1. #1

    Year 6, rework maps that NEED IT

    It's obvious to say that year 4 and year 5 have been a disaster for the most part when it came to reworks. From theme park, to house (controversial), reworks have been removing personality from maps and turning them into simple and bland paintball arenas. The worst part is that the maps that actually need reworks aren't?! Oregon was probably the most balanced map before the rework and now it's become insanity. It's clear yoo-bee isn't planning on adding any new maps anytime soon with their 2 year trend of constant reworks. I propose that they instead rework maps that desperately need it. Y6 should definitely rework Tower, Fortress, Favela (mildly, and by that i mean by adding just a new pathway to top floor site and adding indestructible walls there, but not too many) and especially BARTLETT. Bartlett had huge potential for it's unique layout of the library site, but it desperately needs a rework due to the spawnpeeks and ways into the actual building(virtually 2 ways). The dining room wall facing outside should be destructible or have a door. These little tweaks would be great because its obvious the players hate BIG reworks like hereford or oregon where you alter the aesthetic of the map significantly. The good thing about small reworks/buffs for these less popular maps is that the meta doesn't have an effect on it YET. Bartlett hasn't been played in casual for years now so the meta simply does not exist for it. When it comes to tower, people tend to just leave half the time before they even start round 1. This gives the developers the opportunity to hotfix the small issues with the map (like what was done on kafe in kitchen) but keep everything else the EXACT (huge emphasis on this) same to capitalize on pre-existing map knowledge. On kafe, the windows were the exact same (except prep) and everything else was super familiar, the only time the whole community enjoyed a rework.
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  2. #2
    UbiShoreman's Avatar Community Representative
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    I like some of the proposed ideas here!

    The community as a whole seems fairly mixed on which maps "Actually need it" which has been a bit of a point of confusion. For instance, most folks agree on Tower and Skyscraper, but Favela and Fortress still remain hotly debated. The house rework is also getting some really mixed reviews, some people loving it, some not so much. In general, when you think of a "good" rework, what kind of elements do you look for?
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  3. #3
    Not replacing good door with windows. I like the Chalet rework but i dislike the fact that games door was replaced with a window as you cant use the more discreat entry method on windows and you are also forced into vualting which can be annoying in some sitatuions. The same goes for Theme Park as there is no longer a main door, and instead is filled with poorly placed windows.
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  4. #4
    Slyrr7's Avatar Senior Member
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    The question was asked. Here is my answer, from my perspective. None of the maps 'needed' to be reworked. A 'good' rework should keep the map the same, just make minor adjustments to stop exploits like spawn peeking and run-outs. A good player will adapt his tactics to a dynamic and unpredictable map. Not expect the map to be changed to conform to them. Static, predictable maps are what this game started off trying to step AWAY from.

    What we need is for UBI to stop the hacking, the exploits, and other such things which make EVERY map a drag. Trust the players to sort out everything else.

    Let's be frank - the reason why some players hate Favela, Plane, original Hereford, original House, and Skyscraper is because they're unpredictable. They don't fit into the pro-league, Defuse Bomb mentality. These players need to get over that and play through the map, K/D ratio be darned. You live with your losses. You adjust.

    In short - a 'good' rework is the one that doesn't need to be made.
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  5. #5
    xcel30's Avatar Senior Member
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    Originally Posted by UbiShoreman Go to original post
    I like some of the proposed ideas here!

    The community as a whole seems fairly mixed on which maps "Actually need it" which has been a bit of a point of confusion. For instance, most folks agree on Tower and Skyscraper, but Favela and Fortress still remain hotly debated. The house rework is also getting some really mixed reviews, some people loving it, some not so much. In general, when you think of a "good" rework, what kind of elements do you look for?
    I never saw soemone saying that favela was balanced, i heard people saying they liked but they also understood that was not viable in comp
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  6. #6
    PurpleRainDMSR's Avatar Member
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    The only good reworks are the ones that largely leave the map as-is, only tweaking the map with minor improvements, like adding the small second tunnel to armory or the little room between cash and bedroom on clubhouse; adding some spawn cover on Consulate; putting a gate to protect the worst spawn on Border.

    Those reworks worked because they took the maps people love and left them the eff alone(!), instead of basically removing and replacing them with something completely different. Daring to dub the reworks of the last couple years with the same names as the originals is blasphemy, especially in the cases of Kanal and Hereford, which barely look or feel like the originals inside or out. Well, maybe out... the spawn sites are the only parts of those maps that still look like the originals. The crap we've been getting lately should've just been renamed, the maps they were based on given minor tweaks that didn’t drastically alter them and both maps continue to exist side by side.

    All Favela has ever needed is a few less soft walls and maybe the top floor area outside packaging and the other stairs to be made accessible to defenders.

    All Airplane needs is to stop being left out of rotation longer than it's left in. That, and the single worst thing (and I'd say the only bad thing about this, my favorite map), is that the spawn sites absolutely suck and 99% of the time result in spawn killing because of how they force attackers to bottleneck into a lowground situation with little useful cover and only a small handful of entry points. I will never be convinced that airplane needs anything more than for the spawn situation to be fixed and the rest of the map left the heck alone. Maybe add a second hatch above or near cockpit. Absolutely revert the changes I hear were made that have removed all the vertical play from server floor; removing that aspect of the map in effect turns it into tower 2.0 as far as fuze, buck and sledge are concerned, almost completely removing vertical play from the map altogether.

    Tower, on the other hand, could really use some added vertical play. Maybe expand the elevator service access area to add a couple paths with soft floors and a hatch or two above media and maybe gift shop or CEO. Remove a few of the soft walls in restaurant and add some soft ceilings.

    I don't know what's not to like about skyscraper... other than the runouts. I like that map, so do something about that and it’s fine by me.

    I liked Kanal. I liked Oregon. I liked the original kitchen layout in Kafe and had some of my favorite moments in the game in there - including the best 10-second-or-less ace I ever got. I liked the old theme park and hate that these Yoo-Been-Swindled ****s removed Zanzibar.

    Before I stopped playing the game, I started quitting every time one of these pale shadow reworks came up. Sure made the game feel small, what when you have an already unwanted and loathsome rotating map pool choking the life, variety and choice out of the game and preventing me from playing my favorite maps, only to have to skip half or more of what few maps are deemed worthy for rotation by the infallible, supreme leader, god king Yoo-Bee-Tyrants.

    DO NOT QUESTION OUR DIVINE EDICTS! DISTRACT YOURSELVES FROM OUR FAILURES WITH THESE SHINY COSMETIC TRINKETS!
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  7. #7
    Sgt Astor's Avatar Senior Member
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    God please no! Enough reworks. I wanna play on something new.
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  8. #8
    Originally Posted by UbiShoreman Go to original post
    I like some of the proposed ideas here!

    The community as a whole seems fairly mixed on which maps "Actually need it" which has been a bit of a point of confusion. For instance, most folks agree on Tower and Skyscraper, but Favela and Fortress still remain hotly debated. The house rework is also getting some really mixed reviews, some people loving it, some not so much. In general, when you think of a "good" rework, what kind of elements do you look for?
    What you will see the split be, as far as map reworks
    Is the "competitive" community vs the non

    For example, I think maps like OLD hereford are a GOOD thing, because their design does NOT let all playstyles apply to all maps
    Some maps SHOULD be roamer heavy
    Some SHOULD be anchor heavy

    Making everything viable for everything, actually results in LESS variety as people will simply due the same, most effective strat over and over because the game lets them
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  9. #9
    The spawn peeking fix for plane should be two "high ground" spawn points with good cover overwatching the front and rear of plane. This way attackers can take a Glaz and or Kali or a Recruit with an LMG to watch for early game run outs.
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  10. #10
    Slyrr7's Avatar Senior Member
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    For example, I think maps like OLD hereford are a GOOD thing, because their design does NOT let all playstyles apply to all maps. Some maps SHOULD be roamer heavy. Some SHOULD be anchor heavy. Making everything viable for everything, actually results in LESS variety as people will simply do the same, most effective strategy over and over, because the game lets them.
    Hear, hear. You nailed it. The 'reworks' were engineered solely and specifically for Pro league, and their statistically predictable game play. The reworks were made to force all players to play in exactly the same way, do exactly the same things, and follow the exact same strategies over and over again. Because that's the way the pro players 'like' it. Problem is - not everyone is a pro player. And the non-pro players dislike that kind of contrived playing style. Not only that - we resent UBI and the pro league for forcing it on us against our will and consent. We resent them taking away the original maps that we did like, and herding us like cattle into inferior reworked maps that we don't like.

    I will never forget a post from a company representative, trying to address this divide when the complaints of Casual players became a bit too loud for UBI's comfort. They said there was a purpose behind the changes being made, to the maps, to Casual, to Terrorist Hunt, and all the other content that was being taken away. They said that the purpose was to 'realign' us. The world "realign" in that context had a manipulative, almost sinister tone. Especially when you realize it was applied to a video game that was supposed to have been made for our entertainment. It came across as an artificial, behind-closed-doors plot, schemed and cooked up to force us away from the game that we liked, and corral us into playing only by Ranked, Defuse Bomb, pro-league game rules. And they said it like they thought they were giving us a wonderful treat, rather than slapping us in the face with a dead fish. As if Casual players, who enjoyed the real-world, unpredictable original maps, couldn't wait for UBI to take it all away and replace it with inferior, pro-league junk.

    With the development team for Siege pretty much AWOL except for the ones catering to the pro players, we can only pray that someone among them finally wakes up and realizes they have a responsibility to their customers who live outside the Defuse Bomb, Pro-League sandbox.

    For example - the dearly departed IceyCat posted an example of a reworked House map that only had some minor fixes from the original to fix some serious exploits. It still looked and played like Original House though. UBI said they were interested. So - why not implement it? We've got plenty of hard drive space, UBI. We can take it.
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  11. #11
    Your never going to please everyone with a re-work, personally i like all the re-worked maps so far. would definitely like to see tower/skyscraper re-worked.
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  12. #12
    WBBCoop's Avatar Senior Member
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    Originally Posted by VDubnub88 Go to original post
    Your never going to please everyone with a re-work, personally i like all the re-worked maps so far. would definitely like to see tower/skyscraper re-worked.
    I agree that you can't win the hearts of everyone when it comes to reworks. I also think that the current reworks have mostly positive changes to them.

    Personally I think Bank and Fevela are the two most needed maps for change. Bank has a stagnated meta, and a huge volume of developement potential in the lobby itself. Favela could use some alternatives for the defenders to welcome the attackers inside rather than the viabilities of 'outside play' or 'vertical play' (which honestly are the only two options).

    Also, the addition of a new core mode, that is coming with Y6, might change how we feel about our general conceptions of reworks anyways. Hopefully we get a 'squad mode' and change (or eliminate) the wothless unranked mode to accomidate .

    All in all I'm not displeased with any map changes and I think it needs to be done for those of us that think stagnaton is more of an issue than nestalgia.
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  13. #13
    Originally Posted by UbiShoreman Go to original post
    I like some of the proposed ideas here!

    The community as a whole seems fairly mixed on which maps "Actually need it" which has been a bit of a point of confusion. For instance, most folks agree on Tower and Skyscraper, but Favela and Fortress still remain hotly debated. The house rework is also getting some really mixed reviews, some people loving it, some not so much. In general, when you think of a "good" rework, what kind of elements do you look for?
    I think i speak for the community when i say that the elements that make a rework good is simply making minor tweaks. If you look at clubhouse, the very first rework; it was such a slight tweak, just adding a little connector here, but thats the secret. LITTLE changes not like oregon where all the lines of sight have been shifted differently. The part that players love about old maps is that the term "balance" isn't shown so evidently and there's clear "power spots" in the gameplay. An example of this is like kanal. On the rework all of the furniture and misc objects have been placed for perfect crouch height or standing height and nothing obstructing that. In older maps, there was a variety to the height of different pieces of furniture and objects around the map where sometimes you had a small line of sight, or a larger one. Additionally, if you look back at kafe rework. People LOVED this rework because it was essentially the same exact map but everso slightly tweaked. Kitchen was the only part really overhauled and obviously main entrance consequentially, but the middle floor was left unchanged and top floot just got a minor buff (the addition to the new balconies was amazing). I really want to emphasize the fact that reworks shouldnt be large changes but small tweaks. Take for example the hatch on old oregon. It was a very powerful tool to the attacking team once a plant went down, but thats INTEGRAL to what the true meaning of TACTICAL shooter means. Being tactical means taking control of a key part of the map and utilizing something natural to swing the round in your favour. What is done now in reworks is that all these "key" and powerful map points are removed or are degraded to the point of near uselessness (exactly like the hatch on oregon). Let me address favela. Favela is a map that many casual players ADORE because of how amazing it looks, players are scared to see it rework because of the track record of old reworks like oregon and hereford. The main problem for favela is the fact of too many destructable walls (which is great for its uniqueness and should STAY but it doesnt fit so well in the current meta) and the packaging room site site. A good solution to fix favela is simply by adding a connecting point from the top of south stairs and connect it to the door of packaging room and ALSO making the north stairs go towards east only for the final staircase and finally make the north facing wall indestructible. Finally the Football bedroom/office site should be switched to bedroom/apartment(without the kitchen part) and make part of the east wall indestructible (only the part connected to the site). Other than that, keep the map the EXACT same, and i mean exactly (same textures, colours, spawns, everything, it's what makes people happy). When it comes to fortress, the map in my opinion is just too bland colour-wise so an art overhaul would be required. Some walls of sites should become indestructible to make it easier for defenders staying on site and the main stairs should be more open to cover them from the top. There is probably more needed for fortress though. Moral of the story though, to be liked a rework needs to do this; 1- Slightly buff an unviable bomb site to be better and making the least amount of change layout-wise to that site. 2- Do NOT put metal shutters on windows a lot (like what was done on new chalet, *gag*), leave em open, it makes the map look not only bad but unrealistic. 3- Don't overhaul textures and colors on that map, it ruins the aesthetic of the base map (like what was done on oregon, house, hereford, kanal). 3- Don't touch sites that are meta and considered strong, instead only buff bad sites, this way a game on a certain map isnt always played the EXACT same way every time. 4- Leave these "power spots" alone (Ex: Old oregon main hatch and attic long window, Old chalet kitchen window and array of windows of main stairs, etc.) these "power spots" are what make the map unique and fun to play around with. 5- Leave people have their variable furniture (ex: bartlett; all the furniture is mostly of different heights and positions, making the map seem more natural). 6- Stop focusing on line of sights and 2 way angles being the key of everything, let the map seem NATURAL (by this i mean do what was done for every map until blood orchid). The maps afterwards so clearly focus on these lines of sights, but holding strong angles and defending peculiarly is the root of this amazing game. You can ask anyone if they prefer getting 360 flicked in the head for shooting one bullet from an open angle or if they prefer dying of a tactical play like getting flashed or cornered by a lion, etc. 7- Don't try to impress the playerbase of what you're capable of doing to the map by changing it so much, we want map buffs, not complete reworks.
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  14. #14
    Originally Posted by DrFluffykins Go to original post
    I think i speak for the community when i say that the elements that make a rework good is simply making minor tweaks. If you look at clubhouse, the very first rework; it was such a slight tweak, just adding a little connector here, but thats the secret. LITTLE changes not like oregon where all the lines of sight have been shifted differently. The part that players love about old maps is that the term "balance" isn't shown so evidently and there's clear "power spots" in the gameplay. An example of this is like kanal. On the rework all of the furniture and misc objects have been placed for perfect crouch height or standing height and nothing obstructing that. In older maps, there was a variety to the height of different pieces of furniture and objects around the map where sometimes you had a small line of sight, or a larger one. Additionally, if you look back at kafe rework. People LOVED this rework because it was essentially the same exact map but everso slightly tweaked. Kitchen was the only part really overhauled and obviously main entrance consequentially, but the middle floor was left unchanged and top floot just got a minor buff (the addition to the new balconies was amazing). I really want to emphasize the fact that reworks shouldnt be large changes but small tweaks. Take for example the hatch on old oregon. It was a very powerful tool to the attacking team once a plant went down, but thats INTEGRAL to what the true meaning of TACTICAL shooter means. Being tactical means taking control of a key part of the map and utilizing something natural to swing the round in your favour. What is done now in reworks is that all these "key" and powerful map points are removed or are degraded to the point of near uselessness (exactly like the hatch on oregon). Let me address favela. Favela is a map that many casual players ADORE because of how amazing it looks, players are scared to see it rework because of the track record of old reworks like oregon and hereford. The main problem for favela is the fact of too many destructable walls (which is great for its uniqueness and should STAY but it doesnt fit so well in the current meta) and the packaging room site site. A good solution to fix favela is simply by adding a connecting point from the top of south stairs and connect it to the door of packaging room and ALSO making the north stairs go towards east only for the final staircase and finally make the north facing wall indestructible. Finally the Football bedroom/office site should be switched to bedroom/apartment(without the kitchen part) and make part of the east wall indestructible (only the part connected to the site). Other than that, keep the map the EXACT same, and i mean exactly (same textures, colours, spawns, everything, it's what makes people happy). When it comes to fortress, the map in my opinion is just too bland colour-wise so an art overhaul would be required. Some walls of sites should become indestructible to make it easier for defenders staying on site and the main stairs should be more open to cover them from the top. There is probably more needed for fortress though. Moral of the story though, to be liked a rework needs to do this; 1- Slightly buff an unviable bomb site to be better and making the least amount of change layout-wise to that site. 2- Do NOT put metal shutters on windows a lot (like what was done on new chalet, *gag*), leave em open, it makes the map look not only bad but unrealistic. 3- Don't overhaul textures and colors on that map, it ruins the aesthetic of the base map (like what was done on oregon, house, hereford, kanal). 3- Don't touch sites that are meta and considered strong, instead only buff bad sites, this way a game on a certain map isnt always played the EXACT same way every time. 4- Leave these "power spots" alone (Ex: Old oregon main hatch and attic long window, Old chalet kitchen window and array of windows of main stairs, etc.) these "power spots" are what make the map unique and fun to play around with. 5- Leave people have their variable furniture (ex: bartlett; all the furniture is mostly of different heights and positions, making the map seem more natural). 6- Stop focusing on line of sights and 2 way angles being the key of everything, let the map seem NATURAL (by this i mean do what was done for every map until blood orchid). The maps afterwards so clearly focus on these lines of sights, but holding strong angles and defending peculiarly is the root of this amazing game. You can ask anyone if they prefer getting 360 flicked in the head for shooting one bullet from an open angle or if they prefer dying of a tactical play like getting flashed or cornered by a lion, etc. 7- Don't try to impress the playerbase of what you're capable of doing to the map by changing it so much, we want map buffs, not complete reworks.
    Oregon was one of the best reworks ever btw. It still had the stuff that worked (top floor, tower, lobby area etc. ) but reworked some points where it was too linear which was the main weakness of the map. The things that changed really were attic, small tower and the addition of freezer, pillar and the hallway leading from tower to kitchen.
    To your points on reworks in general:
    1. Yes unviable bombsites need to be buffed.
    2. Thats the point of reworks its rebalancing so attackers dont control 90% of a bombsite from outside. Which was the case with 2 of the sites on chalet.
    3. The maps feel a lot cleaner and less cluttered so I like it that way.
    4. Power spots yes but they should not be undefeatable like the hatch on oregon was. There are still power spots on the new oregeon btw.: Pillar for example controls the blue door, tower stairs, the freezer door and the meeting hatch drop. The kids window cuts off white stairs rotation, white stairs kids door and kids-attic rotation.
    5. I dont know what you mean those are still there.
    6. Again not really sure what you mean. The new maps still allow you to use your gadgets effectively.
    7. Yeah I agree but I think ubi learned their lesson from Hereford that more isnt always better. The maps afterwards just focussed on the nessecary stuff.
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  15. #15
    N3mB0t's Avatar Senior Member
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    all maps that were reworked aparently needed rework as per what the community as a whole asked for.

    when they saw the reworks they all cheered in awe , some even got on their knees and cryed .

    after playing them and the novelty weared off suddenly the rework was crap and UBi was crap for doing the rework.

    now the community is asking for more reworks WHERE needed!!


    if i was UBI i would be very very confused ...

    not really but you know what i mean.
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  16. #16
    Originally Posted by PES.Captain Go to original post
    Oregon was one of the best reworks ever btw. It still had the stuff that worked (top floor, tower, lobby area etc. ) but reworked some points where it was too linear which was the main weakness of the map. The things that changed really were attic, small tower and the addition of freezer, pillar and the hallway leading from tower to kitchen.
    To your points on reworks in general:
    1. Yes unviable bombsites need to be buffed.
    2. Thats the point of reworks its rebalancing so attackers dont control 90% of a bombsite from outside. Which was the case with 2 of the sites on chalet.
    3. The maps feel a lot cleaner and less cluttered so I like it that way.
    4. Power spots yes but they should not be undefeatable like the hatch on oregon was. There are still power spots on the new oregeon btw.: Pillar for example controls the blue door, tower stairs, the freezer door and the meeting hatch drop. The kids window cuts off white stairs rotation, white stairs kids door and kids-attic rotation.
    5. I dont know what you mean those are still there.
    6. Again not really sure what you mean. The new maps still allow you to use your gadgets effectively.
    7. Yeah I agree but I think ubi learned their lesson from Hereford that more isnt always better. The maps afterwards just focussed on the nessecary stuff.
    Oregon was definitely not the best rework. The main window as it stands is way too powerful when before it was in a more balanced state. The location of the bunk bed by the window was perfect for getting cover from that window and also denying a window plant. The oregon hatch, while powerful, was part of why it was so important to take control of it. Remember that hatch was a double edged sword as it was open from meeting, main stairs, west hall, so taking control of it again was fairly easy.. Yes i agree that it shouldnt have had a LOS on basement hallway but the rest was very well balanced besides that, freezer being an unnecessary addition. On the chalet rework, the garage site was very balanced in my opinion and the addition of the new blue hall was welcome, i don't know why they completely changed the layout of wine cellar though. As it stands, it seems empty and stale with a HUGE wall in the way so attackers can easily plant there without getting contested. It was a good change that master balcony was removed, and that was a good change but thats where the positives end. The switch of staircases was unnecessary as well as the removal of the kitchen window and stairs windows and the shuttering of 80% of all the windows on the map. Remember, this is supposed to be a tactical REALISTIC shooter. Being cluttered is part of the game and the way new chalet is makes it feel like a cs:go or overwatch map thats super minimalistic. You cant deny the fact that reworked maps are banned a hell of a lot more than unreworked maps. The old maps focused on making the building seem normal, realistic, not like the super plain paintball arena that is new oregon and chalet. It's super obvious the way that some line of sights were cut on purpose and it just ruins the aesthetic entirely. For these reworks, they are solely focused on cod-like mechanics. Meaning that if you get shot, the other person has ample opportunity to turn around and return fire instead of utilizing tactics to their advantage and flashing out an area known to have angles being held. You can't have everything perfectly balanced. It's okay for something to be more powerful that others as is the case with the old oregon, coastline, old chalet, etc. There is no need for everything to be layed out so precisely that it cuts off a certain line of sight so perfectly.
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  17. #17
    Slyrr7's Avatar Senior Member
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    Unfortunately, most of the playing community did NOT ask for the reworks. We were fine with the maps as they were originally constituted. Therein lies the divide. The crux of it all seems to be the "Defuse Bomb" game type. Somehow, that game type seems to have become the choice of the "Ranked" and the "Pro" players. They eschew "Secure Area" and "Hostage".

    As such, there is a swath of players who think that any, and ALL maps, should be engineered and set up ONLY to be perfectly 'balanced' for the Defuse Bomb game type. They want the halls, ramps, destructible surfaces, indestructible surfaces, even the lighting and height of the furniture, to be perfectly micro-managed, shaped and flaked so that there are two perfectly balanced bomb sites that can be both defended, and attacked, with the exact same strategies.

    But then there is the OTHER playing community - who doesn't play Defuse Bomb, or Ranked, or Pro league. And a map that may be set up perfect for Defuse Bomb and 'pro' players will completely and utterly stink for Hostage and Casual players. Now - with OTHER games, they aren't so stupid as to think that every map can be used for every game type. For example - Team Fortress 2 does NOT allow the "Control Point" game type to be played in a map like 2Fort. The Control Point game type has its own maps. They were made especially for Control Point. Same with CTF. And Payload. They did NOT try to take all the CTF players and force them to play CTF in a map that was made and built and balanced for the PAYLOAD game type. That would be stupid.

    But UBI doesn't seem to understand this. They have 3 game types in Siege, and they're trying to jam ALL of those game types into the SAME maps. Except now, they have given up on Hostage, and Secure Area - and they seem to be trying to force all the Hostage players, and Secure Area players, to play their matches in maps that were only set up to only be "Defuse Bomb" maps. It is against all reason and common sense, but that's how UBI is doing things at the moment.

    Ideally, since UBI created this irreconcilable division among their own customers - they should be compelled to resolve it. There are two ways they could do this:

    1) Don't rework the maps - rework the Multiplayer settings.

    Give everyone what they want. Keep the reworked maps, but bring back the original maps too. Change the Multiplayer settings, so players can turn each map ON or OFF in Multiplayer to their personal preference. If some players don't want to play in the reworked maps, they can turn them OFF so they'll never have to see them again. Conversely, if the 'pro' and the 'ranked' players don't like the original maps? They can turn those off too. Problem solved. Everybody gets what they want. And again I say - hard drive space is not an issue. We have plenty of it. Stop trying to use that as an excuse.

    2) Set the "Reworked" maps to ONLY do Defuse Bomb.

    Since UBI only wants to rework the maps so that the Defuse Bomb players can enjoy them? So be it. Make it official. Set it so that Hostage and Secure area are disabled in these maps. If they want to make maps only for the Defuse Bomb game type? Then only allow them to be used for that game type. In all other games, CTF maps only work for CTF matches. Payload maps only work for Payload Matches. Control Point maps only work for Control Point matches. Defuse Bomb constructed maps should be the same. They should only work for Defuse Bomb matches. Just bring back the ORIGINAL maps as well, so that Hostage players, and Secure Area players, can have their own maps for their own game types. Again - stop telling us we don't have enough space on our hard drives for both versions of the maps. We do.

    Sure, the playing community will be divided. But it's far too late for that. UBI are the ones who divided us. They should 'rework' the multiplayer settings and make it official. Let the Defuse Bomb players have their own maps for their own game type. Leave the original maps to those of us who play Casual, Hostage, and Secure Area. We'll do just fine without each other.
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  18. #18
    Originally Posted by Slyrr7 Go to original post
    They want the halls, ramps, destructible surfaces, indestructible surfaces, even the lighting and height of the furniture, to be perfectly micro-managed, shaped and flaked so that there are two perfectly balanced bomb sites that can be both defended, and attacked, with the exact same strategies.
    This quote sums up PERFECTLY the message i was trying to convey with my furniture variability point and the destructive 2 way angle rework philosophy that is destroying the game. I agree with all of your points on bringing back the old maps. All in all, you said it perfectly, although i wrote this whole new "philosophy" to rework maps because its evident that that's the direction ubisoft is going to go forward with for a LOOOOONG time as we've so clearly seen in the past 2 years. Im trying to make the best of a bad situation and,yes, IDEALLY NONE of the maps should be reworked, instead slightly changed and buffed like consulate and clubhouse.
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  19. #19
    I also made a reddit post on the potential rework idea on favela https://www.reddit.com/r/Rainbow6/co...a_rework_idea/
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