Senior Member
I'm a touch confused by the inconsistent rationale of your list here. You don't want western or futuristic settings because of RDR and cyberpunk, yet you are all in for post apocalyptic and modern military settings, of which there are 100x more examples of than the settings you don't want? Also, they did a post-apocalypse setting with New Dawn already and it was one of the worst FC games yet.Originally Posted by ApostolizApo Go to original post
My vote for a spin-off / primal-esque title was a Viking setting, but with AC: Valhalla utilizing that scenario it's extremely unlikely.
Member
Agreed. Especially the exotic settings is for me one of the main aspects of Far Cry. For the SpinOffs the term "exotic" could be replaced with "creative" ... and maybe "bold" (esp. Blood Dragon, but also PrimalOriginally Posted by ApostolizApo Go to original post)
For the Main Games it is more like holidays: (Afrika, Rook Island, Kyrat, Hope County). But these settings doesn't only contain sterotypic bright holiday places (like: Afrika: waterhole with wildlife; Rook Island: tropical beaches with waterfalls in the back; Kyrat: wonderful mountain sights, Hope County: national park like places with the possibility to fish). The setting also include more ... messy, rumpled places and things (e. g. the trash in the water of Mosate Selao (Bowa Seko, Afrika, Far Cry 2), the falling-apart-cars in Far Cry 3 etc.); or in other words more (stereotypic) realistic places and things.
Ironically these "dirty" things make the setting feel even more beautiful - or at least intense. You have more the feeling that you are realy there. Much more, than if everything was 100% cheesy.
Far Cry 6 seems to be no exception - luckily.
I realy (and still) like the idea of a Horror/ "Van Helsing"-Setting Far Cry. Similar to the other two "general settings" (Fantasy and SciFi) it realy depends which details and aspects would be used in a Horror Setting.Originally Posted by ApostolizApo Go to original post
Horror could be more mixed with SciFi, Fantasy or Adventure. Adeventure (which we already have as an aspect in Far Cry (esp. Far Cry 3 and 4)) is a bit excluded.
So the quesiton is: more "Van Helsing"-style (includes: Fantasy as an aspect) or more a futuristic (maybe post-apocalyptic) SciFi-based style?!
Or even both*?
Fittingly the idea of GameGuru2018: mixing a (Dark Post-Apocalyptic) Western and a Demonic Scenario, might come realy close to "both*".
"Van Helsing" fits rough into the Western Times - sure, the location of Western and "Van Helsing" is a different. But sure ... the "Van Helsing"-Scenario fits not to bad to a (dark) Western Scenario: guns and rifles, horses, the (stereotype) manner of people. Adding more SciFi by adding the post-apocalyptic aspect. Plus the demonic apsects of course, which could be counted to a "Van Helsing" and a more futuristic Horror setting. Very cool!
The argument that Far Cry New Dawn already had an post-apocalyptic setting is given, but it follows the story of Far Cry 5 (direct sequel). In comparison to the here discussed scenario, it is to close to reality.
The idea of a post-apocalyptic, western, [demonic or horror] scenario is much much deeper rooted in the creative field.
(Remember: Far Cry 3 Blood Dragon has also a post-apocalyptic scenario ... and Far Cry New Dawn is something totally different to it.This idea is totally different to Far Cry New Dawn.
Tried to thinking ahead this setting/scenario/idea ... ... Wow, I have a lot of good ideas that where never seen before. A few of these might work very good as a SpinOff. Maybe you feel same?
(If I will find some more time, I might post a few specific approaches and ideas which could be included in this scenario.)
~
Sry to say it like that, but GameGuru18 is a realy crazy user!; but - hell - he has realy, realy good and creative ideas.
(And he is bold enough to just post them ... which makes him realy fitting to Far Cry)
I can already imagine it figuratively:Originally Posted by GameGuru2018 Go to original postIt can be two in one.
Dark Post-Apocalyptic ( or not post-apocalyptic) Western + Demonic Scenario.
Just in every "western song" ...... there are words about Hell, Devil, Demon, Ghost ....
Why not to show it in the game?
So many types of enemies!
Diversity!
And colors....
Ubisoft games today look like cartoons, with bright and vivid colors.
Even the last Far Cry (New Dawn) couldn't escape that fate.
Very predictable.
Some diversity in colors won't be bad.
Dark colors + Fire (bright).
Beasts from Hell, The Devil, different Ghosts ....
Our world enemies + all that devilry. From another world.
For instance, some desparate cowboy, whose desire for revenge was so great that he was allowed to materialize in this world again, for a short time.
In exchange for something.
Or some villain, the Devil himself.
I like also to switch between the worlds in the game, something like it was in "Murdered: Soul Suspect" or "Wolfenstein (2009)"
So.....Dark (Post-Apocalyptic or not Post-Apocalyptic) Western + Demonic Scenario can merge together easily!
Dark colors + Fire...
Real enemies + Hell creatures,
Ghosts....
Good story and Villain + Gameplay....
Mixed with viscous music ....
>>
Far Cry "Life and Death": Main Menu, "The Kill Devil Hills - Boneyard Rider (- Legendado)" plays in the background. The colors dark, serious: grey, black, a bit beige. Small red and orange glowing particles are visible on the ground. Barely visible craters in the shadows ... Looks like a fight that doesn't have to be too long ago. Only recognizable at second glance.
The picture shows the landscape: A canyon: Burned, dry, sandy, smoky. A rider on a horse is visible in the picture, enveloped in his coat, a heavy-calibered rifle on his back and two shiny silver revolvers in his weapon belt. On the floor a few bones - human bones? In the backgound a destroyed futuristic building. And in the sky a few demonic looking creatures. Circling around our rider?
New Game <=
Options
Store
Ubisoft Club
Trophies and Guide [collectables and datas/turorials]
So...
Big +1 on this idea, I realy like it!
Member
Back to the (post-apocalyptic) Western Demonic Setting for a Far Cry SpinOff.
Or short PAWDS / PAWD-Setting
Had indeed a bit time to think it a little further:
Environment and visual world:
Colors, as GameGuru2018 also suggested: Dark and mostly colorless tones. Gray, black, beige, maybe a bit brown and orange for sand and rocks. Fires and explosions should be nearly the only real colorful things in the worl: Red, Yellow, Orange … a bit more smoke after an explosion on the ground, that decays after a few seconds. This, to give the whole setting a smoky touch. [„The world is burned already“].
The music suggestions and style of GameGuru2018 fit into this idea: Mostly dark and viscous Western Music
The environment itself could be a mix of three main apsects. Each aspect could merge into the other ones (with or without) visible transition:
1. „Classic“ Western - but still customized – Deserts. Means: rock desert, stone desert, sand desert. Including a few dry plants and cactuses (pattern: cactuses of the Sonoran Desert, Arizona and California, USA // like the Saguaro – the symbol for Western Deserts). Other objects could be „classics“ like stones, rocks, …; but also things like geysers and more „vulcanic“ things – which could be also counted to the next main aspect:
2. Demonic/Hell Environment. Here could be used also a lot of desert stuff, to merge it with the „Classic“ Western environment. Including customized things like: grey or brown cacutses.
But also objects like: active tar pits, lava lakes, sulfer springs and other vulcanic things could be used. Adding some more hellish objects like: demonic statues, bones of demons or humans, forged iron fences, „ghost-“ or „soul-fires“ (blue or black flames), old cages, traces of fights, craters (vulcanic and craters of impcats) or even some (dark) ghostly elements.
A few variety could be given by adding other hellish ecosystems. Here could be used: „dead/burned – or demonic – forests [which fit to the 3rd aspect – Post-Apocalyptic – aswell]; demonic swamps, lake districs with tar pits or acidic water, montane regions (vulcanic and/or black rocks with demonic decoration [... goes slowly into the direction of a vampire-style, which fit's agaon to "Van Helsing"]); and maybe also cold places with ice and snow. But without to much using of the color: white.
[„A mix of heat and coldness – could be also used for the day-and-night-cycle“].
3. Post-Apocalyptic places are part of the deserts, means: a few traces of the old (futuristic) civilizations could be seen. [„Nothing with flashing lights or beeping computers! Everything is burned and rusted metal ... or ashes. Dark and gray colors … everything was thousands of years ago“]
Radioactive fields (with grey plants and other effects), salt lakes, big craters, a few rudimentary ruins (walls, paving tiles) could be part of it. Very, very rare: Traces of old (futuristic) cities or industrail areas.
The sky could be cloudy the most times, but it should not be dark/night all the time in the world. Falling fireballs (lava bombs of a vulcan or meteorites could be used as design element [also to give light, if they are big and slow enaugh], or also as … „dangerous natural/weather phenomenon"). In deserts the sun could shine, but as an aggressive light that tries to burn everything. Maybe it could be red and/or much bigger than it is normal. [„Red giant also means: the end for the world could be very near.“]
Sand storms (similar to Assassin's Creed Origins) could be a good addition.
Day-and-night-cycle: Why not, but could be customized in creative ways which would fit to the rest of this scanario. Have nothing sepcific at the moment.
Because of the demonic theme the map could contain a lot of places under ground (demonic caves, hellish caves, ghostly caves). Mixed with Western Elements (like: gold mines and caves) the environment could also merge into other styles. Maybe it would be useful to add a below ground map (similar to Assassin's Creed Unity: Dead Kings DLC-Map). But this doesn't mean the below ground environment has to be connected or as big as the parts above ground. ["Wouldn't it be funny to use some mining wagons as a small fast travel system?!
By working with demonic (/horror) or ghostly elements, it was never wrong to add some dark places under ground. In this environment there are a lot of possibilities for a alternating designs,.
Weapons:
As said in a few posts before: Weapons are not my subject, especially if we talk: models or details.
But – in general – I would suggest a mix of classic Western Weapons (Revolvers, Rifles, Shotguns) with the aspect, that they had to become stronger. After all they need to be powerful enough to kill demonic creatures. Maybe a few very heavy-calibered muzzleloaders with an unique style could be used.
Maybe (similar to the used swords in „The Witcher“ [series of games from CD Project RED]) different type of weaposn could be designed to fight different enemies.
„Classic designed weapons“: Hostile Humans
„Heavy-Calibered weapons“: Big Demonic Creatures, very big or dangerous ones could be used as minibosses and bosses.
„Special Anti-Ghost weapons“: Ghosts and other „astral“ entities. Maybe: Very expensive weapons with rare ammo which work similar to a shortcut, if the player don't want to sneak around ghostly creatures in a few missions.
Mixing the weapons design with a few „hellish“ elements would give them a interesting design/touch – like: Ghost Rider Rifles, Phantom Revolvers and similar. DIY-weapons are a no go in this scenario. We have had them very often now in different scanarios (no critizism), but in this world: there are no DIY-parts left. The weapons are made by high specialised and skilled gunsmiths: Humans or even other entities.
Futuristic weapons are also not existing; ... well ... after all the time. Also they wouldn't fit into the scenery. Maybe futuristic elements could be used by a gunsmith to make some unique weapons … but this wouldn't fit very well in the whole scenario at the moment.
Generally and in the meta-level the scanario should be based a bit on real old Westerns and a few horror movies. Mostly the behavior of the figures and characters. (e. g. a few lines of „The Good, the Bad and the Ugly“ – to pay tribute to this movie – would be great and fitting. Same as for other movies: „The village of the damned“ or even Italian-/Italo-/“Spagehtti“-Western [remember: Bud Spencer and Terence Hill Movies?
The list is very long and could also include [small/hidden] references to these movies and stories. A few could be very cool and surprisingly (in this dark world) funny.
Story and following a few Gameplay aspects:
Entery Scene (which also explains the world, the situation of the humans and introducing the protagonist) // Short Version:
>>
„You know the story - or not? The story how the world was born. The 13rd demon: Satanael, was banned from the angels and became Satan ... the Devil!. This was before things like time existed. And for more than 15.000 years the humans were free and were ablte to build a civilisation ... without demons and ghosts ... or other humans ,that tried to get the best parts of it.
But the angels started to arguing and fighting. The injustice and simultaneously the world as we know it were born, ... same as the humans fall. The fight of the angels made them weak and the world broke apart ... and Satanael rised again and blighted all of the angels.
The universe filled with his ether, he forcing the planets in their new orbits and forged the sun into one of his enslaved figments.
Now he sits in his fortress in the middle of this supercontinent; exploiting the weak and fearful – hunting the strong ones … or pay a few of them, to do hunt the other ones for him.“
Nores [the protagonist]: „C'mon old man: You tell me that the devil exists?! You think I am a damned child?! Everyone knows this fact. How could someone not?! The world is full of his statues, demons and man who work for him.
Iam not here to listen your bubbling. I am here for the Silver Coins. Markus said, you have a job fo me, don't you?“
The room is visible now:
A small Western styled wooden hut. An old man on a chair; Nores [the protagonist and playable character] standing in the middle of the room. In the corner sits a person, barely visible and wrapped in his coat. The face is not visible.
Now the weapped person (Markus) speaks with a rough voice: „He told me he has a well-paid job for you. Not more, not less. I saw the Silver Coins ... that's why we are here now.“
Nores: „I hope so, I am a headhunter, not a damned student, nor is this old, smelly fart a bookman.“
Old man: „I have a job. Indeed. Not far away from here, in the ruins of the old heaven-world, just behind the Canyon of Molten Lead. The ruins from the time the angels still existed.... a friend of mine tried to seek some thing … something important. He wants to prove, that ... that there was a time without demons, without the devil! And maybe … just maybe bring it back to ... to me! This world!“
Nores: „You say me, that I should go and rescue some other old man?! Good, but this is ghost rider territory. It won't be cheap. How many hours is the man gone?“
Old Man: „About three or four days ...“
Nores: „Three days? He is already dead then ... if the ghost rider did't got him, than some rabid hellhound or just a few drunken raiders who used him as human target.“
Old Man: „No one cares his life. But the things he found … I care the things he found. And I pay you 3000 Silver Coins if you bring me eveything he had with him to me.“
Nores: „What 3000?! Markus, give me a reason not to kill you both! It looks like I wasted my time. Now it looks like, I need to waste some lifes to calm down again ...“
Markus stands up. Now it is recognizable, that he has no real face. His head looks like it is made of smoke with a (cowboy-)hat, just a yellow eye is visible. ... or is he smoking?! [Thx for finding/posting that inspiring picture @GameGuru2018]
Markus: „Okay old man, fun is over! You said, you would pay us 8000 Silver Coins, and nothing less.“Originally Posted by GameGuru2018 Go to original post[...]
[...]
Old man: „Shut up, stupid ghost ...“
Nores pulls his revolver and aims on the head of the old man.
Old man: „I don't fear death. You you won't get a single coind if you kill me now.“
A shot hits the arm of the old man. He isn't hurt very bad, but drops a bag full of silver coins.
„Sure?!“, asked Nores.
„Okay, okay … there are like 6800 Silver Coins inside. Take 'em, and bring me the stuff of my friend. Deal?“
A few seconds pass.
„Deal.“, said Nores.
He grabs the bag with the Silver Coins and leaves the hut with his (ghostly) friend Markus.
„C'mon Markus, we need to hurry, ghost rides could be close and in the canyons ahead lure a few suprises ... Well, I would be surprised if not.“
Markus: "When we're talking about surprises: I have finally your new demon killer rifle with me. The gunsmith took months, but he has kept his word. Look ..."
Markus gives Nores a heavy-calibered rifle with an unique design.
Markus: "The man worked according to my plan, but built his experience with. An unique rifle! Caliber 0,535 - or 13,6mm - one muzzle and three bullets in a revolver drum. Not a slow muzzleloader. Kills a hellphant with a single bullet. But still fast enaugh to hit the winged beasts, too. Could be also loaded with shot rounds for swarmers."
Nores: "Not bad. You paid the man?"
Markus: "I revenged him and paid his widow."
Nores: "Well, you are not a lier as you said: unique."
[...]
Both bestride their horses and the game starts, while the protagonist/player rides with his ally towards the Canyon of Molten Lead.
<<
Rough: The story revolves (or twists) around the fact that the headhunter Nores figures out, that there truely was a world without demons. And by continuing to seek for proves and „artifacts“ – mostly for selling them, so for the Silver Coins – he becomes a real danger for the devil himself. More and more people start to belive in the fact, that the world can be devil free - just because it was devil free in the past aswell.
So he is drawn into the whole thing, which is not really interested in him.
The devil appears (in the best Far Cry tradition of the Main Games from times to times: An evil but interesting and maybe very persuasive villian) and wants to get the artifacts from the protagonist/player which he found (in the main missions). The devil offers Silver Coins and unique upgrades. If the player refuses to the devil, he suffers downgrades and pain. ( Some of the downgrades could be overcome by using more Silver Coins).
--> Carrot and stick that affect gameplay and make the game harder - regardless of the difficulty chosen.
The gostly friend of the protagonist „Markus“ also influences the protagonist to do deals with the devil.
Maybe the devil made him also a few promises.
The enemies are demonic creatures, more or less intelligent (depends on the creature) – heavy-caibered weapons are the best way to kill them.
Hostile ghosts and cursed entities – as same as some very dangerous demons – these are very strong and deadly. It is realy hard to kill them. Ghosts and similar can only be killed with special and very rare (and/or expensive) ammo and weapons. Bigger demons could be minibosses or bosses, as said already above.
It should realy feel like a deadly environment. But the player shouldn't die all the time. Means: Calling your horse or running away might save our protagonist many times. The enemies should not hunt the player all over the map (in opposite to e. g. Far Cry 2, after driving through a "check point" of the UFLL or APR).
Humans are also a common type of enemies. Bandits, minions or headhunter who work for the devil ... and so on. The „weak“ (civilians) are supressed by the demons and the hellish forces, also by other humans. The „stronger“ humans (means armored headhunters and bandits) are hunted by the devil or integrated the the force of the devil. This is why they are also a common type of enemies in a lot of (in Far Cry established variations: Sniper, Melee, Shotgun/Assault ...).
The game could have at least 2 different endings: A „Good One“, where the devil disappears and the humans are free from him again. This is triggered if the protagonist chooses to refuse all offers of the devil.
The other one could be the „Good for you!“-Ending. Nores becomes a high ranked member of the forces of the devil and/or one of his best headhunters. This is triggered, if he accepts the offers of the devil. This could also include, that Markus survives ... or gets a new body.
There could be a ranking how high the rank of Nores will be, based on the fact how many offers he accepted. Or if the player completes all side missions for Markus
I also suggest, that the protagonist have a few cool lines, like our protagonist in Far Cry 3 Blood Dragon, just … of course … fitting to this scenario. Check the meta-level stuff (Western-Movies, Horror-Movies, maybe Italo-Western).
~
Well so far one of my ideas to this very interesting PAWD-Setting for a possbile Far Cry X.5.
I hope it is inspiring and interesting!
(As an author I like to create ideas for worlds like this one … but it is very hard for me to do it in English. Took a bit time ... and this is a very important resource ...)
Senior Member
In the game, there can be The Devil and Antichrist. Together or one of them.
Antichrist - the tool of the Devil on earth. In the material world. Who prepares his coming.
Antichrist won't come with horns and hoofs.
He will come crossing himself and building churches.
Не will come as a fighter for justice, freedom and democracy.
The most people will be sure - this is a good person.
They will trust him.
Originally Posted by password1234xxx Go to original post
It can be a woman as well.
Pretty and tender creature ....good shot and brave at the same time. Connected with two worlds.
Member
In a lot of video games, films and books (including older stories like "Faust", Johann Wolfgang von Goethe, released (in parts) since 1790) the figure and character of the devil was a very tricky aspect.Originally Posted by GameGuru2018 Go to original postIn the game, there can be The Devil and Antichrist. Together or one of them.
Antichrist - the tool of the Devil on earth. In the material world. Who prepares his coming.
Antichrist won't come with horns and hoofs.
He will come crossing himself and building churches.
Не will come as a fighter for justice, freedom and democracy.
The most people will be sure - this is a good person.
They will trust him.
It can be a woman as well.
Pretty and tender creature ....good shot and brave at the same time. Connected with two worlds.
As hard as it is to define: "good", it is to define: what is "evil".
The devil as the symbol for "the evil" or "evilness" is even more hard to define, because he is something like the tip of it.
In the stereotypes there are mostly two main pictures of the devil:
The Brutal/Mighty Punisher (which ironically could cause him doing good. Because he punishes the sinners (evil humans) and indirectly helps to bring justice in the world. "Satan" was in very past times something like the prosecutor in the Judgment of the Dead or/and also in the the Last Judgement.
To avoid this aspect (that he might indirectly do "good"), the figure/character of the steroetype devil was very often mixed with "the Tempter".
Means: He is the one, who tempts innocent people to do evil things, to finally get their souls (and punish them).
This picture of the tempter seems a bit more "modern", but also "fallen" gods (for around 2000 years ago and much more) who became a part of the devil-figure got the same tempting aspects.
E.g. "Beelzebub", an old synonym for the devil, comes from a dropped god. Same as the name "Lucifer", also a dropped god longer time ago.
A lot of these dropped "ex-"gods got tempting aspects, which isn't very surprising -> "They are tempting you to get your soul and to draw it into damnation." -> The best way to get people from one god to a new one.
The tricky part in creating a good "devil"-figure in a story is to create a good mix of: The Devil as the Tempter and The Devil as the Brutal/Mighty Punisher. No question: You need both to fit the right (stereotype) picture of the devil.
But ... both aspects are a bit contradictory.
The Balance needs to be right. Otherwiese the devil will become only a punisher of the evil guys (and he won't become a bad guy!) or he loses in power: A tempter is always "someone who tries you to do something. You still have control. Which means also: He has no 'real' power over you. (Otherwise he doesn't need to tempt!) -> Which makes him looking weak".
~
I have no problems if the devil would be a woman. But I hope for a good balance of his figure in its inner aspects. Everytime I check this balance if I see "the Devil" in a story.. ("Mephistopheles" - the devil at Goethe's Faust ... I think he realy lags in "the punisher"-aspect ...
Maybe it would be clever to give him more manifestation which merge into one another. I don't mean this simple as: As an endboss, he needs to become bigger and look evil. Lol, no! I also talk about his character:
If the devil is shown as a woman (why not, fits realy good to "the Tempter"), I also want to see 'her' very evil and brutal side: A mix of a femme fatale and an evil and mighty queen with hordes of demons and other evil creatures. Otherwise she/the Devil wouldn't feel powerful enaugh to fit into the needed stereotype.
~
If we take the idea of two endings:
Ending #1: The Devil is gone (good ending)
and
Ending #2: The protagonist will become the devils best head hunter
... we could also use the saying: "You think you change the devil? Wrong - the devil is changing you."
Means: The Ending #2 should also include, that A) the protagonist suffers (e. g. feels lost or is literally beaten - or even raped - by the Devil from times to times) and B) the protagonist is doning realy evil things now. (Things that he would never had done at the beginning of the story.)
-> This would also push the apsect of "the Devil as the punisher".
~
I also read GameGuru2018's post in the topic:
https://forums.ubisoft.com/showthrea...what-to-expect
which is also Western related.
Imagine if the protagonist sits on the horse like on the first picture in the given examples. A supposed lost woman is lying on the sandy road, while the protagonists travels by horse. The protagonist dismounts fast and runs to the woman. She is alive and first say "thank you". Then she says to him, that this was only a trick to make the protagonist listen ... and she is the evil empress of the [demonic wild west world] he lives in ... responsible for all things he terms as "evil in the world".Originally Posted by GameGuru2018 Go to original post[...]
1st person, South Western nature, villains, Far Cry style and good story will make a memorable Far Cry Western....
She sits up and makes an offer to the - still wondering - protagonist. Something like: "Give me the [XY / quest object] and I will give you a [super fire rifle with a tripple-magazine] [so: something gameplay related!].
The protagonist slowly truns around - because he sees a few shadows around him - and checks the just now empty, sandy desert.
He is in the middle of a whole army of [hellhounds - or similar] that gaze on him. They have sandy colors and look "very angry". The woman smiles.
Now she (the Devil) says: "Otherwise - if the protagonist doesn't agree" ... ... well: the protagonist won't get the cool gun, but instead a very nice and slow death experience.
So the player has the choice now: Work for her (the tempting Devil) and take the super rifle with incendiary rounds and a very big magazine (and maybe an additional "kill this nice guy"-job).
Or:
Fight against the [hellhounds] - which also means ... if the player survives ... the protagonist would have reduced health after the (partly scripted) battle with the [hellhounds].
[Need to buy an upgrade again to fix it
Maybe it is a bit "classic" carrot and stick ... but with the result that the soul of the protagonists suffers by taking the carrot (again and again). And the Devil, ... well ... she laughs and smiles ... [which also pushes the aspect of the "mighty, brutal punisher"]
... ... and a love-hated character by the player is still more impresive than a only loved or only hated one ... ;D
~
Ubisoft should hurry in doing this Western or even PAWD-Setting Far Cry ... before its competitors take (a few of) our ideas from Ubisoft's forum for their own games
Senior Member
Don't be afraid, password1234xxx, our ideas never end.
Originally Posted by password1234xxx Go to original post
Villain in its best.
Absolute Villain.
That's why it should be a woman.
Only don't like Elizabeth Hurley in Bedazzled!
I have nothing against Elizabeth but too much emphasis on sexuality.
Temptation doesn't mean only sex.
She can flatter your Ego...
Feed your desire for revenge....
Feed your greed, individualism, possessiveness....and many other things.
For many men Villain comes not like "Vaas", "Pegan" or "Joseph"!
Their Villain is not brutal psycho.
Their villain is beautiful, tender, smells good and so close.
Anyway, to put an accent mostly on sexuality of devil-female in the game would be wrong.
But she must be Beautiful.
There is a saying, just in every language in the world, like - "Devil's beauty." (very beautiful, irresistable attractiveness)
Despite the fact that it is not fashionable today.
Cyberpunk2077 was critisized recently that there are too many beautiful people in the game.
And she must be Feminine.
Real trap for opposite gender.
It will be first Real Far Cry Female Villain.
Absolute villain.
Member
Speaking of temptation, of course, sexual things are one of two main aspects that people come up with first.Originally Posted by GameGuru2018 Go to original postDon't be afraid, password1234xxx, our ideas never end.
Villain in its best.
Absolute Villain.
That's why it should be a woman.
Only don't like Elizabeth Hurley in Bedazzled!
I have nothing against Elizabeth but too much emphasis on sexuality.
Temptation doesn't mean only sex.
She can flatter your Ego...
Feed your desire for revenge....
Feed your greed, individualism, possessiveness....and many other things.
For many men Villain comes not like "Vaas", "Pegan" or "Joseph"!
Their Villain is not brutal psycho.
Their villain is beautiful, tender, smells good and so close.
Anyway, to put an accent mostly on sexuality of devil-female in the game would be wrong.
But she must be Beautiful.
There is a saying, just in every language in the world, like - "Devil's beauty." (very beautiful, irresistable attractiveness)
Despite the fact that it is not fashionable today.
Cyberpunk2077 was critisized recently that there are too many beautiful people in the game.
And she must be Feminine.
Real trap for opposite gender.
It will be first Real Far Cry Female Villain.
Absolute villain.
These aspects are realy present (which is no surprise ... sex means babies, and babies mean that the humans survive ... well, they did it for thousands of years this way).
But: Things that come to mind quickly become boring or forgotten again also very quickly. So they're not the trick ... at least not when they stand alone.
A Femme Fatale ... there are a lot of out there
So right: This aspect is important, but alone, it is nothing special. We need more to make "a Tempter" to "a Tempter".
One other aspect that pushes a villain (in its "evilness" but also "temptingness"/as a Tempter) is an also very present but "worse" aspect:
(negative meant) Wealth, Greed, "Pelf"/or "the Mammon".
Without being too socially critical: the mammon has much more power - because he "has the money"
(The name "mammon" is comparatively new. An not translated term in the 16th century in the New Testament in the Bible. It only meant: Wealth - but without the translation it became a personification for the negative effects of wealthiness like total greed. ... well: "Mammon" = a kinda pretty new demon - nothing that is 1,000 or 2,000 years old
Femme Fatale // the Mammon Aspect - no question our villain needs both concering the key aspect of "The Tempter". And the good thing is as said above: Both aspects can work together!
[The Tempter:]
Femme Fatale Aspect:
In the end a very simple but good working aspect
1. Sexual charms and/or hints
2. With the logical knowing, that abandon oneself to these charms/hints will have realy bad consequences in the end (regret it)
+> of course one don't care the bad feeling in the end, because of the outlook for a short-term high feeling (extase)
+> ironically: making things even worse (e. g. protagonist dies before he/she can regret it, so: while the extase/high feeling) seems to push the luring aspect: Because the protagonist won't experience the regret in the end.
--> This makes the protagonist realy looking selfish.
As said: a classic, good working aspect. But alone ... not the trick. Nevertheless it should be used. Combined with:
Mammon Aspect:
Means to the villain (aka the female devil):
1. She has to be greedy
2. But on the other side: Has to tempt the protagonist into "greedness", too.
--> To bad: this is again an act of balance, because both aspects contradict each other. At least, if they stand alone.
Means: In the story, the villain (female devil) has to give things to the protagonist ... without giving him the major ammount of it or without a consideration that has a much higher value than the object itself.
A specific situation could be: The devil gives the protagonist an unique weapon - but also a (side) mission that has to be completed - in which the devil get's additional things for herself. (Gold, souls ... of old friends of the protagonist ... something like that
In gameplay aspects this could also (and simple) mean: If the player make decissions to work with the (female) devil, the player gets more in-game money to buy equipment, ammo, weapons and so on. Also - as said before - unique power-ups and special unique weapons could be another aspect.
On the other side: The player has to do side-missions to push the "Mammon"-Aspect of the devil. Well "she needs revenue from her investment."
Example:
The protagonist - our head hunter - get's tempted by the female devil to do X and not Y.
[Here the devil uses Mammon, but also Femme Fatale channels to influence the protagonist/player]
Y means: Downgrade and trouble (for the protagonist and the player)
X means: An unique weapon and maybe an hot kiss
But X also means: You have to do something the protagonist (and the player) doesn't want to do:
Like to help to conquer an [classic Western styled] village for the devil.
+> Even worse: After doing so, some ghost riders [or similar] kill everyone to "harvest their souls". The female devil just smiles warm ... while the protagonist also watches how [some known person from the story] gets brutally killed druing the massacre, too. Ouch!
~
Mabye: A few tempting aspects of Faith Seed (Far Cry 5) could be used, too; a bit transformed and not unattached to new aspects like: The "Brutal Punisher"; or "the Mammon" (as part of the Tempter aspect).
Faith Seed is - no question - a Femma Fatale ... a kinda untypical one, because she doesn't use sexual aspects. No, Faith Seed uses calm, peace and sympathy as tempting weapon. But also subliminal the desire to be close to a young woman. (She behaves a bit like a girl in love: Sitting into the grass, butterflies fly around ...)
Summarized: Faith uses something like a form of "luring" innocence as a tempting weapon. Untypical for a Femme Fatale - but (with checking the results) ... they fit in the end. (You remember the Angels, right?!)
Also this shown innocence makes you feel bad: Because you are the ... well: not innocent one.
This aspect of using innocence as weapon could be used, too.
~ ~ ~
Adding all aspects so far ...
Our villain:
She - the devil - never realy loses control or shows weakness [Powerful Empress] ... she shows a few sexual aspects to tempt instead [Tempter/Femme Fatale]
... and everything prized she gives to the protagonist will harm him in multiple ways ... just a bit later [Tempter/Mammon]. (Repayment with interest!)
Opposing her? No - the protagonist changes every time he takes a step towards her. If he realy tries to oppose her: She shows him that this is a bad idea. Brutal force and used power to turn him back again (well ... if our protagonist survives).
But following her ... also very often feels like a punishmend for the protagonist [Brutal Punisher].
I realy can imagine, how this villain fits into this stylized Western World:
A cute, young woman, that has a whole demon army behind her, tempting with her wealthiness and her body; but also (subliminally) punishing the protagonist for being with her. If he tries to fight her or to get away: It gets even worse!
And then, between smoke, fire, cloting blood and the fresh bones of just slaughtered old friends of the protagonist, she dances like a small girl and says to the protagonist: "Come on, dance with me" and smiles warm. [Innocence as an additional weapon for a Femme Fatale, similar to Faith Seed]
Whatever the player (you) chose to do in this situation ... it's not right. Everthing feels wrong ... what have you done? You are falling. The only point that still holds you (barely) alive in all this emptiness is the person you fear most: It is her!
Now she gots you
~
Far Cry was always the Game Series of Villains - the SpinOffs felt a little neglected compared to the Main Games.
--> Time to change it, and a Western- or PAWD-Setting (the female devil fits realy good in here!) seems realy a good place for this!
~
ps
I am not scared that our ideas will end. ;p But at least my time to talk over them.
(Honestly: I only find so much time to write nearly weekly into this forum because of that annoying Covid-19 out there.)
Senior Member
(To write here doesn't demand so much time!
Make your posts shorter if it takes so much time to write.
Find some time in the night or early in the morning. You can't always be busy - 24 hours a day! There are always gaps.)
The devil can be as a man in the game or a woman.
One day Far Cry will have to make a female - as a main villain in the big game!
This will be a hard task for them.
Because, I'm afraid, they will try to make her brutal, with iron will. Even looking the same.
In other words, they can make a woman - as a second-rate man!
But power of a woman not in brutality!
Her power is not in man immitation.
Her power is in Contrary.
OPPOSITES ATTRATCT.
She is soft, tender, cools a man in the heat and warms him in the cold.
She gives him roots.
Without her a man is just a tramp. A drifter.
Her power over a man can't be overestimated.
I think developing the main villain as a woman, developers will face many problems.
From feminism to company policy.
To be a villain - woman shouldn't be brutal and look like a man.
We know from history that the most violent and brutal cortels in Mexico were led by fragile women.
She doesn't have to be brutal - she must be smart.
For brutality she has tough guys around.
Let's hope developers will make good villain-female, when the time comes.
Moreover, I hope there will be attractive female characters in Far Cry 6!
Not like in Watch Dogs Legion.
Only one Judy Alvarez from Cyberpunk2077 is much more attrcative and charismatic than all Legion's characters combined.
This shouldn't happen with Far Cry 6!
Member
Originally Posted by GameGuru2018 Go to original post
The aspects "brutal", "iron will" and "soft, tender" + "being contrary to a man" are not necessary opposites. It depends on the situation. A character should be much more than 'one-' or just 'two-dimensional'.
Means, in one situation the character needs to be like this, in other ones like this. (Different triggers, different reactions - doesn't mean that a character gets unpredictable.)
In Far Cry 3 Citra [leader of the Rakyat] comes close to a classic (... not to say: one- or two-dimensional) "femme fatale"
(- ... ... ... still I like the ending in which the protagonist Jason get's killed 'like a warrior' by her much more
I could imagine a female villain character like [the following] in a game: (assuming there are decissions to make by the player regarding the storyline)
If the protagonist/player follows her will/plan, she shows "her warm and nice side". Which doesn't mean the general situation for the protagonist gets better.
If not ... both sides: Being evil to punish the protagonist, but still keep a door open for him(/her) to turn around and follow her.
Maybe you know the line that a sweet woman (which done very evil things or cover evil things) just 'Gives the dread a pretty face."
I think this is what we need here, too - if we talk about a good, female villains.
~ Or even a female devil as antagonist like in the idea above:
==> I personally (still) imagine some very feminine, cute anime-lady mixed with the protagonist of the song "Man skin boots" from the finnish Hard Rock/Heavy Metal Band "Lordi"
[btw, here it is: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=joLL...el=LordiLyrics)
(But I think enaugh said to this great idea, let's keep the box closed; I stay on a more general level now concering female villains: )
An other aspect is (as already mentioned by GameGuru2018): A female character shouldn't end up as a secand-rate man. Of course: true.
But: No question, this is a realy hard task for the story writer - half the world is thinking about: what is a "man" and what a "woman" (especially: talking his // her behavior).
On one side she needs other aspects than a man; but on the other side she shouldn't be a 100% stereotypic "mirror" of a man. This could be a "downgrade", too. The reason is the history of the human beings - especailly in the Middle Age and Renaissance:
The (stereotype) aspects and tasks of a woman were also rated under the tasks and behaviors of a man. In the result we have the same problem: She will end up as a second-rate human.
As far by now, this "types" fall out:
- the "copy of a man"-woman (second-rate man)
- the one-dimensional stereotype woman (which is in each aspect the opposite of a man) (including 100% resp. classic femme fatale-characters)
--> both can be seen as extremes, --> means we need to find a middle of both not to crash into them:
Not to much "(stereotype) man", or she will end up as a second-rated man.
Not to much "(stereotype) woman", or she will end up as a second-rate human (and the militant feminists will rage out ... again. ... ... damn these are hard times
Not to make her to close to a stereotype man is simple, just do the opposite ... but the hard task is now: don't overdo them. (... or you have a sterotype woman ... lol).
"The opposite" means (for me) not to mirror all things like some bipolar Yin and Yang. You have possibilities to vary aspects by "oppositing" them; they are not bipolar or two-dimensional.
Example: Imagine this lines to happen in a story:
==> >>A stereotype villain would kill the traitor now!<< --mirriroing--> >>A not sterotype villain would XXX{?} <<
==> Letting a >>traitor alive<< in a story is just the half aspect of an action. As you see, you need to anwer more elements in this case. And this is the chance to vary.
Back to the female villain directly:
One mistake which could be made: Making her not powerful, just because a man might be shown as powerful:
A woman (ally or villain) can have also endless power in a story without being hated by the audience ... as long as she isn't shown as rebellious [as ally] or traitorous [as villain, especially: concerning other villains]. (Why? This old aspect is pushed be older (hollywood)-action-movies over years ... without being noticed by the (male) story writers :/ )
The question should be: How the player/protagonist notices that she is powerful?
This could be in different situations and - of course - in different ways. Means also: "brutal", "iron will" and "soft, tender" are not opposites - because: you have much more situations to show different aspects.
In situation 1 a stereotype male viallain would do: X1, and X2
In situation 2 a stereotype male viallain would do: X3, X4 and X5
--mirriroing-->
In situation 1 a stereotype male viallain would do: Y1, X1 and Z1
In situation 1 a stereotype male viallain would do: Z2, Y2 and Y3
(X and Y are contraries; Z is a new aspect - neither Yin nor Yang; the ammount of aspects vary, because other elements open new possible actions)
Well ...
In general I don't think the storywriters need to do something realy new, just because the villain is a woman now:
All these questions and idea-finding-processes should be asked resp. used regerdless the gender of the villain. Finding new answers on (old) questions is always important to create new and fresh characters (and villains) (regardless the gender of the character/villain). The questions/ found apsects need to fit to the character/villain, and the character/villain has to fit to the whole story (... including his/her gender and behavior; the gender itself isn't a guideline for the behavior ... ).
[QUOTE=GameGuru2018;15232870]
[...]
Moreover, I hope there will be attractive female characters in Far Cry 6!
Not like in Watch Dogs Legion.
Only one Judy Alvarez from Cyberpunk2077 is much more attrcative and charismatic than all Legion's characters combined.
This shouldn't happen with Far Cry 6!
Okay, the question about what is "attractive" is even harder to answer
But one thing I noticed, which can infuence this aspect:
Watch Dogs Legions, as same as Far Cry new Dawn uses an "over-modern" style.
I don't know Watch Dogs as series and saw only a few contents of Watch Dogs Legions, but I heard similar comments concerning Far Cry New Dawn (like: concering the character: Selene [(field) doctor of "Prosperity"]).
The over-modern style (like for Selene's hair) is - no wonder - unfamiliar for many people; of course this irritates and makes things rated as unatractive in much more cases.
For Far Cry New Dawn (and maybe: Watch Dogs Legions) this aspect is not bad:
As part of the world and story, unfamiliar aspects are needed and fit.
But, looking from a higher level on all these worlds (and included styles), the demand resp. capacity for these over-modern ("irritating") designs is already oversaturated. We had Far Cry New Dawn, we have other modern titles with similar over-modern designs (including some from other publishers and studios) ... now there needs to be found something new for Far Cry 6.5 (or similar). (... before other studios do it
In a Western-, a PAWD- or similar setting, these over-modern style (including: "irritating" appearances of females and males) doesn't fit.
But I also think, Far Cry 6 already won't include over-modern styles like New Dawn.
Senior Member
To develop a villain-female, in the big game, will be very challenging task for developers.
She mustn't be "Vaas in skirt"!
A man and a woman...
No one should be humiliated, no one should be deprived of the rights.
We're different. No one is better or worse.
This difference enriches us.
We exist on this planet because of that difference.
I think attempts to destroy that beautiful difference - is attempt to endager the very existence of humanity.
We have differences in our bodies, we have differences in our psychology.
If someone denies it ... I don't know what to say.
I agree that the world should be without casts, without classes ....but world without genders???
Only imagine that! Nightmare.
Developing the villain as a female, developers of the game, writers, should take into account that differences.
Psychology and behaviour.
Better if not only a man will write the story!
Much better if they're both. (only not some angry female feminist-writer)
With good actress in the main role - game will have succes.
It can be famous female-actress or just popular female singer. (with acting talent)
As for dark western....
password1234xxx, today Ubisoft's games are very colorfull, with bright and vivid colors.
Do you think they will make a dark game?
Contrast would be striking....
As for me, I'm for contrast! (at least sometimes)
