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  1. #1
    Tyrjo's Avatar Senior Member
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    New VIKING hero: Meet The Einherjar

    A new viking concept warrior idea I've been working on since the Smiður.

    Etymology: In Norse mythology, the einherjar (Old Norse literally "army of one", "those who fight alone"[1][2]) are those who have died in battle and are brought to Valhalla by valkyries. In Valhalla, the einherjar eat their fill of the nightly-resurrecting beast Sæhrímnir, and valkyries bring them mead (which comes from the udder of the goat Heiðrún). The einherjar prepare daily for the events of Ragnarök, when they will advance for an immense battle at the field of Vígríðr.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Einherjar



    Faction: Viking

    Personality: Both dead and alive on the same time. Filled with a zealous duty which makes him stop at nothing. Absolutely despise the Jörmungandr which he sees a traitors of the people that must be hunted down. He's blinded in such a way that he thinks that everyone but the Einherjer serves the Jörmungandr. Has a whispering way of speaking in the same manner as Hitokiro. Very edgy.

    Physique: Slender fitness type.

    Weapons: Axe and shield.

    Gender: Male

    Type: Hybrid

    Hit Points: 125

    Stamina: 140

    CHAINS

    Lights are enhanced (e).

    L(e)L (e)

    HL(e)

    L(e)H

    HH

    HLH

    HHH

    Zone attack
    A 700ms bash which can be hard feinted to provoke reactions. Chains on hit into light startup which is guaranteed if the bash hits, or a heavy attack which is not guaranteed.

    HERO SPECIFIC

    Full Block Stance:
    In Odin's Service (Audio: Fyrir Óðinn! - For Odin!)
    A full block stance which has different options out of it. L or regular H (which can be feinted). It's not possible to CGB in Full Block as usual.

    Bash out of In Odin's Service:
    Odin's will (Audio: Óðinns vilja! - Odin wills it!)
    On a successful full block there is a guaranteed stun component bash on the GB input. Odin's will guarantees a chain starter light attack after the stun has been applied.

    Odin's will can also be accessed as a third chain optional 500ms bash on the GB input after a LL LH HL or HH chain has landed on the opponent. Any attack made if this bash lands ends the chain.

    Heavy after Odin's Will:
    Vigridrs Glory (Audio: Til Vígríðr! - Towards Vígríðr!)
    It's also possible to perform a top UB heavy after the Odin's will stun, which can be hard feinted or soft-feinted into guard-break. This attack has hyper armor. This attack is not guaranteed.

    Soft feint into Full Block Stance:
    The wit of Huginn (Audio: Aaah! (weasing))
    A heavy attack soft feint into the Full Block stance.

    Dodge attack:
    The wit of Muninn (Audio: Haaa! (weasing))
    A side dodge which chains into Odins will. Has severe GB vulnerability if missed. Recovery can be cancelled by going into Full Block.

    Forward dodge jump attack:
    Einherjers Pursuit (Audio:
    A forward dodge jump top heavy attack with dodge tracking. Can be soft feinted into the Full Block Stance.


    EXECUTIONS


    Coming soon...


    BATTLE SHOUTS (My own fantasy)

    This is a new type of audio content which can be added to your emotes or executions. The game now also has an option to show in game text translations of the icelandic, japanese and latin phrases.

    Óðinns vilja! - Odin wills it!

    Fyrir Óðinn! - For Odin!

    Til Vígríðr - Towards Vígríðr!

    Beiðni minni er lokið - My wait is over!

    Ég hef beðið svo lengi eftir þessu - I have so longed for this!


    If you have any cool ideas you think would fit the concept. Please post!
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  2. #2
    Pretty interesting concept. My only worry at least from an initial look is the character looking similar to Warlord via the shield. IIRC the devs stated they opted to not give Centurion a proper shield because they didn't want him and Warlord looking similar. I personally don't mind. But it is something I thought i'd note. (vikings in general look far too similar with their armor options. Wish they'd diversify them more.)


    So here are my questions:

    -The light and the heavy out of his full block. Are these finishers? Mid combo hits? or chain starters?

    -Is there a follow up to his zone bash? And is the follow up a finisher? Can you chain off of the bash even on whiff? (ala BP zone)

    -Is the light from Odin's will a finisher?

    -The unblockable after Odins will. Is it also a finisher? You note it is soft feintable into GB. Is it hard feintable as well?

    -Is the armor on the UB heavy immediate or is it only available after the soft feint window?
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  3. #3
    Tyrjo's Avatar Senior Member
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    Thanks for your replies. Since he has a shield he will resemble Warlord with his looks and the game play will revolve around the shield. That's why I tried to change the way the shield works a bit. The reason I wanted to make a hero with an axe and shield is because it was the most common weaponry for viking warriors as swords were expensive and not something a common Norseman always would be able to afford. That's why I think it would be very fitting for the Einherjar to have this type of equipment.

    Similarites
    Enhanced lights
    Full Block Stance

    Differences
    No hyperarmor on normal heavies
    No fast low recovery bash from neutral
    Can feint the zone attack
    No dodge tracking on the zone attack
    Zone is an UB
    No parry counter
    Lower HP
    Larger stamina pool
    Longer Chains
    Unblockable top heavy accessed from a successful full block with a soft feint.
    Soft feint heavy into Full Block
    Can feint the heavy attack out of Full Block
    A dodge attack

    Very good questions Raime!

    Originally Posted by Knight_Raime Go to original post
    So here are my questions:

    -The light and the heavy out of his full block. Are these finishers? Mid combo hits? or chain starters?

    I think they should be regular chain starters if you haven't blocked anything.

    -Is there a follow up to his zone bash? And is the follow up a finisher? Can you chain off of the bash even on whiff? (ala BP zone)

    Yes, there is a follow up chain finisher light or heavy which you can feint. The idea is just that it's there to mess with opponents who react instantly on orange, hence the feint.

    -Is the light from Odin's will a finisher?

    If Odins will come from a successful Full Block or from The wit of Muninn it's a chain starter. If it comes as a third chain option it's a finisher.

    -The unblockable after Odins will. Is it also a finisher? You note it is soft feintable into GB. Is it hard feintable as well?

    The Unblockable heavy is always a chain finisher. Should be hard feintable too I guess.

    -Is the armor on the UB heavy immediate or is it only available after the soft feint window?

    Haven't really thought about timings that much to be honest. Maybe it's more balanced to have it activate after the soft feint window?
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  4. #4
    "I think they should be regular chain starters if you haven't blocked anything."

    So they double as both a full block specific counter but also attacks out of it normally. Interesting. Do either of the moves have properties (enhanced, undodgable, etc) after doing a block?
    And if they come from blocking Are they mid chain attacks or finishers?


    "Yes, there is a follow up chain finisher light or heavy which you can feint. The idea is just that it's there to mess with opponents who react instantly on orange, hence the feint."

    So basically BP's zone but with the addition of being able to feint it. That's quite interesting. Though you usually try to have something to compliment the unblockable. Like how BP can threaten with an undodgable or his bullwark slash at the same time mid combo. In this setup it seems like you'd go for the bash blind and then try to bait with either the unblockable heavy or the zone. Without knowing the stun duration or heavy UB timing I can't know how effective that mix up would be. Just noting that it's the only one I can think of atm.


    "If Odins will come from a successful Full Block or from The wit of Muninn it's a chain starter. If it comes as a third chain option it's a finisher."

    Not much to say here. Just glad for the clarification. With the given kit flow you've explained so far this makes the most sense.


    "Haven't really thought about timings that much to be honest. Maybe it's more balanced to have it activate after the soft feint window?"

    That would make it in line with nearly every other HA timing that currently exists. So that would be best. Ubi has been trying to mostly standardize HA timing so I was just curious if yours was going to align with theirs or if it was going to be one of the few exceptions.



    I'm afraid I lack creativity when it comes to stuff like this but I figure i'd include it since you did ask for suggestions. How would you feel if he could dodge into full block via canceling his dodge/dodge recovery? This is actually my second biggest ask for an inclusion to Warlord's kit. But considering yours plays around with dodges already it might be more fitting here. And I would like to ask why your dodge attack doesn't also come from forward dodge.
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  5. #5
    Tyrjo's Avatar Senior Member
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    Originally Posted by Knight_Raime Go to original post
    "I think they should be regular chain starters if you haven't blocked anything."

    So they double as both a full block specific counter but also attacks out of it normally. Interesting. Do either of the moves have properties (enhanced, undodgable, etc) after doing a block?
    No, they are regular attacks out of full guard like f.e. Warlords. The Einherjer's Full Block Stance need a block in order to be able to flow to the Odin's Will stun. Think of it like Warlords Headbutt, but you need to block in Full Block in order to do it. Then you can either confirm the light poke or chain into a unblockable top heavy which can be soft feinted, feinted or let go to finish the chain.

    Originally Posted by Knight_Raime Go to original post
    And if they come from blocking Are they mid chain attacks or finishers?
    Regular attacks from Full Block without a block should be like regular starters. I think the attack after Odin's Will also should be regular starter, otherwise you'd be at the end of the chain too fast and can go for a Odin's Will end chain bash again. It would probably feel like the old Centurion.

    Originally Posted by Knight_Raime Go to original post
    "Yes, there is a follow up chain finisher light or heavy which you can feint. The idea is just that it's there to mess with opponents who react instantly on orange, hence the feint."

    So basically BP's zone but with the addition of being able to feint it. That's quite interesting. Though you usually try to have something to compliment the unblockable. Like how BP can threaten with an undodgable or his bullwark slash at the same time mid combo. In this setup it seems like you'd go for the bash blind and then try to bait with either the unblockable heavy or the zone. Without knowing the stun duration or heavy UB timing I can't know how effective that mix up would be. Just noting that it's the only one I can think of atm.
    Yeah, that's true. Come to think of it, he doesn't have a jump attack. Maybe a jump attack that tracks dodging and rolling would be a fit?

    Originally Posted by Knight_Raime Go to original post
    "If Odins will come from a successful Full Block or from The wit of Muninn it's a chain starter. If it comes as a third chain option it's a finisher."

    Not much to say here. Just glad for the clarification. With the given kit flow you've explained so far this makes the most sense.
    Originally Posted by Knight_Raime Go to original post
    "Haven't really thought about timings that much to be honest. Maybe it's more balanced to have it activate after the soft feint window?"

    That would make it in line with nearly every other HA timing that currently exists. So that would be best. Ubi has been trying to mostly standardize HA timing so I was just curious if yours was going to align with theirs or if it was going to be one of the few exceptions.
    Originally Posted by Knight_Raime Go to original post
    I'm afraid I lack creativity when it comes to stuff like this but I figure i'd include it since you did ask for suggestions. How would you feel if he could dodge into full block via canceling his dodge/dodge recovery? This is actually my second biggest ask for an inclusion to Warlord's kit. But considering yours plays around with dodges already it might be more fitting here. And I would like to ask why your dodge attack doesn't also come from forward dodge.
    I wanted it to be an evasive move you did to avoid something. And didn't want him to be Warlord 2.0. A forward dodge attack that stuns and confirms damage, then chains further or goes into an unblockable heavy. To me that sounds too much cancer.

    Why would you want to cancel the GB vulnerability of a side dodge with something that's GB vulnerable? To that makes no sense, but I may be missing your point.
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  6. #6
    -"No, they are regular attacks out of full guard like f.e. Warlords. The Einherjer's Full Block Stance need a block in order to be able to flow to the Odin's Will stun. Think of it like Warlords Headbutt, but you need to block in Full Block in order to do it. Then you can either confirm the light poke or chain into a unblockable top heavy which can be soft feinted, feinted or let go to finish the chain."

    Well you know WL better than I. But I could've swarn the light after block on WL is unblockable and the heavy after block is undodgable. But good to know.



    -"Yeah, that's true. Come to think of it, he doesn't have a jump attack. Maybe a jump attack that tracks dodging and rolling would be a fit?"

    You could do that yeah. Most characters usually have a dash forward attack so that would fit.


    -"I wanted it to be an evasive move you did to avoid something. And didn't want him to be Warlord 2.0. A forward dodge attack that stuns and confirms damage, then chains further or goes into an unblockable heavy. To me that sounds too much cancer.
    Why would you want to cancel the GB vulnerability of a side dodge with something that's GB vulnerable? To that makes no sense, but I may be missing your point."

    Fair enough. Though I didn't know your side dodge attack stunned. I still think your character could benefit from having something on forward dodge besides a chase tool. Warmonger can cancel her dash forward recovery with a light. Not really a thing for team modes but it's nice as a soft read in single pick scenarios.

    The idea of the dodge into full block is mainly to let you avoid a specific attack when being ganked or to gain some spacing distance. But be able to full block an external attack. Some people also try to dodge attack a dodge attack. So it would be semi bait there. More to the point though it seems like you're using his FB as a way to start offense. So I feel like being able to be a tad bit more defensive on a dodge that leads into combos might be neat. (it's not like you can't dodge>FB cancel recovery>light to beat out a GB attempt) d:

    Though I will admit part of the reason I wanted this on warlord was because I wanted to incorperate his crashing charge mix ups into locked on state. So it might not be as good of a thing on it's own.
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  7. #7
    Tyrjo's Avatar Senior Member
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    Originally Posted by Knight_Raime Go to original post
    -"No, they are regular attacks out of full guard like f.e. Warlords. The Einherjer's Full Block Stance need a block in order to be able to flow to the Odin's Will stun. Think of it like Warlords Headbutt, but you need to block in Full Block in order to do it. Then you can either confirm the light poke or chain into a unblockable top heavy which can be soft feinted, feinted or let go to finish the chain."

    Well you know WL better than I. But I could've swarn the light after block on WL is unblockable and the heavy after block is undodgable. But good to know.
    The light from a successful WL FB are unblockable, and the heavy has tracking. But the only follow up Einherjer has from a successful Full Block is the Odins Will stun and the corresponding options after that. If you didn't block something, they are just regular chain starters which come out of the FB.

    Originally Posted by Knight_Raime Go to original post
    -"Yeah, that's true. Come to think of it, he doesn't have a jump attack. Maybe a jump attack that tracks dodging and rolling would be a fit?"

    You could do that yeah. Most characters usually have a dash forward attack so that would fit.
    Then its settled.

    Originally Posted by Knight_Raime Go to original post
    -"I wanted it to be an evasive move you did to avoid something. And didn't want him to be Warlord 2.0. A forward dodge attack that stuns and confirms damage, then chains further or goes into an unblockable heavy. To me that sounds too much cancer.
    Why would you want to cancel the GB vulnerability of a side dodge with something that's GB vulnerable? To that makes no sense, but I may be missing your point."

    Fair enough. Though I didn't know your side dodge attack stunned. I still think your character could benefit from having something on forward dodge besides a chase tool. Warmonger can cancel her dash forward recovery with a light. Not really a thing for team modes but it's nice as a soft read in single pick scenarios.

    The idea of the dodge into full block is mainly to let you avoid a specific attack when being ganked or to gain some spacing distance. But be able to full block an external attack. Some people also try to dodge attack a dodge attack. So it would be semi bait there. More to the point though it seems like you're using his FB as a way to start offense. So I feel like being able to be a tad bit more defensive on a dodge that leads into combos might be neat. (it's not like you can't dodge>FB cancel recovery>light to beat out a GB attempt) d:

    Though I will admit part of the reason I wanted this on warlord was because I wanted to incorperate his crashing charge mix ups into locked on state. So it might not be as good of a thing on it's own.
    I suppose it wouldn't hurt to be able to cancel the dodge recovery with a FB the way you put it. Situational and sometimes useful.
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  8. #8
    A cool concept. I don't see any problem with the hero looking and acting like warlord since the new year in for honor is a year of recycling. They recycled how many characters to make the warmonger? Just give the new hero op feats so casuals buy it day one and we're ready to go.
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