Answer to Stefan on Lawbringer hyperarmour | Forums

[jordan-tanton]

I miss being able to feint the top unblockable into another top unblockable tbh, wasnt really broken either.

[Mr_Incredible]

So I got a question for knight

So your telling me and everyone else here that raider before the rework wasnt a hard hitting stamina bully. That people only knew him as the guy who grabbed you and would spin you in a circle if he didnt carry you. How do you figure this one out.

And dont say "that's not what I said I" summarize it.

[Illyrian_King]

I did. Caeheart. Who is the current person in charge of the tier list. Lawbinger being s tier pre rework is the same reasons he's near S tier now. So if you truly understood why he was considered S tier then than there shouldn't be a problem with my statement now.

More than likely you don't know why and you just parrot what you see or hear because your understanding of how the game works at a higher level of play is comparable to that of a child.

I am in this Community now since there is a forum ... in other words back to good old 2015. I followed Setmyx, but I never heard anything about a guy named Caeheart. If that is the "pro" you are refering to, then your whole argumentation is even more disappointing.

Also funny is, that you indirectly said, that there is not much different pre- and post-rework. Earlier you always claimed, that there were a lot of changes. So much talking about your lack in understanding ...
Also he was not considered S-tier, but A-tier in Setmyx's season 9 tier list. Also I can't remember Lawbringer ever being on A-tier on his earlier lists. It got ****-stormed from all angles.

Also claiming that I "just parrot what I see and hear" is another thing just a fool ignorant like you can say. I mained Lawbringer for 9 Seasons, doesn't that go somehow in your weird idiotic head?
I was the VERY first one in this forum complaining about the "rework" (not that I am proud of that, just standing my point), talking about my experience with all the fundamental flaws he has, that weren't fixed. I didn't hear anything from anybody, beside Stefan ruining my expectations for a halfway-decent rework.

Now the rework is out, it has proven poor, all pros (be it on youtube (even your FatherLaw) or wherever else) call it underperforming or bad, everybody disagrees with you.

[UbiInsulin]

Raider didn't have one. They gave him one.

I agree that the whole "sticking to a hero's identity" thing is poor. And LB will be forever flawed because he was designed as a turtle from the get go.
But on a personal level I like having a hero based around parry options versus having yet another hero that trades through everything.

Would adding HA to LB have any chance of creating a Valk rework situation, where some Valk mains think she is a completely different hero now (and have some nostalgia for the old version)? This is probably not a perfectly analogous situation, but this is just a thought that occurred to me while we're on the subject of changing identities.

If HA is a no-go (sounds like it is for the moment), are there other changes LB could use that go with the theme?

UPDATE: The flaming needs to end now. Don't talk about each other, talk about the game.

[Knight_Raime]

So I got a question for knight

So your telling me and everyone else here that raider before the rework wasnt a hard hitting stamina bully. That people only knew him as the guy who grabbed you and would spin you in a circle if he didnt carry you. How do you figure this one out.

And dont say "that's not what I said I" summarize it.

Those are descriptors not identity. Identity has a bit more depth to it. Like lawbringers identity of turtle because nearly all of his tools encourage defensive play.

[Knight_Raime]

Would adding HA to LB have any chance of creating a Valk rework situation, where some Valk mains think she is a completely different hero now (and have some nostalgia for the old version)? This is probably not a perfectly analogous situation, but this is just a thought that occurred to me while we're on the subject of changing identities.

If HA is a no-go (sounds like it is for the moment), are there other changes LB could use that go with the theme?

No, armor alone wouldn't cause that. LB would have to see much more significant changes to take a departure from his current identity for that to be a possibility.

If you mean changes to change his identity to a trading hero he'd need his heavies sped up and probably even some sort of soft feint that loops back into his trading.

If you mean to improve his current turtle identity not much can be done. He's already a great turtle. He really just needs more stamina and better tracking heavies in order to improve what he already has.

[Siegfried-Z]

Would adding HA to LB have any chance of creating a Valk rework situation, where some Valk mains think she is a completely different hero now (and have some nostalgia for the old version)? This is probably not a perfectly analogous situation, but this is just a thought that occurred to me while we're on the subject of changing identities.

If HA is a no-go (sounds like it is for the moment), are there other changes LB could use that go with the theme?

Imo these 2 are not even comparable.

LB HA is something people wanted for him because it look logic with LB armor.

While Valk lost A LOT of things in her rework :
-Headbutt : gone
-Shield Crush after a heavy : gone
-Full block on Sield tackle and ability to dash out of it : gone (btw this is the main change Who kill her identity).

With her rework Valk got only new chains and a sweep/CC dmg buff.
With some others minor changes as more direct dmg and less bleed on deflect and a faster top light.

Valk rework was the worst the team have made after PK because she really lost a lot for a medium buff only in others area.

Now about the topic here, i really think they've made 2 big mistakes in 2 reworks.

Let me explain.

Raider : bad rework.
Bad because they made him OP . Its sad to see the team unable to realize when things are too strong while we are in s10.

LB : good rework Imo in terms of balancing.
He is just good now without being too strong.
But, why did they not give him HA ? Everyone wanted this for LB and they didnt do it while they give him 400ms top lights ? Seriously LB with a 400ms top lights ... laughable. Even more when Raider and Hitokiri got the HA.

The team choices just show how much they doesnt understand their community and how small is their intention to makes logic changes.

[We.the.North]

While Valk lost A LOT of things in her rework :
-Headbutt : gone
-Shield Crush after a heavy : gone
-Full block on Sield tackle and ability to dash out of it : gone (btw this is the main change Who kill her identity).

Valk used to be my main. After these changes, not anymore. They killed her and like you said, point 3 really puts the nail in the coffin for me.

[TheUberDome]

Maybe a soft feint into his bash. He gets his bash mid combo, so having him be able to soft feint into it shouldn't be that much of a change to his "identity". It should work in a similar way to valks soft feint bash, where it tracks dodges.

[Illyrian_King]

Maybe a soft feint into his bash. He gets his bash mid combo, so having him be able to soft feint into it shouldn't be that much of a change to his "identity". It should work in a similar way to valks soft feint bash, where it tracks dodges.

There are a lot of things, that can be done.
But the problem is, that it would be the "standard" fix next to all heroes get. There is not much variety between the heroes left. That is pretty boring.

I always wanted hyperarmour on his heavies, combined with unparriable property (blocking still possible, and parrying lights still possible) BUT with increased block damage (thinking about 30% instead of the regular 18%). This would cause around 10dmg on every heavy block.
Leave his stamina short as it is (to keep his pressure time limited), slow down all his basic attacks (even lights), but let lights still continue the chain like now.

This would be an interesting completely different approach, that would make him viable (exact number tweaking of course necessary), let him attack and ALSO fit his appearance perfectly.
Slow but hard hitting and protected.