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  1. #11
    Goo-Goo-Man's Avatar Senior Member
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    Originally Posted by N3mB0t Go to original post
    as to where the thread "might be going"... why do the PVP boys would get upset if i had an option to not get bullied by their group of 4 heros waiting for me at the gates with their OP gear to murder me?

    maybe because bullying is a sane and very fulfilling activity for them instead of going into an actual PVP game and have their *** handed to them in a silver plate when everyone is on an even ground....
    Your attitude and misunderstanding of the concept of the DZ does you a massive (pun intended) disservice.

    First of all, the DZ is NOT a PvP arena.

    You most definitely also have an option to not get bullied by a group of 4 heros (sic) waiting for you. It's called alternative entries and adequate situational awareness.

    But be that as it may, your statements clearly convey the intent of not wanting to understand what the DZ is and what makes it great for a certain subset of the community AND THAT IS OK - I am by no means belittling your choice/thoughts and whether you do indeed understand what the DZ is and just ignore it or whether you don't.

    What I am trying to convey is that the DZ is a gameplay mode that caters for people who understand and accept it for what it is: It is a PK arena with no rules, no mollycoddling, no hand-holding, where 4v1 murder is OK if you are weak enough to get caught.

    It is a Hunter vs Hunted environment, Wolves vs Sheep.

    Have the respect to at least recognize the DZ for what it is: An arena where a certain subset of the community thrive and enjoy. You don't see us coming after your PvE content. Do the same for the DZ.

    If you are a Sheep and cannot understand what it is to be a wolf, or do not want to become a wolf, then stay out and quit attempting to turn the DZ into a Petting Zoo...........it's not gonna happen, thankfully.

    NY DZ roll on!!.
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  2. #12
    CoOp_Gordon's Avatar Senior Member
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    Originally Posted by Goo-Goo-Man Go to original post
    .......
    Everything you said is true GooGoo, BUT this issue is that some gear is locked behind the DZ, where PvE players do not wish to go. And yes, I know that gear is also locked behind the RAID, but that is also basically an area where most of the PvE players do not wish to tread. A looter-shooter that locks loot away behind unpopular content is not a good idea.

    If you read my comments earlier in this thread you will see that I am not "afraid" of the DZ, it is simply an area and playstyle that holds zero interest for me. But I fully understand the mentality of those who do not wish to venture in there. It is no fun for them to have their gear stolen, it is a bad feeling and drives them from the game. The small D2 DZx3 are different to the more open world hunt and evade area that was the D1 DZ. Even as a PvE player I ended up enjoying that one after patch 1.8. I often wonder how D2 would have evolved if one of the DZs was PvE on a weekly rotation. I guess we will never know.
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  3. #13
    Goo-Goo-Man's Avatar Senior Member
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    Originally Posted by CoOp_Gordon Go to original post
    A looter-shooter that locks loot away behind unpopular content is not a good idea....
    So true.

    Don't know why the Devs did not just increase the loot quality/quantity in the DZ or Raid as opposed to having exclusives behind the content, alternatively just have exclusive cosmetic items, but hey, what do I know - I'm just a player and not a developer. But some things are just so damned obvious - makes my head hurt sometimes lol


    Originally Posted by CoOp_Gordon Go to original post
    The small D2 DZx3 are different to the more open world hunt and evade area that was the D1 DZ.
    Again, true.

    And again, a monumental design SNAFU..........

    Man they got the 'Three DZ' concept so wrong it strongly offends my usually thick-skinned sensibilities lol

    I am sincerely hoping the NY DZ gets this right this time around for D2.......


    Tell you what, they desperately need a DZ EFT. Someone with clout needs to at least attempt to talk some sense into whoever is in charge over there........it's bordering on embarrassing after all this time
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  4. #14
    I fail to understand why 85% of DC and 100% of NYC isn't enough PVE.
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  5. #15
    CoOp_Gordon's Avatar Senior Member
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    Originally Posted by D-Y-N-4-M-O Go to original post
    I fail to understand why 85% of DC and 100% of NYC isn't enough PVE.
    Originally Posted by CoOp_Gordon Go to original post
    .........BUT this issue is that some gear is locked behind the DZ, where PvE players do not wish to go........
    .
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  6. #16
    SevenNVD's Avatar Volunteer Moderator
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    Originally Posted by N3mB0t Go to original post
    why do the PVP boys would get upset if i had an option to not get bullied by their group of 4 heros waiting for me at the gates with their OP gear to murder me?

    You could reverse that question, to answer that. If your wish is for more varied PvE content, why does that have to be in the PvEvP area?

    It's okay for kids to play soccer on a tennis court, but you can't expect the tennis players to be happy with that.

    If the wish is for more varied PvE content, it seems that they are working on that, basing on the Skyscaper leaks. Wouldn't t it be better to leave the PvEvP and PvP areas for that content and design the PvE maps just for that?
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  7. #17
    N3mB0t's Avatar Senior Member
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    Originally Posted by Goo-Goo-Man Go to original post
    Your attitude and misunderstanding of the concept of the DZ does you a massive (pun intended) disservice.

    .
    i do understand what the DZ is ,it sounds good on paper but doesnt really works because it allows for player behaviours that should be avoided by game devs IMO,, what i cant understand is as to why someone thought it would be a good idea to have this on a mainly PVE game an on top of that lock content behind it.

    like other user said even on DIV1 where the mode was way better implemented and somewhat fun only 4% of the player base extracted an item, that says a lot, as a dev i would have scratched or completly changed the way to implement PVP in my game , why insist in something that clearly doesnt work well enough to be called a sucessful attempt.

    and i´ve been in there , and no i wasnt brutaly murdered or anything, i was even helped by another solo player that joined me and helped me clear landmarks once , i even reached level 45 just from farming and killing smart agents trying to sneak around to kill me when i was extracting , but i did like the layout of the map and running around it hence why i would like to see this as an extra PVE free of bullys option.

    i see you are very proud of being "THE WOLF" on such a skewed setting, a badly , unbalanced PVP mode in a PVE game... i pity on that , get on serious PVP game and be the wolf there , that yes is something of some merit.

    Originally Posted by D-Y-N-4-M-O Go to original post
    I fail to understand why 85% of DC and 100% of NYC isn't enough PVE.
    i fail to understand why the devs of a PVE game waste time and resources on PVP , being like you said only 15% of the game.
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  8. #18
    CoOp_Gordon's Avatar Senior Member
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    Originally Posted by N3mB0t Go to original post
    ......

    i fail to understand why the devs of a PVE game waste time and resources on PVP , being like you said only 15% of the game.
    Nonetheless, it is probably the part of the game that gets most exposure, via YT vids and the like. So it's basically free advertising. And really, if game mechanics or search for loot don't oblige you to enter it there is absolutely nothing to dislike about it.

    The final set of devs on Div1, Ubi Leamington, effectively rendered arguments against the DZ invalid by removing all the loot gated behind it. Also, they introduced a PvE semi-DZ area in the form of the West Side Pier, together with more activities which gave a glimpse into what the D2 LZ would be like. For the first time since the early rapid decline in the game, player numbers increased and participation in the DZ went up.

    Ubi Leamington, where are you when the game needs you most?
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  9. #19
    N3mB0t's Avatar Senior Member
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    Originally Posted by SevenNVD Go to original post
    You could reverse that question, to answer that. If your wish is for more varied PvE content, why does that have to be in the PvEvP area?

    It's okay for kids to play soccer on a tennis court, but you can't expect the tennis players to be happy with that.

    If the wish is for more varied PvE content, it seems that they are working on that, basing on the Skyscaper leaks. Wouldn't t it be better to leave the PvEvP and PvP areas for that content and design the PvE maps just for that?
    well... a player always wishes for more content, PVE or PVP it doesnt really matter , that is a fact not even related to this particular subject , but what i whished was not to turn the DZ into a PVE only zone , only thing i wished was to have the option to run around that area , that is already done but massively wasted as its almost empty all the time, without the possibility of being raped by someone who thinks that is fun in any way.

    and the "tenis players" arent unhappy because i would be playing football on their court , they are unhappy because they could not get near me , steal my ball , rape me and spit on me,they would have to that to themselves , all 6 of them, so dont fool yourself or try to fool me with those analogies you make that dont even make any sense as in a virtual world like this they could be playing their "tenis" with each others and i could be playing my football at the same time and none of us would know the other is there.
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  10. #20
    Goo-Goo-Man's Avatar Senior Member
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    Originally Posted by N3mB0t Go to original post
    i do understand what the DZ is....
    You do not.

    If you did, you would not say the following:

    Originally Posted by N3mB0t Go to original post
    ......because it allows for player behaviours that should be avoided by game devs IMO.....
    That is the essence of the DZ, to allow for ANY behavior. It is a PK arena after all. It is NOT PvP.

    Originally Posted by N3mB0t Go to original post

    i see you are very proud of being "THE WOLF" on such a skewed setting, a badly , unbalanced PVP mode in a PVE game....
    Pride has nothing to do with it.

    I understand it.

    And again, IT IS NOT a PvP game mode. It is a PK arena with an element of PvE.

    And yes, it is natural for a person to want what another person has, in this instance the 'other' maps utilized for the DZ.

    but i did like the layout of the map and running around it hence why i would like to see this as an extra PVE free of bullys option
    That however does not mean you can have it just because. That would immediately devalue the entire concept. Why on earth would the Devs do that?

    And yeah, if you really believe that there are bullies in the DZ then you obviously still do not grasp the concept.
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