Both Male and Female Eivor are canon | Forums

[NrVr7]

As far as Eivor being a female name ...... 99% of people would have never known if someone hadn't made a big deal out of it ......

The name won't change how the game itself plays so who cares? That's the way I look at it ......

“What's in a name? That which we call a rose by any other name would smell as sweet”

- Shakespeare

What sensible, or intelligent answer do you expect with arguments like that honestly?

[SixKeys]

For this last point I do not know what to think about it, it is clear that you are affected because it is the opinion of your daughters, we lose a little the "reason" side in contexts like these, but why not explain to your daughter that the game tells a story? Like a book, because that's the whole thing of Assassin's Creed, initially, to tell a story

Just because his opinion is informed by the fact that he is a father to girls doesn't mean his "reason" is compromised any more than yours is as someone who is not in the same position. Having children of the opposite gender often simply means being able to empathize more with them than before. Before you never have to concern yourself with questions like "why don't more women play games?". After you become a father and your girl says she doesn't want to share in your hobby because she feels excluded, you learn to look at it from a different point of view. He wants to include his daughter in his hobby. He wants her to feel like she's not just an afterthought to game developers. He has to look at the sadness or boredom in her face when he pulls out yet another Generic Action Man title from his library. It's just pure empathy.

The problem with the "it's all about telling a story" approach is that when the entire games industry is comprised mainly of straight, white male devs, the stories we tend to get are always told from that perspective. Do we really need the umpteenth "angry man wants revenge for his dead/kidnapped wife/daughter"? Are those really the only types of stories games can tell? Are those the only shoes worth walking in for 200+ hours? What message does it send to girls when the only role women ever get to play is as the catalysts or supporting characters for men's adventures? If it's all about telling the same stories from the same perspective over and over and over again, why do people remain surprised that more women don't identify as gamers?

[JKAC2013]

I think that people often overact because the gender. Just look at Horizion Zero Dawn it got praised by so many people and had a strong female protagonist. Why is Ubisoft so afraid to make a game just about a Female Protagonist? I know its because of the sales...

Also in the current situation we have no real "gender" in Odyssey no matter what you choose you got treaten like a gender neutral character and it will be the same in Valhalla i think. Whats the point of having a choice when only the VA and Character Modell change?

[RHYLASS]

LOL Ubisoft are you here? Anyone at home?

[NrVr7]

Just because his opinion is informed by the fact that he is a father to girls doesn't mean his "reason" is compromised any more than yours is as someone who is not in the same position. Having children of the opposite gender often simply means being able to empathize more with them than before. Before you never have to concern yourself with questions like "why don't more women play games?". After you become a father and your girl says she doesn't want to share in your hobby because she feels excluded, you learn to look at it from a different point of view. He wants to include his daughter in his hobby. He wants her to feel like she's not just an afterthought to game developers. He has to look at the sadness or boredom in her face when he pulls out yet another Generic Action Man title from his library. It's just pure empathy.

The problem with the "it's all about telling a story" approach is that when the entire games industry is comprised mainly of straight, white male devs, the stories we tend to get are always told from that perspective. Do we really need the umpteenth "angry man wants revenge for his dead/kidnapped wife/daughter"? Are those really the only types of stories games can tell? Are those the only shoes worth walking in for 200+ hours? What message does it send to girls when the only role women ever get to play is as the catalysts or supporting characters for men's adventures? If it's all about telling the same stories from the same perspective over and over and over again, why do people remain surprised that more women don't identify as gamers?

Do you have a child I'm not talking about being informed, but about being more in feeling than logic, which father or mother would not be in feeling when his daughter or son tells him something like that? We want the best for our children and that's normal, but getting out of logic and reason is not a reliable view of things


For your question on "why do women not play" do you REALLY think this is the problem? I have seen women playing "man" games and with men (Rainbow Six, different JRPG etc ...) on the other hand, I have not seen many women in the development strangely, it could Does it mean that what you are trying to demonstrate simply does not exist? (That we are totally all the same) There is only you who sees the characters of AC as "generic action man", it is enough to see Arno, Ezio, Altaïr for example they are generic action man?

Ok I'm going to pass your delusion of "straight white male developer" what is this underlying discrimination ( Besides being totally wrong, but hey, looking for who develops the games must be too complicated for the people coming out with these arguments (I let you search for the teams of the first AC and the current teams of Ubisoft) )

@JKAC2013 = Some AC had "female protagnist", things is that you don't just want to get some female protagonist (and important female even when the protagoniste is male), you just want to play female everywhere

[SixKeys]

Do you have a child I'm not talking about being informed, but about being more in feeling than logic, which father or mother would not be in feeling when his daughter or son tells him something like that? We want the best for our children and that's normal, but getting out of logic and reason is not a reliable view of things

Like I said before, being able to understand why your daughter/sister/wife would feel left out because they don't see enough representation in gaming doesn't mean his logic or reasoning has been compromised by emotional attachment, it's just basic human empathy. If all games only ever featured female characters and a male friend told me he doesn't like playing games because of that, I wouldn't tell him to just get over it, I would say "yeah, that does suck, actually. Hey, what if we played this other cool game that has a male character instead?"

I have seen women playing "man" games and with men (Rainbow Six, different JRPG etc ...) on the other hand, I have not seen many women in the development strangely, it could Does it mean that what you are trying to demonstrate simply does not exist? (That we are totally all the same) There is only you who sees the characters of AC as "generic action man", it is enough to see Arno, Ezio, Altaïr for example they are generic action man?

There are plenty of female developers. Maybe you're just not looking hard enough? Jade Raymond was instrumental in creating Assassin's Creed, after all.

However, there is truth in what you're saying in that many women are rejected or harassed out of the industry, a problem that also exists in many other fields (STEM). It's not a question of women not wanting to be developers - there are quite a lot of them working on indie projects - it's that the industry is still not as welcoming to women as it could be.

As for Generic Action Man, I'm mainly referring to this:


Recently we are starting to see more and more games with protagonists that don't all look like carbon copies of each other, which is great! Having more diverse haracters creates opportunities for more diverse story-telling. And interesting stories are what's most important, right?

The unfortunate thing about AC having gender choice isn't the existence of the choice itself, it's that there is no difference in how the character's story actually plays out, even though it's unlikely that a woman in ancient Greece would have been treated exactly the same as her male counterpart. I enjoy playing as a female character, but a game like Odyssey doesn't actually give the player the experience of being a woman - the actual roleplaying aspect, which in a roleplaying game should be quite important.

Compare Odyssey to AC Liberation which was told from the POV of Aveline, a mixed-race woman in 18th century New Orleans. Being half-black, she was not equally respected among her white peers, so she could disguise herself as a slave and blend in. However, being half-white, she still had enough privilege that allowed her to attend events for the nobility, so she could blend in there too. Liberation is a fantastic example of actually putting the player in a woman's shoes in a historical setting, not just writing a generic story that works for both genders. That's the kind of approach I want to see more of going forward. Unfortunately, the RPG direction by its very nature prevents these kinds of unique stories from being told, which is why it feels creatively compromised.

[NrVr7]

Like I said before, being able to understand why your daughter/sister/wife would feel left out because they don't see enough representation in gaming doesn't mean his logic or reasoning has been compromised by emotional attachment, it's just basic human empathy. If all games only ever featured female characters and a male friend told me he doesn't like playing games because of that, I wouldn't tell him to just get over it, I would say "yeah, that does suck, actually. Hey, what if we played this other cool game that has a male character instead?"



There are plenty of female developers. Maybe you're just not looking hard enough? Jade Raymond was instrumental in creating Assassin's Creed, after all.

However, there is truth in what you're saying in that many women are rejected or harassed out of the industry, a problem that also exists in many other fields (STEM). It's not a question of women not wanting to be developers - there are quite a lot of them working on indie projects - it's that the industry is still not as welcoming to women as it could be.

As for Generic Action Man, I'm mainly referring to this:


Recently we are starting to see more and more games with protagonists that don't all look like carbon copies of each other, which is great! Having more diverse haracters creates opportunities for more diverse story-telling. And interesting stories are what's most important, right?

The unfortunate thing about AC having gender choice isn't the existence of the choice itself, it's that there is no difference in how the character's story actually plays out, even though it's unlikely that a woman in ancient Greece would have been treated exactly the same as her male counterpart. I enjoy playing as a female character, but a game like Odyssey doesn't actually give the player the experience of being a woman - the actual roleplaying aspect, which in a roleplaying game should be quite important.

Compare Odyssey to AC Liberation which was told from the POV of Aveline, a mixed-race woman in 18th century New Orleans. Being half-black, she was not equally respected among her white peers, so she could disguise herself as a slave and blend in. However, being half-white, she still had enough privilege that allowed her to attend events for the nobility, so she could blend in there too. Liberation is a fantastic example of actually putting the player in a woman's shoes in a historical setting, not just writing a generic story that works for both genders. That's the kind of approach I want to see more of going forward. Unfortunately, the RPG direction by its very nature prevents these kinds of unique stories from being told, which is why it feels creatively compromised.

I'm not sure I understand this argument, because it seems to me really close to nothing if I understood it correctly, what kind of person will play more a game for the character than there is on the screen, there we do not not so careful (back 3/4 of the back, and we look elsewhere)

It will be like wanting to play Portal only because it is about a woman, whereas it is a game in fps

So you say yourself that there are female developers, and that in addition they have a crucial role, and it's up to me to find out? I really do not understand where you are coming from, your ideas are really disturbing, because contradictory, and the worst is that people like you seem to want women, because they are women, what to be a woman should prevail over being competent? (And don't let me say what I didn't say, competent women there are)

I would not even respond to these stupidities, sorry to say so, that is "rejection" etc ... we put them forward much more than any other reason

For the Generic Action Man, yes indeed if you put the same character several times it will quickly be generic I confirm it to you, I find that moreover dishonest, moreover some have nothing to do, you put the character from GTA IV, who is a Serb, but what seems to bother you is only the color of your skin, and that has a name, and we call it racism

For what follows I rather agree I would say, a woman in ancient Greece would surely not have been treated in the same way, the same for Aveline, but hey you have to make a choice, either create a story for a character and do it well, be created the possibility for players to make their own choice, but in this case, well it requires concessions

[SUGACOMA]

Just because his opinion is informed by the fact that he is a father to girls doesn't mean his "reason" is compromised any more than yours is as someone who is not in the same position. Having children of the opposite gender often simply means being able to empathize more with them than before. Before you never have to concern yourself with questions like "why don't more women play games?". After you become a father and your girl says she doesn't want to share in your hobby because she feels excluded, you learn to look at it from a different point of view. He wants to include his daughter in his hobby. He wants her to feel like she's not just an afterthought to game developers. He has to look at the sadness or boredom in her face when he pulls out yet another Generic Action Man title from his library. It's just pure empathy.

The problem with the "it's all about telling a story" approach is that when the entire games industry is comprised mainly of straight, white male devs, the stories we tend to get are always told from that perspective. Do we really need the umpteenth "angry man wants revenge for his dead/kidnapped wife/daughter"? Are those really the only types of stories games can tell? Are those the only shoes worth walking in for 200+ hours? What message does it send to girls when the only role women ever get to play is as the catalysts or supporting characters for men's adventures? If it's all about telling the same stories from the same perspective over and over and over again, why do people remain surprised that more women don't identify as gamers?

Thank you ... It's humbling to find someone who understands my reasoning .

[gianmariot2]

Why can't Ubisoft just choose a man or a woman and stop with this ridiculous charade? I don't care if the protagonist is a woman. I played with Aveline and Kassandra and Amunet and they're all great. Just tell us a good story and be done with this political correctness nonsense.

[LDS_Darth_Revan]

Why can't Ubisoft just choose a man or a woman and stop with this ridiculous charade? I don't care if the protagonist is a woman. I played with Aveline and Kassandra and Amunet and they're all great. Just tell us a good story and be done with this political correctness nonsense.

No.
Also having choices isn't SJW nonsense as you put it. That doesn't even make ay sense.