Member
Debate me, skeletons.
I believe it is not unreasonable to ask for an explanation of intent behind recent balance changes. I don’t think that Redlynx should have to explain every move ever, but there are some changes recently with regards to card balance that are really starting to make people wonder. A detailed explanation of the following decisions would be appreciated:
Swarm buffs - why? Swarm wasn’t held back by it’s lack of damage. Swarm was held back by the omnipresence of Bebe in the metagame. Rats, for example, were quite balanced before the buff. They countered cyborg Kenny and dogpoo and they ate isolated units for breakfast. They acted as a check to Dougie and they burned tanks at a pace that generated fair value. Now, though, swarm focused decks are not just viable but arguably overpowered and without question cheesy. You buffed a useful class of cards used for specific reasons in the meta (which encouraged healthy decision making) into a catch all card for whatever threat one faces. Why buff swarm units instead of, say, nerf Bebe cards? If not nerfing Bebe cards directly, why not consider some changes that would weaken Bebe indirectly... like strengthening or introducing more back-of-board types of removal?
Dougie damage nerfs - seriously? Dougie is the biggest love/hate card in the game. I get that. It’s also the biggest risk/reward card in the game. Most checks and counters to this card - which every theme has access to - are at worst energy neutral and in most cases they produce an energy advantage vs Dougie. The mystic epic assassins, all forms of direct removal (UC, Transmogrify, LB, FB, AS), swarm, mind control (the card and the charged ability from Timmy), etc etc etc. all neutralize Dougie with ease. Ignoring the fact that a buff to swarm is already a nerf to Dougie, and also ignoring that the new superhero theme has several answers to Dougie... why didn’t you nerf Dougie’s HP to allow common and rare assassins to one shot Dougie similar to how the epic assassins already do? THAT would’ve been a huge nerf that would’ve preserved the risk/reward aspect of the card. Keep the powerfist freeze nerf, that was fair. But by nerfing damage your run into situations where it takes 3 hits to take a bar - which is basically impossible unless your opponent is tanking or just DCed. You removed the risk/reward aspect of the card. Why take this course of action instead of, say, the HP nerf I proposed as an alternative?
There are other questionable balance moves too. You over buffed Sharon. She is on every adventure deck now. The balance changes made recently are not allowing for organic meta development. You’re just removing or inserting cards into the meta as you see fit with seemingly little regard for trying to build an ecosystem within your game. SPPD has enormous potential as possibly the best mobile freemium game on the market. If you guys can fine tune your balance philosophy and create a metagame that changes in response to usage trends rather than just whatever card RL just buffed... that would be amazing.
Senior Member
I would think it would be as simple as checking usage stats and applying buffs and nerfs as seen fit. Affecting many cards during a season change can at least bring new metas to the table each season instead of keeping all the OP cards OP and all the crappy cards rarely used and if used worth almost nothing.
A list of things they could be working on:
Make lesser scale legendary cards actually feel legendary (Sixth Element Randy, Inuit Kenny, and Call Girl come to mind)
Fix matchmaking, diminish the value in deranking, disallow players from finding opponents who have a terrible connection
Creating in game polls for players to vote on changes. Give power to the players and stop making all the choices no one asked for
Instead they are:
Buffing cards that didn't need buffs
Nerfing cards that didn't need nerfs
Buffing then nerfing then buffing then nerfing the same cards (Swarms and Dougies)
Making the game all shiny and sparkly
Now I am not the biggest RedLynx fan. But I am however a huge South Park fan. And I can almost guarantee Matt and Trey would agree that they want the best qualities in the games based on their show. Obsidian probably had to work really hard to impress Trey specifically to get Stick of Truth the green light. RedLynx is literally fully catering to whales in the most obvious way, clearly by not touching certain cards that players have probably sunk hundreds of dollars into maxing, and not sticking true to the element of balanced GAMING and not giving the South Park name the justice it deserves. If they could actually utilize some of those profits and create a new team which has a sole purpose of thoroughly testing cards and making decisions on balance, we would end up with a heavily improved game that has a lot more variety instead of every season having the same mystical/fantasy bullsh*t being played over and over and over making me pull all my hair out.
That questionable call of the legendary/epic buff was one of the best balance changes in the entirety of the games 2 years of running. If they did more things like that every season instead of just singling out a few cards that people constantly b*tch about whether good or bad we could have some healthy meta changes and finally see some uniqueness in games.
Senior Member
100% agree with this. Lowering the HP but keeping the attack would have been a better solution.Originally Posted by Mamey0 Go to original post
Generally though, at NK level 20, level 6 Dougie still takes a bar in two hits (whichever version it was that hit me yesterday) and will NOT die from arrowstorm level 4. Considering normal assassins DO die from arrowstorm, I think that Dougie should as well. Not sure why he was made to be not only faster than assassins, but also have higher HP, better damage / abilities AND be a headhunter.
Member
Level 6 Dougie survives level 4 Arrowstorm because he is level 6, so is over leveled compared to the Arrowstorm. Level 5 Dougie dies to level 4 Arrowstorm.
Even if level 6 Dougie did die to Arrowstorm, that would’ve been better than nerfing the attack which basically just means you have a level 6 Dougie or you can’t use it at all.
Senior Member
Well, as I said, pretty much all assassins will be killed by a level 4 arrowstorm, but Dougie does not die from it, which doesnt make a lot of sense considering he already has the perk of his warcry and being a headhunter. I dont remember for sure if AS level 4 kills off the mystic epic assassins at level 5 though, but if it doesnt then the zap will.Originally Posted by Mamey0 Go to original post
Where I play in the ladder, level 6 Dougie is a lot more frequent than level 5, and its a lot easier to get a rare card (which can be requested) up to level 6 than it is to get the epic arrow storm up to level 5. So its hard for that particular counter to keep up.
Either way, I think we both can agree that a health nerf would have been better
Senior Member
You do realize they don't won't to admit they f*cked up, right? They just recently buffed all Dougie health, and they don't want to admit what a colossal screw up that was so they figured they would just nerf his attack.
To be fair, I was sick of Dougie taking bars in 1 hit or near 1 hit, so I appreciate their effort. But I have never really personally had a problem with Dougies. Occasionally if played well they can surprise me, but more than 75% of the time they fail to take a bar from me.
So many people want arrowstorm to be an endless counter to cards. But it's really quite an unfair card considering if you could 1 shot a Dougie with it, any other cards on the field are hit as well and you come up with a small to large energy gain over your opponent. You can't address arrowstorm not being able to kill 1 card without addressing how powerful of a card it is. There were times when Dougie was 1 hit with a 4 arrowstorm, and I could take out Dougie, all assassins, all swarms, nearly remove level 4 randy spawned in kids, all for only 4 energy. That's mindless and boring. I actually took arrowstorm out of my deck specifically for how mindless and boring it is. Most spells are mindless and boring, and I can't imagine how much more fun the game would be if they were limited in matches. Then again, combos like Drow Elf and Dougie would be an essential combo in decks.
Senior Member
Well, it all comes down to the themes and cards you are playing. With some decks dealing with Dougies will be easy out of the box.
To be honest, I only mentioned arrow storm since his counters listed it and I happen to know that it doesnt really stop a Dougie at the most common levels (AS 4 and D 6). And because it doesnt make a lot of sense that normal assassins die by it, but Dougie does not.
That being said, I dont really think arrowstorm to stop a dougie is a great counter because from my experience, people usually try to play him as either a first move (surprise you before you are ready or hoping you drew a crummy hand) OR when major pushes in either direction has just failed and the board is cleared and both players are low on energy, hoping you wont be able to get a counter out in time. In both of those cases using arrowstorm is a waste, since Dougie is often alone.
As for arrowstorm in general: I gave it up in exchange for fireball a long time ago but have since been forced to bring it back recently as a result of swarms getting buffed and all the scifi ranged spam decks. Again and again with the rats, T&P, visitors, BHK, warboy / Bradley, etc. Often combined with UC to remove any tank you try to use to stall the push with or regen to make it near impossible to get rid of the spam in time. In those cases, arrowstorm comes in handy. And lets be honest, against most normal decks its quite useless at higher NK levels. Everything except assassins and swarms will survive with hardly a dent. Level 4 GWC/Medusa/WDT/6ER/etc wont care. Nor will level 5 Randies/bhk/santa/slave/etc.
They may not admit they have made a mistake, but if you look at cards like Incan, they have a history of massive buffs as well as subsequent nerfs, so nothing is impossible. And considering the "love" Dougie has been receiving in the forums ever since they buffed him, its impressive they have done nothing for so long. Not even a minor tweak until now.
Senior Member
Dougie has always been risk reward. An attack nerf has lowered the reward. Personally I always liked the idea of having enough game knowledge to play a Dougie when you know your opponent is low on energy, and hated when it was as easy as throwing any 2 cost assassin out to take him. An entire bar did seem a bit overkill though. In the end, I prefer Dougie to spells. Even though I hate both, at least Dougie is a physical card that can but put on the board and needs thought rather than one of the mindless spells. You can just chuck and pray Dougie, but I would give that risk about a 20% success rate (at least against me). Now I feel like he is more on par with Marcus. Marcus doesn't take a phone, but he does lower it significantly if you manage to get 2 attacks off.
I think it's always been fine the way it was. I am a big fan of multiple unit buffs over few unit nerfs. I would rather make other cards viable in the wake of strong cards rather than making the strong cards weak in the wake of other weak cards. Regardless, I still see Dougies (some games even 2 different ones) so I think it would take more than they did to make him stop being played. They should just LEAVE HIM ALONE, and move on to other cards that really deserve some attention.
