Goodbye For Honor | Forums

[Lunamaria2020]

I did say all games have metas, as did early for honor, but it was less about the meta than it is now.

Eating spam is not the fault of the receiver when bad internet gets the advantage over good internet. Latency issues hit the people with the best internet the hardest and mcds wifi gets frame advantages from their own lag. This is the only reason why light spam is such an issue on console, and the fight changes coming should fix that.

I was not even close to saying the game should be slowed back down to season 1 for honor. Im saying it was more skill based back then, and the fight changes that are coming are going to reinstate some real skill based gameplay.

How do I know this? Because my skill really shined in the TG. I was performing the way I felt I should be, probably because of the lag/latency compensation.

Suddenly i was parrying like, 70% of the lights coming at me as opposed to the 5% i parry on the current live game. Please do explain this when the majority of players expressed parrying to be harder in the TG than the live game?

I felt it was easier, even though the game had made it harder. How does this make sense??? Latency/Lag issues. I had 600 mb/s download speed during all this. Im hardwired to my modem. Screw wifi. And still, the mcds wifi players were always getting frame advantages (not actually but it sure as hell feels that way with the lag/latency issues).

Its really easy to say "git gud, if you have issues, you're obviously just bad".

Its also easy to take a moment and try to figure out why other people have a particular issue when you don't.

Either you are:

1. On PC
2. One of the people with Mcds wifi.
3. A god of for honor that looks down on every non GM player as if they all suck, even diamond players such as myself. (Currently Diamond 2)

You mean when a parry netted you a GB and a heavy or insta death if you were near pikes or ledge ?

[Lunamaria2020]

The idea of an old 'turtle' meta is just silly. The problem was defence was more powerful than offence, and STILL IS. We are still in a version of turtling that has been there since launch - the changes they introduced just gave more tools for the turtle players to add some attacks to their turtling, yet still fight from a 'reaction only' playstyle.

I have said it before, but EVERY real life combat sport has scoring for 'aggression'. Even if you get hit more, if the other guy just stood there and reacted you will win the fight. This is because if you both stand there waiting to react, there IS NO FIGHT. There needs to be incentive to attack, and not just because it will win the easiest.

THE TG changes might help, but do zone attacks parry?

The Skill ceiling on this game has been crashing for quiet some time, but I think thats in response to many of the orignal purchasers, who wanted a skilled game, walking off over various unrelated issues such as

-No designated servers
-Bizarre GB changes from beta to launch
-Revenge in duels
-Cliffs and traps absolutely everywhere
-Having to organise a game blackout to get decent ingame currency rewards
-New champs being obviously far superior to existing champs
-And one big one, the gear system being DELETED rather than phased over to a new one. All that effort & money, taken away in what can only be described in many areas as an illegal move - end user agreements allow content to be updated, but it doesn't allow them to say, delete all your ingame purchases or render them useless. If you offer something for a price, and someone accepts it and pays, you cant later change it. What they did was like someone buying a bus ticket, and halfway through the trip driver gets up and states that the bus route is now going somewhere completely different to its original destination, but because your are on the bus and its going somewhere you are not getting a refund or a new ticket to where you wanted to go.

While many of these were addressed, the game constantly felt like a battle against the devs at which point many of the skill seeking players just threw their hands up and went elsewhere in frustration. Most of my OG friendlist dont play, I just came back a few times, however most never did.

Many of the new players have come over with the various promotions etc. from other games, and weren't the ones who preordered and hung on the edge of their seat for launch. The teething problems saw those (skill seeking) players off.

The gear system was ****, plain and simple. You could not grind a low level character, it was pure pain. If you were matched against top geared opponent, the first mistake meant death. It was stupid, glad they get rid of that.

[Qoissant]

The gear system was ****, plain and simple. You could not grind a low level character, it was pure pain. If you were matched against top geared opponent, the first mistake meant death. It was stupid, glad they get rid of that.

I'd take that any day over the current terrible perk system. The simple fix was to remove revenge and damage stats from gear and replace it with stuff like revive health, speed with offerings, obj capture speed, bonus renown, etc.

The old system worked WAY better in terms of fulfilling progression that suited the games groove but the problem was you could abuse revenge and damage with high level characters. Remove that and the high levels don't posses ridiculous advantages over you.

When i first started playing this game i got my warden from rep 0 to 8 while in high level lobbies because i played with a friend. Never once whined about that advantage they had over me because i didn't mind it.

[Lunamaria2020]

I'd take that any day over the current terrible perk system. The simple fix was to remove revenge and damage stats from gear and replace it with stuff like revive health, speed with offerings, obj capture speed, bonus renown, etc.

The old system worked WAY better in terms of fulfilling progression that suited the games groove but the problem was you could abuse revenge and damage with high level characters. Remove that and the high levels don't posses ridiculous advantages over you.

When i first started playing this game i got my warden from rep 0 to 8 while in high level lobbies because i played with a friend. Never once whined about that advantage they had over me because i didn't mind it.

Oh, do not get me wrong. The perk system is terrible but still far better than the gear system before.

Obviously, they rushed the perks system because ppl were leaving the game in part because of that since you could not grind another character without a lot of mental suffering. And even at max level gear, it was still stupid with instant revenge and 60+ dmg heavies.

[MrBdur]

Oh, do not get me wrong. The perk system is terrible but still far better than the gear system before.

Obviously, they rushed the perks system because ppl were leaving the game in part because of that since you could not grind another character without a lot of mental suffering. And even at max level gear, it was still stupid with instant revenge and 60+ dmg heavies.

Ok. Gaser and Luna. Seriously. Every time I see you two give opinions on this game, I'm left scratching my head.

Luna, you pointed out basically (key word is basically) the only non skill based portion of the early game which was free gb on parry which got fixed rather quickly.

I do agree Conq was ******, but he still is, and honestly, I'd prefer old Conq to the current one because right now, he's just cancer.

Also, gear perks werent active in duels and brawls, so yes you could grind without the enemy having gear advantages, and besides, if you knew how to play, it wasnt that hard to grind even in dominion with a vanilla hero against fully stacked ones. Yes it was a little annoying having the disadvantage but thats exactly what pushed people to grind so hard.

Gaser, the TG changes will DEFINITELY improve the overall feel of the game. Latency/Lag compensation, stamina changes, damage changes, etc.

Whether it SAVES the game or not, that is to be seen, but it will definitely improve things and make the game healthier.

The thing I think I'm most excited for though is the Latency/Lag compensation. I've always had top tier internet, and I'm always wired in, so you can understand my frustration when Mcds wifi players get the advantage due to their own lag. Its almost immitating frame advantage. (Though its not actual frame advantage)

Its pretty dumb that I pay more for a better connection, and because there is no latency compensation, I'm the one at the disadvantage?? I can't wait for that to be done away with.

[King_of_Xibalba]

MrBdur, I hate so much that situation , mcdonald's wifi player only winning cause he pass My blocks, teletransporting, skip animations, constant frame advantage...this is the thing that enrages me the most and the few times I hatemailed someone. All my training hours and skill wasted by his poor choice. I'm not even in the USA, and having 30 to 40 very stable ping with a cat 6 ethernet cable and some NA player can beat me for having a 120+ ping due connecting to mcdonald's and they are not mexican ( meaning being poor as third world poor don't apply). God is so ****** up, NA is the region owith the best internet Quality , i'm not playing against somalians or someone from Timbuktu.

Also I destroyed 90% of the players un 4vs4 with TG changes, so maybe yes their improvements at lag compensation will be a major one. A Game changer truly.

[MrBdur]

MrBdur, I hate so much that situation , mcdonald's wifi player only winning cause he pass My blocks, teletransporting, skip animations, constant frame advantage...this is the thing that enrages me the most and the few times I hatemailed someone. All my training hours and skill wasted by his poor choice. I'm not even in the USA, and having 30 to 40 very stable ping with a cat 6 ethernet cable and some NA player can beat me for having a 120+ ping due connecting to mcdonald's and they are not mexican ( meaning being poor as third world poor don't apply). God is so ****** up, NA is the region owith the best internet Quality , i'm not playing against somalians or someone from Timbuktu.

Also I destroyed 90% of the players un 4vs4 with TG changes, so maybe yes their improvements at lag compensation will be a major one. A Game changer truly.

Yeah I can't wait. All the players saying "oh you have a complaint, just git gud" are gonna be screaming and whining and then its our turn to say "just dodge, just parry, just git gud."

[Lunamaria2020]

Ok. Gaser and Luna. Seriously. Every time I see you two give opinions on this game, I'm left scratching my head.

Luna, you pointed out basically (key word is basically) the only non skill based portion of the early game which was free gb on parry which got fixed rather quickly.

I do agree Conq was ******, but he still is, and honestly, I'd prefer old Conq to the current one because right now, he's just cancer.

Also, gear perks werent active in duels and brawls, so yes you could grind without the enemy having gear advantages, and besides, if you knew how to play, it wasnt that hard to grind even in dominion with a vanilla hero against fully stacked ones. Yes it was a little annoying having the disadvantage but thats exactly what pushed people to grind so hard.

Gaser, the TG changes will DEFINITELY improve the overall feel of the game. Latency/Lag compensation, stamina changes, damage changes, etc.

Whether it SAVES the game or not, that is to be seen, but it will definitely improve things and make the game healthier.

The thing I think I'm most excited for though is the Latency/Lag compensation. I've always had top tier internet, and I'm always wired in, so you can understand my frustration when Mcds wifi players get the advantage due to their own lag. Its almost immitating frame advantage. (Though its not actual frame advantage)

Its pretty dumb that I pay more for a better connection, and because there is no latency compensation, I'm the one at the disadvantage?? I can't wait for that to be done away with.

Yeah, sure. Annoying ? Orochi spamming light at 35+ dmg EACH. Just annoying really ? xD Raider with top heavies above 70 dmg ? Just annoying sure xD

And what about ppl that does not like duel and brawl? What should have they done ? Play vs IA all day long ? Stop spouting non sense.

And I did not even speak about the "revenge build" which was predominant back then = 2-3 hits BOOM REVENGE AND YOU ARE DEAD ! SO FUN !

[Sweaty_Sock]

The gear system was ****, plain and simple. You could not grind a low level character, it was pure pain. If you were matched against top geared opponent, the first mistake meant death. It was stupid, glad they get rid of that.

It wasnt that it needed to be changed, they literally deleted all loadouts (forced them to one perk) and gave you 5 crates as compensation. I put a year or so into grinding, selecting for aesthetic (and even put $ in) to have it simply removed. I had about 5 champs with 3 different max tier load outs each. I got 5 loot crates, not even enough to get even 1 loadout.

The old perk system needed to be changed, it was HOW it was changed that was the problem (and thats quiet aside from the heavy class biased mess that was put in its place...). I never liked it, but was forced to accept it and build with it, and that cost me actual money and alot of time. For... 5 crates. 5. crates.

I didnt like the system for the same reason feat gain is stupid - giving better players tools to win harder is just *&^5ing stupid, even Call of Duty toned down their kill streaks and they pretty much INVENTED the damn idea.

BUT surely you could have just increased the downsides on the 'min max' gear scores, and made a freely allocated point system where higher tier players could choose to sacrifice a larger amount of say stamina for greater HP etc, whereas new players start balanced.

Yeah, sure. Annoying ? Orochi spamming light at 35+ dmg EACH. Just annoying really ? xD Raider with top heavies above 70 dmg ? Just annoying sure xD

And what about ppl that does not like duel and brawl? What should have they done ? Play vs IA all day long ? Stop spouting non sense.

And I did not even speak about the "revenge build" which was predominant back then = 2-3 hits BOOM REVENGE AND YOU ARE DEAD ! SO FUN !

If old orochi was giving you light spam issues then how do you deal with the new one? With Tiandi? With Calk, heck with anyone light spamming (not to mention back then if you blocked a light and hit GB, you would grab them out of light attack startup so... light spam was a noob mistake (interestingly TG changes will bring this back in the version of your own light beating their light thrown after being blocked, which is nice)

& you STILL need to grind gear, its just that heavy perks are far superior that its not worth bothering with the effort of getting a damn spreadsheet out to calculate your 3 perk builds on anyone else.

Revenge builds were a problem, but that doesn't mean you throw the baby out with the bathwater. And not having gear wasn't the end of the world, and the easiest solution there would be just add some half decent stats the the default Armour. To be honest i'd take a cool looking champ over the better gear score any day but it'd be my choice. Half my champs are still rocking the 1500 points in remedy or whatever BS perk I got on the perk system rework because whats the point in changing, grinding, and trusting the results to be worth anything if they may all just hit the big reset button again.

The game is dumbing down (fancy version would be 'streamlining'), some of it makes sense because removing variables and making champs very similar to each other makes balance easier (which is why imbalance these days is harder to understand). At launch putting champs into 'similar too' pools was very hard, now you can group 2-3 champs together with each other into groups pretty easy (or describe a champs kit as half and half of two others). I'm personally not a fan as its all just rote learnt responses now (and the failure to STILL fix the zone/parry bug and instead build around it, despite knowing defence is too strong...)

This games learning kerb is a fraction what it once was, partly because many players left and needed to be replaced and be able to compete with veterans, and partly as above for balance. What I was saying is many of those players left due to issues outside of the actual gameplay (like no designated servers... I mean people complain about lag these days....imagine if rage quiters crashed your entire lobby).

[Lunamaria2020]

I was playing Orochi back then and slicing up ppl in 3. And I was the one being called out because I did 35+ dmg per lights attack. And that was after the rework of Orochi when he finally go 500ms side light. So keep your comments to yourself.

You spend $ to buy crates or steel for gear? Stupid move.

And it is "dedicated" server, not designated. And as far as I know, they have been in service for 2 years now ? The issue here is lag compensation which favor the bad connections where it should favor the good ones.