Heroes with heal moves as part of their kit aren't balanced. Change my mind. | Forums

[TheUberDome]

There is no way that having a move that gives you health back can be considered fair. Sure shugoki has to make a big risk to get his heal, but shaman has no risk to getting her health back. All she needs is a bleed and she's got shinobi's tier 4 in duels. Plus unlike Jorm and cent, the pounce does not give the opponent stamina back, but DOES give stamina and health to the shaman. Someone explain to me in what sense that is fair?

All healing moves should be removed, and replaced with a stamina regen move. When shaman bleeds someone she should get stamina back on hit, not health
Shugoki should have his recovery fixed on his hug and the healing removed.

Doubt this will even be considered by the devs as they dont pay attention to the community anymore, but i'm curious on your guys' opinions on the subject.

[Lord.Warden.]

I agree with you. Shaman is the most cancerous character when it comes to ganking especially if she's accompanied by a Peacekeeper at her side. You won't get a chance to even get up and attack because the PK will re-apply the bleed status constantly and the shaman will spam jump bite on you.

There has to be either a cool down to that dumb easy win move or a massive revenge build up from it (And please ALLOW REVENGE TO ACTIVATE if the shaman jumped on you and you're on the ground. The amount of times I was on the ground with revenge meter filled up and couldn't pop it is infuriating. Same thing with Shugoki's hug and raider's charge. Allow revenge to stop that crap immediately.

Let stamina reset on the opponent when she lands a bite, otherwise the second u run out of stamina against a PK and a Shaman, it's game over.

[Gaser.]

Outside of shamans bite being a bit to strong, I don’t really have a problem with the rest.

Shugs hug mix up is rather slow and shaman getting I think 2hp on hit ain’t that bad in my opinion.

[RoosterIlluzion]

There is no way that having a move that gives you health back can be considered fair. Sure shugoki has to make a big risk to get his heal, but shaman has no risk to getting her health back. All she needs is a bleed and she's got shinobi's tier 4 in duels. Plus unlike Jorm and cent, the pounce does not give the opponent stamina back, but DOES give stamina and health to the shaman. Someone explain to me in what sense that is fair?

All healing moves should be removed, and replaced with a stamina regen move. When shaman bleeds someone she should get stamina back on hit, not health
Shugoki should have his recovery fixed on his hug and the healing removed.

Doubt this will even be considered by the devs as they dont pay attention to the community anymore, but i'm curious on your guys' opinions on the subject.

Wait, you're *****ing about characters that heal by doing a specific move or creating a circumstance mid-fight, but don't say anything about those that have a heal perk? They only need to press up on the D-pad to heal. And to restore stamina all you have to do is hold back and not attack, duh. Maybe you should hush up until you have an argument worth posting.

[Lord.Warden.]

Wait, you're *****ing about characters that heal by doing a specific move or creating a circumstance mid-fight, but don't say anything about those that have a heal perk? They only need to press up on the D-pad to heal. And to restore stamina all you have to do is hold back and not attack, duh. Maybe you should hush up until you have an argument worth posting.

I'll assume by saying "perk" you mean "feats" otherwise you should give the same advice to yourself of hushing up until you have an argument worth posting. Now to get back to the point, Shaman's bite is broken. It does not reset the opponent's stamina, deals damage, and heals her. Let alone you can't pop revenge if you gained it when she jumped on you for a bite. He has a very good point to argue against heroes like her. Now you may be thinking of 1v1 situation, and yes it's your fault if you get bitten in a 1v1 but you have to look at the bigger picture which is DOMINION. Usually Shamans are accompanied by a Peacekeeper at their side.PK re-applies bleed constantly and easily, and shaman instantly and infinitely bites you. Even when you're in revenge. This is why we need that move specifically fixed. Shugoki's hug is balanced for the most part except for the fact u can't pop revenge during the hug animation.

Next time please read all of the replies and points brought up in the post before you post something so thoughtless.

[RoosterIlluzion]

I'll assume by saying "perk" you mean "feats" otherwise you should give the same advice to yourself of hushing up until you have an argument worth posting. Now to get back to the point, Shaman's bite is broken. It does not reset the opponent's stamina, deals damage, and heals her. Let alone you can't pop revenge if you gained it when she jumped on you for a bite. He has a very good point to argue against heroes like her. Now you may be thinking of 1v1 situation, and yes it's your fault if you get bitten in a 1v1 but you have to look at the bigger picture which is DOMINION. Usually Shamans are accompanied by a Peacekeeper at their side.PK re-applies bleed constantly and easily, and shaman instantly and infinitely bites you. Even when you're in revenge. This is why we need that move specifically fixed. Shugoki's hug is balanced for the most part except for the fact u can't pop revenge during the hug animation.

Next time please read all of the replies and points brought up in the post before you post something so thoughtless.

Oh no, I didn't get the stupid name correct! You're so much better than me at life. And your argument is still a moot point since you said yourself DON'T GET BIT. Plus, why the hell would getting bit by shaman reset YOUR stamina? That doesn't make any sense in any situation or game mode. And if not being able to activate revenge happens WHILE your being bit, your too late, so STFU. If revenge doesn't work just before you get bit, like a regular attack would happen, THAT is the only thing that needs to be fixed. Otherwise, you might as well take out bleed, bulwark, full block, and moves that bring out the little b i t ch in all of you **** players.

I forgot all the characters that heal just by being OUTSIDE OF COMBAT; but neither of you said anything about them! Lmao. Go outside and play cause your dumb.

[TheSamurai2007]

jeez you are a bit too toxic. While i do agree shugoki doesn't need another nerf. shaman is aids to fight in 4v4 because if she pounces you have the double dodge and we know that being attacked stops you from dodging so you would get hit infinitely. good counter is raise the amount of revenge it gives when you do get pounced upon

[Lord.Warden.]

Oh no, I didn't get the stupid name correct! You're so much better than me at life. And your argument is still a moot point since you said yourself DON'T GET BIT. Plus, why the hell would getting bit by shaman reset YOUR stamina? That doesn't make any sense in any situation or game mode. And if not being able to activate revenge happens WHILE your being bit, your too late, so STFU. If revenge doesn't work just before you get bit, like a regular attack would happen, THAT is the only thing that needs to be fixed. Otherwise, you might as well take out bleed, bulwark, full block, and moves that bring out the little b i t ch in all of you **** players.

I forgot all the characters that heal just by being OUTSIDE OF COMBAT; but neither of you said anything about them! Lmao. Go outside and play cause your dumb.

You clearly can't read, salty, and missed the point of this post. Yes, you got the name wrong and it matters because perks and feats are two different things. Anyway, I will break it down for you again.

1) "Don't get bit" Easy in 1v1 not in dominion with a PK hanging around. All the shaman has to do is GB you, PK applies bleed as u counter GB, then PK GBs u and shaman's bite is guaranteed.
2) The reason why would getting bit by shaman should reset your stamina is the same reason why getting dunked upon by CENT or Jorm resets your stamina. Again, look at the bigger picture of "Dominion" game-mode.
3) Revenge won't save you if you get it during the bite which is why we need revenge to activate during it to stop her 50 damage bite.
4) Bleed, bulwark, full block etc do not heal you as part of the character's kit. This post is about heroes with heal moves as part of their kit.
5) If you want to argue against healing FEATS then make another post about that. This post is solely about the heroes with heal moves as part of their kit.

[Gaser.]

You clearly can't read, salty, and missed the point of this post. Yes, you got the name wrong and it matters because perks and feats are two different things. Anyway, I will break it down for you again.

1) "Don't get bit" Easy in 1v1 not in dominion with a PK hanging around. All the shaman has to do is GB you, PK applies bleed as u counter GB, then PK GBs u and shaman's bite is guaranteed.
2) The reason why would getting bit by shaman should reset your stamina is the same reason why getting dunked upon by CENT or Jorm resets your stamina. Again, look at the bigger picture of "Dominion" game-mode.
3) Revenge won't save you if you get it during the bite which is why we need revenge to activate during it to stop her 50 damage bite.
4) Bleed, bulwark, full block etc do not heal you as part of the character's kit. This post is about heroes with heal moves as part of their kit.
5) If you want to argue against healing FEATS then make another post about that. This post is solely about the heroes with heal moves as part of their kit.

1) Pretty sure shamans bash will miss on GB if not timed exactly perfect at the right second, hit stun from a blocked hit is more then enough to do the job.

2) Don’t really have something aginst the stamina thing.

3: Personally I dislike that idea


Personally pins need to give a lot more revenge and should have at least 25% dmg reduction on the pinned guy.

That would solve the issue of pins turning in to easy 100-0 gank tools.

[Goat_of_Vermund]

I do not think a hero having a feature in itself is broken unless it is overpowered.

For example, Shugoki has selfheal, enchanced lights, hyperarmored lights, and a hyperarmor unblockable feinted into a selfhealing bash- and I don't think anyone serious thinks he is anywhere near the top duelists. Even shaman is far from the absolute top in this.

There are multiple games where characters can selfheal, and while it is always useful, if balanced, this feature doesn't mean much. Neither selfheal heroes are really oppressive.

On the other hand, Warden is a very simply made hero with noithing but a few feintable bashes, but that simple tool is so overtoned he is considered the best duelist along with bp and lb.