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  1. #1

    Do you think puzzles and overly complicated mechanics belong in a looter shooter?

    This raid thing has had me thinking.Why do i personally buy and spend time in looter shooters?Me personally its to shoot things and to loot,kind like how in Diablo i like to kill things and get loot.So for me things like raids where you have these puzzles and complicated mechanics,that goes against the entire principal of why i even buy these games and is not a good idea.Shouldn't a looter shooter be just shooting and collecting loot with no need for puzzles or complicated mechanics?

    Whats your thoughts?Do you agree or disagree and why?
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  2. #2
    From the information posted about the "raid", player's experience so far and the obvious oversight of not including matchmaking, then it's rather obvious there is a huge disconnect between Ubisoft's programmers and people who actually play Ubisoft games.


    Ubisoft had a brief chance with Division 2 since so many other game companies have proven incompetent over the past year and they dropped it in the toilet.

    Oh well, extremely low expectations are the best approach to games at this point and it seems no game company can even reach that level of competence.
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  3. #3
    teksuo1's Avatar Senior Member
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    it kind of gives that impression at first (wth is up with these "puzzles") but give it a couple days and a well made video guide will make everything less of a puzzle i'm sure.

    it had to be complex enough to keep the streamers invested for a decent amount of time or everyone of them would have said its a joke and switched game after 45 minutes.

    i just hope they'll come up with matchmaking for it with a prerequisite or "attunement" of some kind ; once the community has watched enough videos


    *interesting mention about diablo in your post too ; i can't seem to pinpoint if this game is trying to be a bit like diablo or wow, or both?
    raids remind me of wow alright, but maybe we need something akin to diablo's rifts as well

    *something like d1's underground but deeper and without end would be very nice imo (i was bummed when it stopped giving levels or rewards at lvl 40 undergorund)
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  4. #4
    CJ Fresh's Avatar Senior Member
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    The incursions were perfect difficulty that required teamwork and communication.

    This raid is an amped up incursion with enemy health pools that are ridiculous
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  5. #5
    Originally Posted by CptDookie Go to original post
    This raid thing has had me thinking.Why do i personally buy and spend time in looter shooters?Me personally its to shoot things and to loot,kind like how in Diablo i like to kill things and get loot.So for me things like raids where you have these puzzles and complicated mechanics,that goes against the entire principal of why i even buy these games and is not a good idea.Shouldn't a looter shooter be just shooting and collecting loot with no need for puzzles or complicated mechanics?

    Whats your thoughts?Do you agree or disagree and why?
    The raid is trash and this game is taking a ridiculous design direction opposite to what advertised months before release. As usual. It's more difficult to make a game with logic than a stupid spongy weak mechanic fest. Fantasy mechanics don't apply to a shooter, nor a looter shooter in a "realistic" enviroment works. i hope they'll get it by now. If you wanna make a looter shooter go for Sci Fi. At least you can put all the shields ****s and out of this world stuff you want. Oh and at least you'll stop at Ubisoft to rape the name of Tom Clancy. find a company that deserves the brand and sell it back because you are the last company that has the decency and the capabilities to create Clancy content.
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  6. #6
    I loved the incursion missions back in Division 1. They required team work, timing, and coordination. Meaning 2 of us had to be here, the other 2 had to quickly run on either side, hit those switches, etc, then move to next location, next wave get ready for shotgunners, etc.

    I think devs have to strike a nice balance between having a few puzzles to complete in the mission, positioning at the right spots, using the right skills at the right time, etc. All of these things can add to make missions more fun because the feeling of satisfaction at the end will be even greater, but like I said, it has to be balanced otherwise it will transition from fun to being a chore and annoying, which sounds like what Raid is right now. As always, i expect Raid, like all other things, to get balanced in a few weeks, after it has already been released.

    As a simple gamer, I find it really odd that devs these days can't figure out these difficulty settings, NPCs strength, etc, before something is released. It's not just Massive either, Blizzard which is a much much bigger dev studio than Massive is still making horrendous balance decisions to this day, costing them many lost players across a range of games. I recently quit Overwatch myself after 2 years, not because the game wasn't fun to begin with, but because bad balancing decisions form the devs ruined the experience.

    So while puzzles and such are a fun inclusion in raids and incursion missions, they HAVE to be balanced, along with other factors like NPC strength, time it takes to complete mission, etc. It's not just one thing, adding puzzles is only one slice of the pizza, but they whole pizza needs to actually be in order before we consider what toppings and how much of each is the right amount.
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  7. #7
    I think this is why most games are deffinitly getting easier/simpler. *shrug* I dont find anything wrong with the raid but I guess I maybe in the vocal minority. I like games that are hard and overly complicated. This raid is kind of welcome to players like me. Dont know, I like Mythic raiding too.
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  8. #8
    J0s3e's Avatar Banned
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    Here, the guy who created 5+ threads here to include matchamking now can't beat the first boss and questions the difficulty of the raid. Exactly as predicted.
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  9. #9
    CJ Fresh's Avatar Senior Member
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    It’s a simple mechanic but the bullet sponge adds on top of the immunity has made this first boss encounter more challenging than what it should be.

    For instance, he can emp us but we can’t emp him. It’s not balance.

    I thought the odz enemies were sponges now but raid devs said hold my beer.

    MM is still viable, heck you meet some great people and laugh at all the struggles.

    Im thinking though is the difficulty worth the low rng chance for the exotic and I’m thinking no. If it was guaranteed then sure.
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  10. #10
    I won't comment on the raid as I haven't played it, but I agree with the sentiments on the incursions. I remember the first time I got taken through Dragons Nest and in the final encounter I thought WTF is this!! Also by the end of the game I thought that Stolen Signal was one of the best to do once you had the right strategy and builds for each boss - especially having the right builds or even the ability to run a variety of builds. And for me that is what this game is supposed to be about and the fundamental c*ck up that plagues this game, the builds and systems such as mods and especially skillpower/skills.

    Anyway was hoping to hear the raid was more like a bigger Stolen Signal, but I suppose not having build diversity or the ability to have something like the immune box, proper flash bang etc. makes it impossible. I just hope they end up fixing the game, but I'm not holding my breath. I still think this game is going to be fkd for 6 months at least.
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