🛈 Announcement
Greetings! The Division forums are now archived and accessible in read-only mode, please go to the new platform to discuss the game
  1. #1

    Stash and Crafting Storage - Improving Build Diversity

    This goes along with another post I saw about crafting ...

    The overall storage needs to be reviewed in this game ... The amount of stash space is no where near (I mean orders of magnitude off) the amount of storage needed if you are looking to have multiple loadouts or experiment with different builds (unless you are one of the lucky ones with the RNG), which is something the Ubi team obviously wants us to do because there is a frustration with players seemingly all gravitating towards the same loadout. In order to counter this, there was a massive amount of nerfs and buffs introduced to try and get players to move to a different approach .. when really what was needed is a minor amount of nerfing and buffing, and a massive amount of STORAGE.

    My reasoning for this is simple ... at any point in time there is a meta build, period. Most people, are going to try and get to that build, to see if it fits to their style while at the same time keeping their current. Well, with limited storage, and RNG that makes finishing for a perfect roe in ESO look like an couple second activity, players are forced to save pieces that will help them get to that meta ... leaving almost no storage for additional experimental builds that they also want to work on. It isn't just as simple as saying that you will only keep your highest DTE for masks for example, because you need to factor in colors ... talents .. brandsets .. etc. Not to mention, when you recalibrate, you destroy your piece right? So people will also chase backups just in case ... I know I do. All the sudden you end up with multiple pieces everywhere and your storage is full. That kills my buzz of wanting to try any other builds because my all I can do is sort my new loot against the meta stash and upgrade where I can .. no room for experimentation.

    On the crafting side ... this is also an issue. With RNG still being the same, there needs to be a serious upgrade on materials. I get it, it doesn't make sense to give us like 10,000 mat capacity because I would likely get a very usable piece in little time by just holding down the X button. At max levels (including brandset material) .. I was able to craft six items before I ran dry. Sure I can go out and farm for most mats, and and I am ok with that .. but the brandset materials just kill it. I mean 8 materials (out of 50) to craft and you only get 1 to one back? It could literally be days for me to get enough brandset mats to try to craft another piece again ... that is just not cool. Brandset being 400 to me would be the best compromise because after 6 or so you run out of regular mats and you can go farm for them again ... and as you are doing this ... possibly pick up more brandset .. but even if you don't .. you have enough to do this run about 7 times before you run out of brandset mats .. and that is if you did it straight through .. most people would do a mat run one or two back to back, but that is it ... so when they move over to other activities, they can slowly recover from the 8 to 1 ratio of brandset material requirements

    Just a thought ... but I mean .. stash and crafting storage ... no development, no PTS ... just storage would have such a huge impact.

    What do you guys think?
     1 people found this helpful
    Share this post

  2. #2
    Uhnomuhlee's Avatar Banned
    Join Date
    May 2019
    Posts
    1,632
    I agree there should be a change, but additional storage space is a temporary fix to a long term problem. It is very much NOT the answer. The community should be careful in asking for this. Massive does listen, and if we get this, we will be right back to square one shortly after the change.

    Now that crafting has a use, the cost of crafting needs to be lowered. The max capacity is irrelevant to the amount of time needed to farm. If I have 150 max stash space for mats, but it takes me 20 minutes to farm enough for one recal or craft, then that amount of time is the same whether I have 50, 100, or 150 max stash space for said mats.

    As far as recalibrating, having 200 items to sift through compared to 100 actually would take MORE time to manage. A better solution, would be to have seperate stashes holding attributes and talents. That way, there would be less time spent perusing your assets and it would be easier to look at your haul after a session and say, "I need this" or "I don't need this".

    I promise you, if stash space is increased, it will fix nothing.
    Share this post

  3. #3
    moesuvious's Avatar Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Posts
    5,373
    yeah, they need to lower the crafting materials for sure or do something. As far as the stash space, an easy thing to do may be to simply not count any piece that is tied to a loadout. I think that would give us plenty of room for more gear without adding another 50-100 spots just to get filled up with more junk. While I do get so tired of seeing 100/100, id probably just quit if it said 200/200!!
    Share this post

  4. #4
    As Ohnomuhlee suggests it would be a temporary change at best. Without solving the fundamental issues that are how RNG creates an item on the fly we would only magnify the problem by an equal order of magnitude. More stash, more sorting, more RNG and more of a problem.

    Crafting can get the green light right now as that wouldn't have the consequences that more stash space might create. Plus one from me on that with the only caveat being a need for a discussion on quantities to be had.
    Share this post

  5. #5
    moesuvious's Avatar Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Posts
    5,373
    Originally Posted by RichardOshea Go to original post
    As Ohnomuhlee suggests it would be a temporary change at best. Without solving the fundamental issues that are how RNG creates an item on the fly we would only magnify the problem by an equal order of magnitude. More stash, more sorting, more RNG and more of a problem.

    Crafting can get the green light right now as that wouldn't have the consequences that more stash space might create. Plus one from me on that with the only caveat being a need for a descusssion on quantities to be had.
    Richard....did you figure out your stuff with your skill build? I didnt get a chance to copy my build last night but if you still need it ill make sure to get it done tonight.
    Share this post

  6. #6
    Originally Posted by Uhnomuhlee Go to original post
    I agree there should be a change, but additional storage space is a temporary fix to a long term problem. It is very much NOT the answer. The community should be careful in asking for this. Massive does listen, and if we get this, we will be right back to square one shortly after the change.

    Now that crafting has a use, the cost of crafting needs to be lowered. The max capacity is irrelevant to the amount of time needed to farm. If I have 150 max stash space for mats, but it takes me 20 minutes to farm enough for one recal or craft, then that amount of time is the same whether I have 50, 100, or 150 max stash space for said mats.

    As far as recalibrating, having 200 items to sift through compared to 100 actually would take MORE time to manage. A better solution, would be to have seperate stashes holding attributes and talents. That way, there would be less time spent perusing your assets and it would be easier to look at your haul after a session and say, "I need this" or "I don't need this".

    I promise you, if stash space is increased, it will fix nothing.
    I think we might be talking about different things. The time to farm absolutely comes into the picture, and in no way did I say that we should increase the the general mats (carbon, steal, electronics ..etc) ... what I did say was to update the brand set space with regards to crafting. That is not a fixed farm, and an 8 to 1 ratio of using 8 pieces, and only getting one back if you break it down. It could literally be days or a week on the high end before you get enough materials back to craft just one piece. Now imagine if you crafted 5 pieces, which is not outside the realm of possibility because RNG is not going to give you something perfect on the first roll ... you will need to craft several and recalibrate to get your desired state. Now those five pieces cost you 40 brand set mats ... and if you only get five back from breaking them down .. that is not even enough to craft one piece .. that isn't right. If, however you had the same storage for the brand set, say 400 .. then I can craft my five and still have enough materials to allow me to craft more each day for the week .. rather than waiting multiple days to craft a single item again. All the while, building back up my reserves as the week goes along. It keeps the momentum of the game moving along, rather than coming to a literal dead stop.

    On the stash side .. I can see where the organization could be better as you are mentioning. My idea would be having the ability to set a threshold of values, or having an auto type of stash / favorite if a certain attribute is within lets say 5% of your max would be cool ... However, it would not solve the fact that you cannot support multiple meta builds per character with RNG the way it is ... there isn't enough space for one, unless you have very good luck on the RNG side. You cannot just organize things by color or talents as you are mentioning .. because how would you do that? I mean, lets say you have storage for blues, reds, yellows ... and hard hitting and devastating for example. What happens if a piece has a red and devastating? Where would that be stored? What if it was yellow and blue? Would you put it in one or the other or create a yellow blue stash? You would have 9 stashes for just colors alone! ... the complexity there is way more difficult than just giving more storage and allowing everybody to determine their own strategy for filtering.

    Just my opinion
    Share this post

  7. #7
    Originally Posted by moesuvious Go to original post
    Richard....did you figure out your stuff with your skill build? I didnt get a chance to copy my build last night but if you still need it ill make sure to get it done tonight.
    Unfortunately I didn't. I'll wait until some of the hotfixes are applied tomorrow. I haven't a build that hasn't been radically altered, for right or wrong, left so I'm also unhappy about that. I need to be patient though, and even left as they are they are still able builds so I am not prevented from doing anything at the moment. Thank you for the consideration though
    Share this post

  8. #8
    moesuvious's Avatar Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Posts
    5,373
    Originally Posted by RichardOshea Go to original post
    Unfortunately I didn't. I'll wait until some of the hotfixes are applied tomorrow. I haven't a build that hasn't been radically altered, for right or wrong, left so I'm also unhappy about that. I need to be patient though, and even left as they are they are still able builds so I am not prevented from doing anything at the moment. Thank you for the consideration though
    Ok. hopefully the hotfixes tomorrow have some effect but ill make sure to make a copy tonight just in case they dont and it can help.
    Share this post

  9. #9
    Originally Posted by RichardOshea Go to original post
    As Ohnomuhlee suggests it would be a temporary change at best. Without solving the fundamental issues that are how RNG creates an item on the fly we would only magnify the problem by an equal order of magnitude. More stash, more sorting, more RNG and more of a problem.

    Crafting can get the green light right now as that wouldn't have the consequences that more stash space might create. Plus one from me on that with the only caveat being a need for a discussion on quantities to be had.
    I completely agree that the RNG needs to be addressed .. but more storage is still required in my opinion. Look at games like Destiny .. they had to increase value space significantly and they went to all standardized rolls for the first part of D2 ... they did this and they did not have the added complexity of recalibration which requires you to keep multiple pieces so they can be combined at some point. And, like D2 .. TD2 shares stash space across characters.

    Also, I think there is a fundamental issue with this discussion in that most people seem to think that there is more sorting needed. Sorting is not the issue at all ... it is a combination of RNG and re-calibration changes that is forcing the need for more storage. For example, I might have 10 masks in stash ... they all have 35% + DTE .. that is the reason I stashed them ... I know this, I don't need to sort this. The reason I have them is because I want to mess with an SMG build so I keep one to burn in to a Sokolov mask when I find one with a red and a blue and hard hitting ... rinse and repeat for each loadout. And no, just keeping one max DTE isn't a solution because each time you move it over you burn the piece .. I don't want to burn my Sokolov mask once I get it the way I like it .. with RNG it would take forever to get it back .. hence you keep more and more pieces to support your multiple loadouts or experimental builds .. and that is where storage becomes an issue. It is straight up storage.


    On the crafting side I agree, it is a simple quantity issue on the brand set side only in my opinion (explained above) .. all other mats seem to be fine.
    Share this post

  10. #10
    Uhnomuhlee's Avatar Banned
    Join Date
    May 2019
    Posts
    1,632
    Originally Posted by riffgod Go to original post
    That is not a fixed farm
    It relatively is now, if I understand you right. Dismantling always yields a piece as of TU5. Lowering crafting costs would generalize to this as well, based on the context of this conversation.

    To further explain alternative stashes, and this has been said many times over so I apologize for not going into detail, but what others in the community have suggested are stashes that hold ONLY attributes and talents. In other words, if you have a gun with optimized on it, and put it into the talent stash, that TALENT would be stored and the gun would cease to exist. Same with attributes. And since this preference is basically already written into the code during recalibration, it should be an easy transition. You wouldn't see actual gear in these stashes, ONLY the characteristic you are trying to save. So when you go to recalibrate, there would be an option to use, say, 1 of 5 ignited talents you have currently stockpiled.

    Sorry for not being more clear.
    Share this post