needs is healthy competition in the squad based tactical shooter genre to get both GR and RS back to what made those games exciting.

Zero Six is still in its infancy. It will likely be a long while before an alpha let alone any real news they can share about the game.

[Kean_1]

Great write up as always and here are just a few of my random thoughts I'd like to share if I can.....


Weapon maintenance
o I’m not so sure about this in a GR game and it would really depend on how it’s implemented IMO. The way it worked in FC2 was a major complaint and probably why it never saw a reappearance going forward. While jams can add to the depth of the gameplay, maintenance shouldn’t be something that saps the fun out of the game.

Tuning Weapons
o I agree that there should be nothing wrong with this but I still think it can be done in a way that makes more sense. CoD:MW is a good example of this in how they handled their gunsmith. Accessories had pros and cons to help balance gameplay but the effects were also grounded more in the realm of believability. Something like a longer barrel could negatively affect handling but increase accuracy and so on. Like you mentioned, this is way better IMO than magical bonuses or unrelated handicaps. Weight could also come into play.

o As for having duplicate weapons available with different configurations, again, I look toward CoD:MW. I prefer their system of being able to save various loadouts for each weapon. For example, you have one M4 but you can save multiple configurations using the acc’s you have unlocked vs. having to swap out these items manually each time. I guess this is essentially the same thing but the player can choose their M4 in different configurations from their own saved, custom presets or build a new one from the available parts they have unlocked.

o Weapon tuning is huge IMO as it encourages players to use different loadouts and weapon platforms. …..something Ubi tried to force on people in Breakpoint when they really didn’t need to. Just look at the diversity of the gunsmith and weapons in MW. There were so many different configurations you could make to the weapons in that game. I found myself switching them out all the time and had several favorites vs. just one. Even changing the ammo some weapons can be chambered for like the .300 Blackout for the M4.


Vehicles
o To add, vehicle physics, sounds and animations need to be refined as mentioned. They flat out suck in Breakpoint. They weren’t even what I would consider good in Wildlands but they were at least better. Breakpoint was a step back in several ways to be honest.

o Vehicles should take damage that affects mobility, speed, handling, fuel (if tank is hit), etc. until they eventually break down. They could also be repairable taking a cue from games like Battlefield. However, maybe this is where the whole idea of supplies can come in as repairs might require certain components or generalized “scrap”. …..Days Gone had a similar system in their game where scrap needed to be collected and could be used to repair your bike, modify things ,etc. Excessive damage could leave you stranded and with a vehicle full of supplies / weapons, etc. you could be looking at a side mission of your own to go and acquire the parts / scrap needed to get your ride going again. ….or the acquisition of a new vehicle to transfer the cargo to. Either way, this helps generate tasks / side missions for the player in a more organic sense just like supply raids you discussed, etc.

o Helos also need to be improved especially in the physics department. Again, the devs should really play games like BF4 and GTAV.

o Love the idea of vehicles needing fuel because once again, raiding bases for supplies or convoys makes a lot more sense. It adds replayability to the game as you could find yourself raiding the same bases for different reasons based on needs, not just missions.



Generalization of these mechanics is fine. There’s no need to over think some of this stuff like the difference in the types of fuels, parts, etc. Fuel is fuel whether it’s a helo taking avgas, a truck taking diesel or car taking regular gasoline. Same with parts using the general “scrap” idea of Days Gone I mentioned. Depending on the level of damage it will depend on how many “parts” / “scrap” will be required to fix it.

Anyhow, great ideas and there is a lot here that warrants more discussion IMO but most of all, Ubi’s attention. .....but Breakpoint is so far from these ideas it will require a new game in the franchise to create something with this kind of vision.

I'll leave the bandaging / healing mechanics to another conversation as I find it a lot more complex than just providing a quick blurb about how I feel about it. Personally, I just want a game that is focused on lethality vs. sponginess, more realistic ballistics, damage, etc.

[Hugo-FOU]

Great write up as always and here are just a few of my random thoughts I'd like to share if I can.....


Weapon maintenance
o I’m not so sure about this in a GR game and it would really depend on how it’s implemented IMO. The way it worked in FC2 was a major complaint and probably why it never saw a reappearance going forward. While jams can add to the depth of the gameplay, maintenance shouldn’t be something that saps the fun out of the game.

Tuning Weapons
o I agree that there should be nothing wrong with this but I still think it can be done in a way that makes more sense. CoD:MW is a good example of this in how they handled their gunsmith. Accessories had pros and cons to help balance gameplay but the effects were also grounded more in the realm of believability. Something like a longer barrel could negatively affect handling but increase accuracy and so on. Like you mentioned, this is way better IMO than magical bonuses or unrelated handicaps. Weight could also come into play.

o As for having duplicate weapons available with different configurations, again, I look toward CoD:MW. I prefer their system of being able to save various loadouts for each weapon. For example, you have one M4 but you can save multiple configurations using the acc’s you have unlocked vs. having to swap out these items manually each time. I guess this is essentially the same thing but the player can choose their M4 in different configurations from their own saved, custom presets or build a new one from the available parts they have unlocked.

o Weapon tuning is huge IMO as it encourages players to use different loadouts and weapon platforms. …..something Ubi tried to force on people in Breakpoint when they really didn’t need to. Just look at the diversity of the gunsmith and weapons in MW. There were so many different configurations you could make to the weapons in that game. I found myself switching them out all the time and had several favorites vs. just one. Even changing the ammo some weapons can be chambered for like the .300 Blackout for the M4.


Vehicles
o To add, vehicle physics, sounds and animations need to be refined as mentioned. They flat out suck in Breakpoint. They weren’t even what I would consider good in Wildlands but they were at least better. Breakpoint was a step back in several ways to be honest.

o Vehicles should take damage that affects mobility, speed, handling, fuel (if tank is hit), etc. until they eventually break down. They could also be repairable taking a cue from games like Battlefield. However, maybe this is where the whole idea of supplies can come in as repairs might require certain components or generalized “scrap”. …..Days Gone had a similar system in their game where scrap needed to be collected and could be used to repair your bike, modify things ,etc. Excessive damage could leave you stranded and with a vehicle full of supplies / weapons, etc. you could be looking at a side mission of your own to go and acquire the parts / scrap needed to get your ride going again. ….or the acquisition of a new vehicle to transfer the cargo to. Either way, this helps generate tasks / side missions for the player in a more organic sense just like supply raids you discussed, etc.

o Helos also need to be improved especially in the physics department. Again, the devs should really play games like BF4 and GTAV.

o Love the idea of vehicles needing fuel because once again, raiding bases for supplies or convoys makes a lot more sense. It adds replayability to the game as you could find yourself raiding the same bases for different reasons based on needs, not just missions.



Generalization of these mechanics is fine. There’s no need to over think some of this stuff like the difference in the types of fuels, parts, etc. Fuel is fuel whether it’s a helo taking avgas, a truck taking diesel or car taking regular gasoline. Same with parts using the general “scrap” idea of Days Gone I mentioned. Depending on the level of damage it will depend on how many “parts” / “scrap” will be required to fix it.

Anyhow, great ideas and there is a lot here that warrants more discussion IMO but most of all, Ubi’s attention. .....but Breakpoint is so far from these ideas it will require a new game in the franchise to create something with this kind of vision.

I'll leave the bandaging / healing mechanics to another conversation as I find it a lot more complex than just providing a quick blurb about how I feel about it. Personally, I just want a game that is focused on lethality vs. sponginess, more realistic ballistics, damage, etc.

As usual we’re very much on the same page. I already agree with everything you say, or you have refined the vision I had.
As you say regarding weapon maintenance, it shouldn’t become a nuisance. Keeping a weapon operational and stoppage free, should be a simple matter. A light clean would keep it operational. A ‘field strip’, could restore it to 90% optimal condition and a deep clean to 100% with a small accuracy and/or ROF bonus.
I also see it as being slight deferent for each weapon. For example, a SBR compressor could be a great, compact weapon for CQC, but could get fouled if used for prolonged open combat. (As in, it wouldn’t be the choice for suppressive fire). But as with everything, ideally the player could choose the level of effect, including an off setting.

Days gone is definitely one to look at, not just for vehicle maintenance, but also for bike handling and animation.

[Vault_Traveler]

I honestly think Wildlands is overrated, going back from Breakpoint its not really fun to play anymore.

Breakpoint is a mess, dont get me wrong but Wildlands isnt that great either.

They both feel like bloated Ubisoft Open World Games the only difference is shooting and traversing in Breakpoint is more fun while in Wildlands World and Missions are better.

Both tactical Gameplay sucks, both AI sucks, both dont feel like fleshed out shooters.

Ofc Breakpoint has other problems on top but yeah doesn’t change the fact that Wildlands isnt that great either.

I enjoyed my stay but its overdue in both.

[Kean_1]

As usual we’re very much on the same page. I already agree with everything you say, or you have refined the vision I had.
As you say regarding weapon maintenance, it shouldn’t become a nuisance. Keeping a weapon operational and stoppage free, should be a simple matter. A light clean would keep it operational. A ‘field strip’, could restore it to 90% optimal condition and a deep clean to 100% with a small accuracy and/or ROF bonus.
I also see it as being slight deferent for each weapon. For example, a SBR compressor could be a great, compact weapon for CQC, but could get fouled if used for prolonged open combat. (As in, it wouldn’t be the choice for suppressive fire). But as with everything, ideally the player could choose the level of effect, including an off setting.

Days gone is definitely one to look at, not just for vehicle maintenance, but also for bike handling and animation.

I agree. Also, gun jams are fine but as you say, it shouldn't be a nuisance to gameplay or feel over used.

Jams can actually be great for tension and perhaps degree of frequency can increase if the player really neglects maintenance. .....with a relatively small chance it might happen any other time. ...and perhaps the severity of the jam can depend on condition as well going from a simple "tap and rack" to get back in the action or a more difficult problem requiring mag removal and further manipulation of the bolt / slide / charging handle, etc.

DayZ has jams but they aren't very frequent at all. I also think they are dependent on the condition. Some jams can be cleared quickly while others show more involved animations showing the player trying to get the weapon back in action. .....even hitting it with their palm at times as if a round is stuck.

It's kinda cool actually because again, it's not something that happens often and when it does, things can get really hairy. In fact, I think of all the time I've played DayZ it's only happened to me a handful of times or so.

What worries me in a game like GR is that it would be a mechanic that is over used to show "hey, check out our cool feature". Nothing wrong with designing things into a game that feel more like a surprise because they don't happen very often.

RDR2 is a good example of that. They have a lot of little details like that which a lot of players never discover. It was almost a year later when I found out you could be struck by lightning.

[KingSpawn1979]

I absolutely admire you Guys around here still making great Suggestions.
It's a Shame Ubisoft still gives a ****.

[MikeWeeks]

I think it's "Ubisoft doesn't give a ****" is what you meant, right?

[Hugo-FOU]

I honestly think Wildlands is overrated, going back from Breakpoint its not really fun to play anymore.

Breakpoint is a mess, dont get me wrong but Wildlands isnt that great either.

They both feel like bloated Ubisoft Open World Games the only difference is shooting and traversing in Breakpoint is more fun while in Wildlands World and Missions are better.

Both tactical Gameplay sucks, both AI sucks, both dont feel like fleshed out shooters.

Ofc Breakpoint has other problems on top but yeah doesn’t change the fact that Wildlands isnt that great either.

I enjoyed my stay but its overdue in both.

Where Wildlands shines is in the overall atmosphere of the game. It creates a believable setting. I’ve gone back a couple of times, but the experience is spoiled by the few improvements BP has made. So I don’t think Wildlands is overrated, but it is far from perfect.