Versatile/vigilance backpack talent are too strong | Forums

[Min90.]

If we are trying to increase overall TTK, we should also be tweaking these talents in pvp modes.

Versatile:
Right now, I'm 2 shotting full blue builds using a shotgun combined with versatile as a 4 blue/2 red build. I can also drop these people under a second using a vector with versatile. This talent is way too strong with smgs, shotguns, and rifles giving 35% amplified damage (multiplicative) on intended ranges. It is letting tanky builds go around KOing other tanks under a second. Keep in mind TU10 will likely bring significant base damage buffs to shotguns and smgs. There won't be any meaning to increasing TTK if players are still getting blown up under a second. Compare this talent to something like concussion which gives moderate 10% weapon damage (additive) with headshot on top of duration restriction which is still rewarding enough to decisively change the outcome of an encounter. Versatile doesn't require you to track your aim on the head, you just swap weapon before turning the corner or peeking for ridiculous 35% amp damage boost which is more than what glass cannon gives.

Vigilance:
Overall balanced trait compared to versatile. My issue is its interaction with the bulwark shield (even more toxic if using vanguard) that basically covers the player's whole hitbox sparing their feet and right hand(when shooting pistol) The shield allows them to basically nullify the drawback of vigilance talent, letting tanky shield users KO people under a second by retaining the vigilance buff in a fire fight. In fact, this talent is a big perpetrator in the current pistols outgunning primary weapon issue. By design, this talent should only reward those who utilize covers well or be used to punish people pushing 2v1/bad positions.
One way to tackle this is that as soon as a player brings up their bulwark shield, vigilance should get turned off in pvp only.

[Agent_Putt]

This is more related to shotguns being overly tuned for PvP for the versatile talent

And youre behind a SHIELD for vigilance are you kidding me? Why should vigilance not proc when your shield is taking damage.

Damage builds dont really benefit from this cos the standard shield is very weak. Plus the whole point of the shield is you cant take cover anyway so theres a huge con to that.

[LUXE75]

Yes that need nerf but only for shotgun i think

[K.A.0.S]

I agree. The Versatile talent must be nerfed for SMG and shotgun.
For opponents with a shield, just shoot him in the arm or leg to remove 25% of the buff damage. Better yet, use pulse.

[Quantum.9]

If we are trying to increase overall TTK, we should also be tweaking these talents in pvp modes.

Versatile:
Right now, I'm 2 shotting full blue builds using a shotgun combined with versatile as a 4 blue/2 red build. I can also drop these people under a second using a vector with versatile. This talent is way too strong with smgs, shotguns, and rifles giving 35% amplified damage (multiplicative) on intended ranges. It is letting tanky builds go around KOing other tanks under a second. Keep in mind TU10 will likely bring significant base damage buffs to shotguns and smgs. There won't be any meaning to increasing TTK if players are still getting blown up under a second. Compare this talent to something like concussion which gives moderate 10% weapon damage (additive) with headshot on top of duration restriction which is still rewarding enough to decisively change the outcome of an encounter. Versatile doesn't require you to track your aim on the head, you just swap weapon before turning the corner or peeking for ridiculous 35% amp damage boost which is more than what glass cannon gives.

Vigilance:
Overall balanced trait compared to versatile. My issue is its interaction with the bulwark shield (even more toxic if using vanguard) that basically covers the player's whole hitbox sparing their feet and right hand(when shooting pistol) The shield allows them to basically nullify the drawback of vigilance talent, letting tanky shield users KO people under a second by retaining the vigilance buff in a fire fight. In fact, this talent is a big perpetrator in the current pistols outgunning primary weapon issue. By design, this talent should only reward those who utilize covers well or be used to punish people pushing 2v1/bad positions.
One way to tackle this is that as soon as a player brings up their bulwark shield, vigilance should get turned off in pvp only.

I agree with you.
In my opinion shields are over tuned now, and have to many support tallents, some of them make shield invournable, boost the armor, boost dmg and so on.
Simple logic would suggest that while having shield that protect most of your body or whole body, you should not have the same or higher dmg, like you have without it.

[As1r0nimo]

You have EMP for that.
And if the enemy goes into HP, than he has lower Crits/HSD.

[LUXE75]

Emp cooldown 26secondes and some that dont work, shield cooldown 8secondes and work with how many you have. Its just to much

[x_Atompilz_x]

Versatile + super 90 ist the only val7able Option to vounter shield builds besides high Armor pestilence builds

[Min90.]

Shields are overtuned as well. We have a separate thread discussing that. Also full red builds absolutely benefit from vigilance and bulwark shield interaction using vanguard whichbmakes the shield invulnerable for 5 seconds. EMP is an option, but unfortunately it is very inconsistent and does not always destroy the shield. Emp also takes about a second to go off due to animstion which is enough time for full red vigilance to 1-2 shot you using high base damage pistol like liberty (regulus and even higher base dmg and consistent recoil). You can try to preemptively emp before engaging but the shield user can also run their own emp to negate yours lol. Vigilance is just too strong with bulwark shield.

[PrettyFlack0_]

They need to nerf the dmg of versatile to like 20% or 25% like vigilance