Junior Member
We got black prior, a 2 chain boring spammy character, we got hitokiri, another boring 2 chain character, now we getting the viking dude (which btw is a huge disappointment... I was expecting a big, buff, thicc thighs and arms, heavy welding dude with a heavy hammer, with big pelts and fur.... but what do we get? A anorexic dude with a bunnings inflatable hammer) all these characters are just so goddam-simple its ridicules. What's fun in doing light light, light heavy, heavy heavy, heavy light? That is the most boring thing ever! I want a character that takes skill to use, like gladiator, so much mixups, everyone can be unique and fresh! Every glad you vs has their own play style! There is no personality with these new characters. Everyone will play the same... You know why? BECAUSE THERE'S ONLY 2 CHAINS!!!!!!!! You ruined valkyrie and her awesome playstyle with her rework, she was a awesome character with multiple playstyles. The whole point of this thread is, please relies that we dont want 2 chain heroes. Theres just no fun in playing the same playstyle over and over again. Please make the last character a fun, and complex character that can mind game the opponent, with mixups they've never seen before, or combos that you made yourself! And no cheap easy access 400 lights or unblockable spam. Just some unblockables for light damage and that's all it needs. Don't make it rely on spam like conq and black prior... they're not fun for anyone...
Senior Member
1) All heros this year are heavies. heavies do not have "overly complex" kits. They have simple attacks with special properties.
2) Gladiator has zero mix ups. Spamming feint 1000 times doesn't make him mix up intensive. Don't know what makes you think he's skillful either. Hardly anything in this game is.
3) That Valk claim never gets old. Did they remove some things from her kit? sure. Was her kit actually good before? No. The one mix up you lost was the potential to use shield crush in a specific situation. Which I guess is a gold star for you but matters **** all because shield crush was garbage and never confirmed anything.
4) I don't know why you are overly fixated on chains. Chains are not really good on anyone nor have they ever been.
5) I'd actually suggest you learn heros before you speak of them. Black prior isn't "spam." He can be spammed. But his kit has far more going on with it. The fact that he can soft cancel recoveries at pretty much anytime to use bullwark and it's attack is what gives him his personality. His kit is probably the best designed kit the devs have ever made in my honest opinion. It's just sullied by the bug it still has.
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Senior Member
Black Prior has very intense mixups, watch a few Faraam videos or other high level BP videos on youtube to understand him. Light-bash-light works until a certain level, or with a certain latency, after that, you need more. I love mirrors when they constantly whiff lights into bash and feed me my bulwark counters (and usually say wow midair). I don't know about your skill, but I really bet you don't know much about bp if you think he is not complex.
Gladiator is very far from complex. He has chains, long chains, but when was the last time you could use your third or fourth light? Or the second? Feint five heavies, light, get a zone or toestab in, and that's it- some glads are very good, but his only viable parts in his kit are his heavies, his toestab (kinda), and his zone. He is avarage in difficulty, and I must say they all play the same, with very little differences.
Here is the avarage shinobi's complete arsenal: light-light-backflip, cautiously walk up, light-light, backflip, charging ranged attack which is mainly a joke since you can't throw them out, dodge close-kick that easily dodged-backflip, turtling for op punishes, running away if anything is at least a little uncomfortable, repeat. He is a walking exploit. An officer with a 10 seconds cd on crossbow would be a more interesting playable character. Shaolin is kinda fine, but usually that is quite simple too: fast light-qi mixup-repeat.
Senior Member
I agree, I want more mix up intensive heroes with a bigger/more complex moveset.
I wonder what year 4 will bring?
Supposedly a second cataclysm was happening, right? That's why the harbingers rose up, I think?
Maybe in year 4 we might expect less edgy and heavy heroes as this year was filled with them? If they're not going to pull a full year of reworks again 🤔
After seeing "testing grounds" and spectator mode, my vision of For Honor's future has brightened up a bit.
Senior Member
I've always love heroes with a bigger kit and some specific mooves.
Heroes giving me this special feeling to use are : Valk (CC/deflect, Shield tackle, sweep, wallspalt light), Shaman (jump attack tracking, bleed, bite), Glad (deflect follow up, parry follow up, toe stab, zone, heavy with no GB vulnerability), Shaolin (teleport feats, CC, sweep), Musha (side heavy with no GB vulnerability, deadly feint, BB options) and Kensei (Lots of softfeints, top sup block, dodge GB).
I do like Shinobi a lot because he is a high skills ceiling heroe but just for fun Times to Times. But at my level of play it became very hard to bait people into range GB plus the recent nerf i am.not sure to touch him again.
I also love HL kit but he is far too static for me.. i like mobile heroes.. at least a minimum.
But it is needed to have very opposite kind of heroes for the simple reason than some as you, Rott or me do like complex heroes but some people enjoy really simple one as WL for example.
Anyway, while i agree Hito kit is pretty much limited, BP and Jormun are more mix up intensive despite having a 2 hit chain.
I do enjoy BP sometimes and even played him a lot recently because it feels good to get some Bullwark counter and CC with him and he is very tanky. His mix up if properlly used is very intensive and the same looks to be true for Jormun.
Junior Member
I've never read something more ******ed in my life. First off, you say heavies are supposed to be simple heroes? Whys that? Is that a rule? Is there a rule that says certain classes need to be this? If that is the case, look at assassins, they're supposed to be fast, light damage and swiftly. Look at berserker. Why does a assassin have the most hyper armor of all classes? That's supposed to be a heavy class role! But your logic means he shouldn't exist!!
Secondly, perfect example of good mixup gladiator is look at Kingmisty on youtube. That punch allowes you do alot of things, heavy feint into punch into zone, or dash light, or maybe a normal light, or mix It up with more punches or zones. So yes. Using unblockables does count as mixups. Because they allow him to enter more complex stuff that makes the opponent guessing what he's doing next.
Thirdly, I bet you never used old valk, you probably joined yesterday. Old valk made the opponent thinking, yes sure, back then everyone wasn't as skilled as today, however if they just kept the same move set but buffed her damage, and give her a better shield bash then she would be the best character in the game, by far the best.
4, wtf you talking about kid? "Chains aren't good for anyone" did you hit your head onto concrete when you were born? Everyone in this game has chains, everyone needs chains, the less chains characters have the more predictable they are. Look at hitokiri, she's either gonna do a late heavy, or a normal heavy, a light into another delayed light, or a heavy, since she doesn't have much of a moveset she cannot be different, there for people can learn and counter her super easily.
5 his character is reliant on shield bash, and since its bugged he is spammy. Since he only has 2 chains, 2 super slow lights and slow heavies, don't think letting them out will land a hit. The only thing he has is feinting the unblockable attack into, you guessed it, a shield bash or a gb. Sure the bulwark stance is unique, and makes him different from all the rest, most people who use black prior rarely use it. And for the people that do, cool, get better at it, however if you're not good at it, guess what? It's back to using that boring 2 chain character of yours.
Senior Member
Senior Member
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Originally Posted by Xeith98zz Go to original post
The Shinobi moveset is garbage, most of it relies on the Kick and the Kick relies on the Double Dash. Since the Double Dash has slow animations that telegraph his attacks, it gives opponents plenty of time to react to movesets. His top heavy attack is also incredibly slow and easy to parry, which means that the only real option is to use a lot Double Light attacks which can't effectively stack with other combos. and requires making distance with a backflip most of the time since the Shinobi becomes vulnerable to being opened up immediately after his Double Lights ends..
The Double Dash is so slow and easily vulnerable to being countered that players are even able to Guard-Break him out of the Double Dash while he's still in mist form before he even gets a chance to launch the kick. It is utterly stupid that he can be GB while dodging, which doesn't really happen to other heroes.
And since the Shinobi was nerfed into the ground with this latest patch, his movesets are now even less viable. The mix ups are far too punishable and reactable to be considered "robost."
I say all of this as someone who has a Rep 28 Shinobi, most of his attacks are a complete liability to use in 1v1 fights, you practically have to spend the entire fight waiting for the opponent to make a mistake, like if they whiff an attack. But if the Shinobi makes a mistake, then he will likely end up instantly out of stamina or dragged to the ground with his own hook, which is a death sentence for a low health hero with no effective defensive capability.
This Nerfed Shinobi has no choice but to play it incredibly safe and cautiously, so you're not going to be seeing a lot of those movesets after this patch. You can expect to see the Nerfed Shinobi running away from 1v1 fights and mostly just trying to gank distracted or vulnerable opponents in Dominion.
