Senior Member
https://imgur.com/a/yOHOjvh
I think this game deserves about this level of seriousness at this point. No matter how we all feel about this game in terms of what character needs what or how depressing it is to watch pro league I think we can agree we are wasting our breath.
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Senior Member
This is totally not the players' fault. We can make suggestions, we can not make actual changes, that would be the developers' job. They are too afraid of course because you literally can't do anything without at least some players throwing tantrums- the thing is, if they would make stupid decisions over and over, but they would fix them in a few weeks, that would be better than fingercrossing every 3 months to make your main finally playable (there are about 6-7 characters that are on the viable level, which is not fine). If they want to keep this game running, they should first make all characters a good pick, then introduce some decent content available for more money.
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It's never that easy,the casual community will throw a fit and this game will be depopulated in a matter of time if every hero was as balanced as wardenOriginally Posted by Goat_of_Vermund Go to original post
It's either completely give the middle finger to the casuals or the competitive players,or get called the worst and most indecisive dev team for sticking in the middle.It's not a good look.
Senior Member
Casual players mostly play against casual players, so I don't think that making every character that is bad a bit better would really hurt them. There are characters considered quite good even on casual level, like the bp or raider, while the nobushi is horrible on casual level play, while still being an S tier character for the defensive abilities she got. I consider myself pretty casual, I don't think I would throw a tantrum if they would make everyone viable- in fact, raider only infuriates me because I know that they won't make all character that level, and cutting his power back can happen well before they make all characters work.
Some problems are so glaring even casuals will notice it. Despite their neverending complaint about lightspam, we see less and less about orochi, the king of lightspam, either because they learned, they left or they realized how bad he is. And even the casual players watch Faraam, Spliced and other youtubers, and even if I am not able to pull off those light parries all the time, I can understand what is an optionselect, how I can get a punish 100% of the time from a thrown cent punch or how I can always backdodge aramusha's finishers. The game should offer more and more options as you "level up" (in this case, master your class), not less and less because you will realize some of your mixups are suspectible for optionselects.
But whatever they are doing, it can't be as bad as seemingly ignoring the problems. Games like SWTOR can get away with the fact that Jedi Sentinel/Sith Marauder is unviable for years now because it has good PVE and story content, but this is a fighting game, if they do not start balancing it soon, it won't last long.
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There already are characters above raider,what are you talking about? People complained about shugoki's demon embrace for weeks until they learnt rolling existed. And no,people have not stopped complaining about light spam.It still exists in full force in many communities,for example reavyne's discord.Some even suggested making blocking much weaker by giving it a durabilty.Originally Posted by Goat_of_Vermund Go to original post
Ubi isnt' ignoring the problem,but skating on both sides.Obviously this pisses off both the sides.
Senior Member
Did somebody say "MEMES"?!
*heavy breathing*
Ngl Raider has been a menace to deal with mostly due to their stunning tap and his damage overall. The stun lasts very long and allows him to do some major damage. Here on the PS4 it's a slaughterfest whenever there's a Raider. I'll still give him the benefit of the doubt as it can take a long time to adapt, but honestly, I think he's too much and would propose a damage nerf. We'll see, hopefully the devs will address next week what their opinions on the "new" Raider are. It took people a while to adapt to the Wu Lin so I hope it's like this.
It honestly feels like the devs don't know who to cater to: the casual players aka the majority or the competitve players, the minority. Best case scenario the hero/rework is optimal (tournament viable) and nerf cries only happen in the first few weeks (usually from newbies or people that won't adapt). Noob stompers aren't a problem, but if the majority of the community starts having a problem with a character (consistently lose against that character) there is a problem. Not saying this is the case just yet, but from what I've heard from friends and a ton of other players who've been playing this game for over two years Raider is a problem.
Let's hope the devs can reassure us next week as it is the announcement of Season 11 in which unlock rolls supposedly were getting looked at.
Senior Member
Sorry, but that is completely untrue. I don't say a Black Prior or a Warden can't compete with Raider, but he is still slightly better. Black Prior has relatively low damage, and Warden's shoulderbash is suspectible to guardbreak on a good read, and Raider's guardbreak punish is one of the betters (excluding if there is no wall either 10 meters before him or anywhere beside or behind him). Raider's mixups are stronger, as a Peacekeeper player, I can quite clearly understand that even his simplest mixups are quite threatening (the only real difference that Raider deals damage, has longer range, a bit faster softfeint, an unblockable with softfeints, hyperarmor for the second and third heavies, and for that, no 400ms second light, 400ms zone for all his stamina and a bit worse guardbreak punish without walls). I am fairly succesful with the normal pk mixups, Raider has a vastly improved version with all the drawbacks eliminated. I would actually be happy if he would be the standard, but right now, everyone is below him (and I did not even speak about the 4v4 potential, he can take on any role in Breach succesfully and probably better than others, he is better in 1v1 than assassins, he is a great minion killer, he has vast ganking potential with the stampede charge, and even if ganked, he is a character with a good chance with wide and very hard attacks, plus decent feats /well, he also has the slippery, but let's forget its existence/).
As a professional chess player, I can compare this game to chess easily, if you don't know what you watch, you can't really understand what is happening and why it is happening. I did not play in the Alpha test, I did not understand what is so hard in deflecting an orochi top after he feinted two top heavies, I could not really measure the skill of good players and the worth of characters before I got more familiar with the game. I consider myself a high avarage player both here and in professional chess, and I can say that in chess, if you only know the rules and play sometimes casually, you can't understand anything about a grandmaster's game and thinking. You probably don't even know what is the worth of a weak square or an isolated pawn in the game, you will understand the very obvious highlights and gambits only.
Sadly, I don't think this game is forgiving enough for players who will want to pick a character randomly for a few matches after they read their moveset, they will be baited into doing like four side dodge lights and won't understand why the second Black Prior heavy still hit them now matter how well they seemed to dodge it. Those players either learn, adapt and join those who want to improve, or they will leave eventually for a more casual friendly game. The solid playerbase are people who try to extend the limit of their skills and actively watch community content to improve, the game should be balanced for them. Buffing and nerfing every month if that is the price.
