Bahhh nerf conq zone | Forums

[The_Sentinel_]

Lol .. Conq can not feint ... you are wrong!

yes I'm wrong rep 70 conq for almost more than 2 years

[The_Sentinel_]

Conq feints heavies with full guard. Full guard guarantees an attack.

Heavy attacks have superior block. Thats defense followed by free damage.

Dodges have superior block. Thats defense followed by a free bash followed by free damage and chain starters.

Zone has superior block. Thats defense followed by free damage.

I'm aware of all these, I'm rep 70 conq and 490 overall. What I meant that he cannot feint like any other hero.

[MrGrippz]

I'm aware of all these, I'm rep 70 conq and 490 overall. What I meant that he cannot feint like any other hero.

Hard feint. He cant hard feint, only soft feint into chained moves or all guard.

The only problem with d0uchecakes condescending novels is hes acting like Conq is a spinning whirlwind & everyone is running into the slow zone obliviously.

We know it atks left. Bdur clearly said the zone is being used as an option select lol. Its such a good option select cuz its a fast zone atk 360 + all guard 360. Literally one of the safest moves in the game. It will instantly stuff offense of any amount of players attacking Conq. After that, Kensei & Zhanhu zones are the only comparable 360 option selects [that i can think of right now] that can stuff offense from all sides & Zhanhus aint that fast comin out.

Conqs zone just needs to cost him much more stamina & IMO that would fix it. At least he would come out of it with a slight worry of being OOS if he aint mindful.

[MrBdur]

Hard feint. He cant hard feint, only soft feint into chained moves or all guard.

The only problem with d0uchecakes condescending novels is hes acting like Conq is a spinning whirlwind & everyone is running into the slow zone obliviously.

We know it atks left. Bdur clearly said the zone is being used as an option select lol. Its such a good option select cuz its a fast zone atk 360 + all guard 360. Literally one of the safest moves in the game. It will instantly stuff offense of any amount of players attacking Conq. After that, Kensei & Zhanhu zones are the only comparable 360 option selects [that i can think of right now] that can stuff offense from all sides & Zhanhus aint that fast comin out.

Conqs zone just needs to cost him much more stamina & IMO that would fix it. At least he would come out of it with a slight worry of being OOS if he aint mindful.

Increased stam cost isnt a bad idea. I still like the idea of simply removing the superior block property of it though.

Either that or make it ONLY defend. No attack. That is, if they are so desperate to retain conqs defensive style.

The reason that dude spews bs like "it comes from the left" is because he honestly thinks it's just that simple. Obviously he plays against super low level, super simple opponents that don't know how to make good reads or time things very well. The only conqs he encounters are the ones who zone on reaction to every single hard feint he makes. LOL

Edit:

Oh sorry. To clarify, I am not referring to "The Sentinel". He is just adding his opinion to the topic. I refer to the actual idiot. I think we all know who I mean...

[Empire_880]

I am not a conqueror main, but I like the class how it's designed(moveset/combos/feats).

In my opinion superior block shouldn't be gone and traded for the ability to feint his heavies. Why? You can't actually feint with a flail and in the game is displayed with this non-existant conq. mechanic. If you try it the head on a chain won't hit the intended place. One does not have control of the weapon at all. It's not a sword, nor an axe, nor like other maces(without a chain).

Call me whatever you want, but I would like to give some examples of LB and PK.

I liked LB in pre-rework. He had some interesting tools to offer in his moveset-the uninterruptable shove-after-block for example(R.I.P). Now because of whiney topics it's now a very risky and vulnerable tool. After rework he had improved combos. That was a nice thing to do. Unblockable top finishers made him kind of OP, (Zhan'zhu's heavy finishers are unblockable too, never played it, so I am not sure), but not invincible considering his damage output too(top finisher stuns too). Shove-after-block was gone too, at least it kept it's hyper armor. With CCU LB got nerfed, but far more than he actually deserved. And some nerfs were needless. To me the class have lost his own identity.

PK-Nerfed twice in a row, reducing her damage to a pitiful degree and has to rely mostly on her guardbreaks with stabs and bleeds. I bet my money someone, who got owned non-stop by PK demanded a nerf on her damage. Nowadays PK has quite limited options to show off.

And now again back on Cong:

What I would do is slighly increase the stamina he uses on zone, but also increase the damage output slightly. All I ask is to stop removing key mechanics to classes(also stop whining about something being OP, but it isn't really), which make one class unique in it's way. Remove this or that and a class become quite generic. Nothing interesting to offer in his/her moveset/combos.

[Goat_of_Vermund]

I am not a conqueror main, but I like the class how it's designed(moveset/combos/feats).

In my opinion superior block shouldn't be gone and traded for the ability to feint his heavies. Why? You can't actually feint with a flail and in the game is displayed with this non-existant conq. mechanic. If you try it the head on a chain won't hit the intended place. One does not have control of the weapon at all. It's not a sword, nor an axe, nor like other maces(without a chain).

Call me whatever you want, but I would like to give some examples of LB and PK.

I liked LB in pre-rework. He had some interesting tools to offer in his moveset-the uninterruptable shove-after-block for example(R.I.P). Now because of whiney topics it's now a very risky and vulnerable tool. After rework he had improved combos. That was a nice thing to do. Unblockable top finishers made him kind of OP, (Zhan'zhu's heavy finishers are unblockable too, never played it, so I am not sure), but not invincible considering his damage output too(top finisher stuns too). Shove-after-block was gone too, at least it kept it's hyper armor. With CCU LB got nerfed, but far more than he actually deserved. And some nerfs were needless. To me the class have lost his own identity.

PK-Nerfed twice in a row, reducing her damage to a pitiful degree and has to rely mostly on her guardbreaks with stabs and bleeds. I bet my money someone, who got owned non-stop by PK demanded a nerf on her damage. Nowadays PK has quite limited options to show off.

And now again back on Cong:

What I would do is slighly increase the stamina he uses on zone, but also increase the damage output slightly. All I ask is to stop removing key mechanics to classes(also stop whining about something being OP, but it isn't really), which make one class unique in it's way. Remove this or that and a class become quite generic. Nothing interesting to offer in his/her moveset/combos.

Both of your example heroes were quite toxic in some way.

Against Lawbringer, there wasn't a thing called chained offense, as soon as you tried to throw anything, you were shoved. Which is not too much fun, it was tiring, irritating, it made absolutely no sense. Peacekeeper had an other problem, her damage was unfairly high: she still has 38 damage on her guardbreak, and she used to have 49 damage on her heavies. That was extremely toxis as well, and she had a 400ms zone optionselect parry too.


If a key mechanic stops the game from being fair or stops other heroes from attacking, that key mechanic sucks. Conqueror's zone is something exactly like this. Him being unable to feint is this too, this just means his offense actually sucks, he can not feint into guardbreak, he can not feint into light- yeah, controlling a flail is hard, maybe that is the main reason it was not used by real people much, but in the game, it is unfair. Also, there are things like Shaman and Shinobi, realism was thrown out the window so long ago that the stray cats could devour even its memories.

[Empire_880]

If I sounded like it, then I apologyze. Also I wasn't playing everyday For Honor and in case I missed something, I won't stop anybody from correcting me here. However, I learned something in the hard way. Change the game more and more. The more balancing one tries to do, something different pops up from nothing. The more balancing one tries to do, the more unbalaced things will become. It happens everywhere.

Now... I still stand against the idea to give the conq. the ability to feint for the physics's sake, albeit how good it would be looking mechanic-wise. Welp. If armor in the game was a thing, I imagine, that 2/3 of the knight's classes would dominate. For balancing reasons, it's not a thing and I understand why. This is a topic I won't dwelve on right now.

Any other suggestions to balance the conq's zone, in case you don't like the stam and dmg increase with a small %?

[Goat_of_Vermund]

If I sounded like it, then I apologyze. Also I wasn't playing everyday For Honor and in case I missed something, I won't stop anybody from correcting me here. However, I learned something in the hard way. Change the game more and more. The more balancing one tries to do, something different pops up from nothing. The more balancing one tries to do, the more unbalaced things will become. It happens everywhere.

Now... I still stand against the idea to give the conq. the ability to feint for the physics's sake, albeit how good it would be looking mechanic-wise. Welp. If armor in the game was a thing, I imagine, that 2/3 of the knight's classes would dominate. For balancing reasons, it's not a thing and I understand why. This is a topic I won't dwelve on right now.

Any other suggestions to balance the conq's zone, in case you don't like the stam and dmg increase with a small %?

I think there are simple things. For example, it can deal 12 damage with each hit instead of the nothing it does now, but it should be guardbreakable. Or it should be a light attack. And in return, chained top heavies could be unblockable, and maybe he should get one more softfeint option from the heavy (like a light attack).

Balancing is not the problem, the problem is how it is done: they do minimal things after months and months, they are not very ambitious, and they are usually not the needed things. Balance is an absolute must, the problem is how they do it.

[MrBdur]

I am not a conqueror main, but I like the class how it's designed(moveset/combos/feats).

In my opinion superior block shouldn't be gone and traded for the ability to feint his heavies. Why? You can't actually feint with a flail and in the game is displayed with this non-existant conq. mechanic. If you try it the head on a chain won't hit the intended place. One does not have control of the weapon at all. It's not a sword, nor an axe, nor like other maces(without a chain).

Call me whatever you want, but I would like to give some examples of LB and PK.

I liked LB in pre-rework. He had some interesting tools to offer in his moveset-the uninterruptable shove-after-block for example(R.I.P). Now because of whiney topics it's now a very risky and vulnerable tool. After rework he had improved combos. That was a nice thing to do. Unblockable top finishers made him kind of OP, (Zhan'zhu's heavy finishers are unblockable too, never played it, so I am not sure), but not invincible considering his damage output too(top finisher stuns too). Shove-after-block was gone too, at least it kept it's hyper armor. With CCU LB got nerfed, but far more than he actually deserved. And some nerfs were needless. To me the class have lost his own identity.

PK-Nerfed twice in a row, reducing her damage to a pitiful degree and has to rely mostly on her guardbreaks with stabs and bleeds. I bet my money someone, who got owned non-stop by PK demanded a nerf on her damage. Nowadays PK has quite limited options to show off.

And now again back on Cong:

What I would do is slighly increase the stamina he uses on zone, but also increase the damage output slightly. All I ask is to stop removing key mechanics to classes(also stop whining about something being OP, but it isn't really), which make one class unique in it's way. Remove this or that and a class become quite generic. Nothing interesting to offer in his/her moveset/combos.

I don't think superior block should be removed from conqs kit altogether, just the zone attack.

I play at pretty high skill levels (as opposed to high rep levels, which I do play at but high rep level does not equal high skill level, per se). At high skill levels, the Conq zone is just simply too efficient at stuffing offense.

I admit, it isn't exactly easy to do, as doing it consistently requires knowledge of most movesets, good timing, and good reads. Players with all those things, however, can effectively stuff 99% of offense in the game, pretty much on reaction.

[Goat_of_Vermund]

I don't think superior block should be removed from conqs kit altogether, just the zone attack.

I play at pretty high skill levels (as opposed to high rep levels, which I do play at but high rep level does not equal high skill level, per se). At high skill levels, the Conq zone is just simply too efficient at stuffing offense.

I admit, it isn't exactly easy to do, as doing it consistently requires knowledge of most movesets, good timing, and good reads. Players with all those things, however, can effectively stuff 99% of offense in the game, pretty much on reaction.

Yeah, that is the most terrifying thing about a Conqueror in duels: if it is a high level one, you know he is seriously good. Black Prior, a character of similar strenght, has a nice linear learning curve: at low level, light-bash-light brings victories, but as the opponents get stronger and you unlock more, you at the end remain with a strong technical hero who teaches you the game step by step. Conqueror is a torturer: low skill Conquerors like those our friend encounters (and what he likely is) are extremely inefficent, everything in the kit requires technical knowledge about other heroes and recoveries.

I really think he should have more interesting offense, and more grounded defense. But I don't keep my hopes up, the way they treated my main for years clearly proves the extreme incompetence of the developers (the fact they let something as stupid as Warmonger's level 1 feat in the game on release proves this easily).