Thanks for the cc status effect nerf! | Forums

[Deltium]

I agree with this nerf, as I personally had a Bashee + Firefly CC build optimized whereby I could keep one or more of the status effects active 100% of the time, and with the Acosta backpack, I would get overcharge as well periodically. It was fun at first to help my team walk through a Heroic mission, but after awhile, it was way too over-powered, and I agree fully with this change. Status effects still work, but they should never have been expected to work this way.

[moodswoods]

I think before nerfing, they should fix the skills to begin with.
Specifically the Firefly bugs out like half of the time in various ways.
So NPCs currently have plenty of breaks anyways.
At least from that skill

But maybe it will be fixed in TU10. At least they acknowledged its on their working list.
https://forums.ubisoft.com/showthrea...n-deploying-it

[RichardOshea]

I.... Status effects still work, but they should never have been expected to work this way.

They should absolutely have been expected to work that way as that is the way they were designed, coded and have been since March. How many times do we intend to accept the: "It wasn't intended that..." argument? It's been trotted out dozens of times now and I 'm starting to wonder of this game isn't just one more unintended consequence; maybe they were trying to open a Bagel shop and all this game just fell out somewhere along the lines?

[xcel30]

I agree with this nerf, as I personally had a Bashee + Firefly CC build optimized whereby I could keep one or more of the status effects active 100% of the time, and with the Acosta backpack, I would get overcharge as well periodically. It was fun at first to help my team walk through a Heroic mission, but after awhile, it was way too over-powered, and I agree fully with this change. Status effects still work, but they should never have been expected to work this way.

Please show me your bleed and OD build viable for legendary and heroic content now, or is your complaint about people spamming blinder firefly? There is more to status effect than those two skills you listed and they killed builds that needed buff akd rework because you threw a tantrum over abusing a meta.

[RichardOshea]

Now we have devs pushing a narrative that these things were not intended to be functional in Heroic or Legendary. I expect them to nerf other skills too now as it looks like (and absolutely sounds like) skill builds are being pushed out of content.

[AgentCoulson64]

Could not agree more. I guess that those red-DPS players that celebrate the CC nerf because it trivialised content are also willing that Massive makes NPC in heroic or legendary resistance to critical damage. This would be a fair change to trivialise the content even less.

[TimesLostArc]

So pretty much the consensus among you all that are celebrating this nerf is that "it will untrivialize Legendary and punish those red DPS players".

Okay. Let me ask you all a question. With NPC's doing so much terrible damage, why haven't healers up to this point really been much of a thing at all compared to Div 1? Why do people avoid playing tank?

The answer is that most healing skills in this game have severe limitations. Either the effect of the heals, the need to be in certain proximity to a slowly healing hive, the heal chem launcher that requires you to aim and expose yourself to NPC's that can often kill you in a single shot, or a number of the other blunderful limitations made to healing to prevent a repeat of Div 1's PvP.

Pretty much at this point if you are going to be healing you are going to be removing 1 damage dealer to lacklusterly support 2 others and a tank.

Also lets mention tanking really quickly. I had to explain this in another thread, but the NPC's in this game all have a threat system just like very other MMORPG on the planet. Pretty much you have to be really obnoxious to be targeted over another player who is running glass cannon.

If healing and tanking didn't exist so terribly in this game, maybe you might have more people willing to do these jobs and request them. Personally, I think Tanking and Healing from the WOW perspective was a total waste and a complete mistake that still hangs over the gaming community. People keep expecting heal bots and shoot me signs. It has done severe harm to Overwatch, and most titles make the smart decision to avoid them when possible.

Lets stop lying to ourselves, you all want tanks and healers to be a thing. None of you are asking why a person should sacrifice doing damage and feeling like they have an impact on play to be your healbot or shoot me sign. I see this pattern keep popping up in other titles when Tanks and Healers are attempted to be introduced. Everything gets nerfed to bring in the Shoot-Me Signs and Healbots.

Also keep in mind that balancing tanks and healers in a PvP game is a nightmare. No one likes to play them unless they are broken and then it can be a mess. Look at Overwatch...

[scarp99anzz]

Could not agree more. I guess that those red-DPS players that celebrate the CC nerf because it trivialised content are also willing that Massive makes NPC in heroic or legendary resistance to critical damage. This would be a fair change to trivialise the content even less.

Why would the red dps players celebrate something that helped them in legendary missions?

Do you think during the mission I sit there thinking, wish he would stop blinding those NPC's?

Yes it made things easier but its in the game so you get on with it, just like the CC blinder guy will have hoped the red dps guy rolled up with his M1A and not a shotgun to the legendary mission.

[RichardOshea]

None of these changes to skills bodes well for Raid 2.

The devs seem intent on ruling skills out of Legendary and Heroic from dealing any meaningful damage via status effects, and I expect them to go on to nerf skills like Turrets, so most skills builds will be of no use when it comes to DPS, which in turn means that all the DPS has to come from elsewhere. So Raid 2 is looking like a simple DPS check as that damage won't be coming from skill builds who also won't be all that good at CC anymore and whose other skills are too weak to compete. Unless the devs plan for us to heal our way through the Raid whatever damage needs to be done won't be coming from any form of skill or shield build. So it's still just an M1A game.

[TimesLostArc]

None of these changes to skills bodes well for Raid 2.

The devs seem intent on ruling skills out of Legendary and Heroic from dealing any meaningful damage via status effects, and I expect them to go on to nerf skills like Turrets, so most skills builds will be of no use when it comes to DPS, which in turn means that all the DPS has to come from elsewhere. So Raid 2 is looking like a simple DPS check as that damage won't be coming from skill builds who also won't be all that good at CC anymore and whose other skills are too weak to compete. Unless the devs plan for us to heal our way through the Raid whatever damage needs to be done won't be coming from any form of skill or shield build. So it's still just an M1A game.

They want tanks and healers. To be honest the 2 sets they have not opted to nerf are somewhat nicely designed. I can tell they tried to put some care into Foundry and Future Initiative. I feel bad trashing healers and tanks when it is obvious that the devs are trying to give these 2 gear sets a chance.

Healing itself can be a rough thing to test especially for solos. Getting groups together on the PTS is difficult.

I don't like that they nuked status effects for heroic and legendary. I think it was pandering to an extent, but Eclipse would overshine the other 2 sets if they didn't. Besides some people need to realize the consequences of what they ask for before they are finally forced to relent.

The problem in the current raid is that Damage Skills get nerfed really quickly. They nerfed the fire turret precisely because there was a tactic to use it to block doorways. A lot of skills when proved effective get nerfed. It is obvious that the devs want more Tank or Healer styles to be valid over Damage Skill builds. Notice the higher buffs on Skill heals vs Skill Damage. Too bad all of the healing skills are intentionally softened for PvP and it severely weakens them tactically for PvE in turn.

I heard a story about a clan that actually tried to force their members to use Tanks and Healers in the raid. I think it was an almost equal balance as well. A member of my clan came in to assist them. The person in question has 300+ Raid completes from before WONY and 100+ after. He is an extremely experienced raider. Anyway this clan's attempt was an unmitigated disaster in Dark Hours. They could not make it past Boomer. The simple reason was the healers and Tanks could not control the adds. Neither could do enough damage to boomer to max out his 4 stages. Pretty much the Adds kept adding up and then boomer always ended the party by breaking the turrets.

So we are to try to have this in the upcoming raid and force it on legendary. Future Initiative has a lot of damage boost, but the problem is that it requires a team to be at full armor. Good luck with that when you have hives that heal slowly or chem launchers that dissipate quickly only to run out of charges. Will the Devs have to lower the Armor and Health of the bosses to compensate for this. Will legendary have to be nerfed as far as NPC Armor and Health? They may not plan to do so now, but I really wonder how things will go when trying to make this work in the hardest difficulty in groups starts to play out.

Will strong skills and builds on paper fail when exposed to the content itself?