Why kill the Jorm? | Forums

[NavityRePocchi]

Simple useless in 1v1 now.

why nerf so hard? i mean, stamina damage is now too low. I can't do the max punish never again.

Usually when try to rebalance a hero, it's better do small changes like 5 or 10 point of value each attack. Not like this.

Gb was 40 > now 20 (20 point????)
bash was 45 > now 30

too big. Really. I think jorm is not top tier expecially 1v1. You nerf him only because is hated hero? don't get the point.

[d_anny25]

Yeah I agree with your points to 100%. Jorm is my main {70} and he is definitely useless in 1vs1...I know he’s strong but also reactable. The changes with stamina drop and the Heavys from 400ms to 600ms are to big. You need now 6 stamina punches to get your enemie out of stamina and your out of stamina too...Hope he is getting a buff with quicker Heavies and the Hyperarmor for the Dodge Heavy...this attack needs 700ms...why? Just useless now

[The_Sentinel_]

adding my voice to yours. I mentioned in a separate post that the devs nerfed his signature move so he is pretty much useless now

[Sweaty_Sock]

Best idea since jorms launch.

His attacks do damage you know, you dont HAVE to hit them to the ground, thats an OPTION. Got a GB? Hit them instead?

The problem with Jorm was he was meant to be a turtle breaker - however the stamina damage meant attacking him was far to risky and in turn forced... more turtling.

He was hated because you couldn't be aggressive against a jorm, as any trade usually halted stamina regen & your cost & stamina damage meaning you are now in for a lost fight... for being aggressive.

He was a flawed concept they brought in JUST when they fixed stamina bullying in the game. It wasnt missed on any of the champs that used to have it, then they rolled it all into a super stamina bully and it had even worse issues. Its just not healthy for a fighting game to stop players from being able to fight.

[d_anny25]

I know what you think and see the problem about it...but players are turtling with so many chars...If you have to play against a jorm then you have to change your playstyle...you can’t spam like you do this to other chars...Do you think Ubisoft solved the problem by nerf him to the ground? I think not...they could buff other chars or do more stamina for all chars...but nerf all his attacks is not the right way to play friendly against a jorm...Jorm players have to change their playstyle too but nobody care about that. But Warden mains who spams only SB and wait till you do something are so great to play against...nevermind. I hope he is getting a buff.

[Sweaty_Sock]

I know what you think and see the problem about it...but players are turtling with so many chars...If you have to play against a jorm then you have to change your playstyle...you can’t spam like you do this to other chars...Do you think Ubisoft solved the problem by nerf him to the ground? I think not...they could buff other chars or do more stamina for all chars...but nerf all his attacks is not the right way to play friendly against a jorm...Jorm players have to change their playstyle too but nobody care about that. But Warden mains who spams only SB and wait till you do something are so great to play against...nevermind. I hope he is getting a buff.

Jorm was designed to BREAK turtles not FORCE people to turtle. Thats the problem, they failed badly and so you have a turtle breaking champ that forces you to turtle. His back grab beats any intelligent mixup as it interrupts through anything HA included.

Warden can get three SB off before hes OOS, each nets 18 damage (wardens gauranteed light is 12 + 6 damage, same as jorms normal light but costs two attacks worth of stamina) before hes OOS. And it used to hurt their opponents stamina as well, but that was removed for the health of the game. Basically thee reps of bash is 18+18+18 damage, or three lights from jorm. And thats assuming they dont guess a counter in that and punish you. Charged SB can be read on reaction if you dont just panic.

I understand that people are mad the easy mode on Jorm was turned off, but thats what is was. 'Good' jorms still win, and the champ still remains fundamentally flawed. He is a blight on the game and a bad release they should have reworked immediately (or not released and delayed to get working). Any character that uses three moves forces three actions. The game has now devolved into 6 moves and the rest of the kits are thrown in the bin. Any character whos kit is built on things DELETED from the game because they were unhealthy for the game, can only be unhealthy for the game.

You didnt just 'seem to gell with jorm' - he was busted and so lopsided anyone could win with him as he took far more skill to counter than to actually play. My jorm is less than a rep and I wont play it in duels or dom because I basically won everything in a row so I parked him in the 'broken as all getout' not to play list for myself. Without any sense of challenge then whats the point of a PVP game, might as well go play skyrim

[d_anny25]

I‘m running good with him but it doesn’t mean I don’t have to criticize the nerf. I think you don’t know how much this nerf made him useless in 1vs1. Not talking about 4vs4. He is easy to react and that is fact. Warden can do sidesteps and do their SB. Broken is his backstep SB but that is another point...But why talking to a person who don’t play this char enough...

[Sweaty_Sock]

I‘m running good with him but it doesn’t mean I don’t have to criticize the nerf. I think you don’t know how much this nerf made him useless in 1vs1. Not talking about 4vs4. He is easy to react and that is fact. Warden can do sidesteps and do their SB. Broken is his backstep SB but that is another point...But why talking to a person who don’t play this char enough...

If your 'running fine' with the nerf then you didnt need what was taken, making it excessive to requirements?

Jorm can feint back GB the warden out of the sidestep bash (they cancel each other out but the warden still takes the stamina regen stall & cant do the damage after so loses...). There is a thread on the warden backstep with my thoughts on that currently out there, it needs a change (always hated it, rarely use it). Im in the 200+ reps bracket, the choice not to play jorm came from easy straight wins playing as jorm vs the challenges to overcome. I know im not good enough to walk through some of the players I was walking through as jorm (we generally trade 50/50, not 100/0), so i retired him.

Jorm has about 4 moves, you dont need to play jorm to understand jorm. It takes a few minutes to learn if you have played any of the other champs

[Klingentaenz3r]

Jorm was designed to BREAK turtles not FORCE people to turtle. Thats the problem, they failed badly and so you have a turtle breaking champ that forces you to turtle. His back grab beats any intelligent mixup as it interrupts through anything HA included.

Warden can get three SB off before hes OOS, each nets 18 damage (wardens gauranteed light is 12 + 6 damage, same as jorms normal light but costs two attacks worth of stamina) before hes OOS. And it used to hurt their opponents stamina as well, but that was removed for the health of the game. Basically thee reps of bash is 18+18+18 damage, or three lights from jorm. And thats assuming they dont guess a counter in that and punish you. Charged SB can be read on reaction if you dont just panic.

I understand that people are mad the easy mode on Jorm was turned off, but thats what is was. 'Good' jorms still win, and the champ still remains fundamentally flawed. He is a blight on the game and a bad release they should have reworked immediately (or not released and delayed to get working). Any character that uses three moves forces three actions. The game has now devolved into 6 moves and the rest of the kits are thrown in the bin. Any character whos kit is built on things DELETED from the game because they were unhealthy for the game, can only be unhealthy for the game.

You didnt just 'seem to gell with jorm' - he was busted and so lopsided anyone could win with him as he took far more skill to counter than to actually play. My jorm is less than a rep and I wont play it in duels or dom because I basically won everything in a row so I parked him in the 'broken as all getout' not to play list for myself. Without any sense of challenge then whats the point of a PVP game, might as well go play skyrim

Thank you Sweaty, you beautiful bastard. Really well put. Much appreciated. I believe no one could have layed that out better than you did in you two first posts.

[NavityRePocchi]

The nerf is too much.

I try to explain myself.
The Jorm's 50 damage punish is mostly like the bite of the shaman, or the cent new jump (42 damage). Except for the fact that he most put you OOS and land one of his special attack. Without punish jorm have really poor kit to land on and low damage overall. The only way to compensate his lack of damage consistently is around punish. So if u decide to nerf all of the stamina damage, you should necessary boost up the rest of damage. Is also an heavy character with only 130 hp instead of 140 like others (except prior).
If u are not happy of the actual "stamina bully" Jorm, simply do small rework. Compensate any lack of damage with small buffs while maintaining this stamina damage. Or for example make light finisher guarantee after any bash lands. (like mostly characters).