So the new hero is good. | Forums

[Knight_Raime]

The light on her finisher exists because she's a trader and her mid chain has no armor. it's 500ms and is telegraphed by her jumping. it's easy once you're used to it.
Her kick might be 500ms but due to it's link time or poor tracking people are capable of dodging it on indicator. So until her kick can actually catch people I wouldn't suggest nerfing it.

[Sweaty_Sock]

The light finisher is stupid, because its done on reaction and is 18 damage (?!) a light light combo = 36 damage. Thats INSANE

The standardisation of lights to 500 ms was stupid if you are then adding effects to those lights. Hyperarmour light should be slower than a non hyper armoured assassins light

To be honest %*^& her identity if its hyperarmour on everything, it makes the game breakdown whereby you cannot act aggressively or you will be outtraded and lose.

Saying her weakness is she is forced to backout of things for stamina cost is not also not a good point.. most characters would be forced to follow through with theirs and be punished, others are just in the same boat. What you should be thinking is for some stamina you can cover your misread...

The problem is the HA is so early that shes not a trader in the sense of correctly throwng attacks at the same time. She can react late (when should be getting hit) and still pull off the trade. IT is terrible design (warlords hyperarmour for example is good, you need to get it timed correctly to trade)

[Vendelkin]

The light finisher is stupid, because its done on reaction and is 18 damage (?!) a light light combo = 36 damage. Thats INSANE

The standardisation of lights to 500 ms was stupid if you are then adding effects to those lights. Hyperarmour light should be slower than a non hyper armoured assassins light

To be honest %*^& her identity if its hyperarmour on everything, it makes the game breakdown whereby you cannot act aggressively or you will be outtraded and lose.

Saying her weakness is she is forced to backout of things for stamina cost is not also not a good point.. most characters would be forced to follow through with theirs and be punished, others are just in the same boat. What you should be thinking is for some stamina you can cover your misread...

The problem is the HA is so early that shes not a trader in the sense of correctly throwng attacks at the same time. She can react late (when should be getting hit) and still pull off the trade. IT is terrible design (warlords hyperarmour for example is good, you need to get it timed correctly to trade)

You are just restating your same argument with no new input of value beyond the fact that you dont like it.

If you dont like the HA than you should have brought it up more with shugoki, and continually with zerker.
Also warlord ha is not trader ha. You have to pre attack early enough that an opponent even on console can react feint and parry pretty easily. The point is she can choose to trade and thats where her offense comes from.

I agree assassins have lost their identity, but as many have said, and developers have said, any lights slower than 500ms are just unfeintable light parry bait. They are.. and if you ever eat her opener light thats on you. Cause its stupid easy to parry and has no options after the r1 if you are ready for it.

You cannot just pose an absolute gutting of thw only real thing a new character has going for her without giving something back. I would be fine with some losses if she gained serious viability elsewhere. Thing is her ha is designed such that it cant even be spammy. It always has to be used with determinite purpose on her part. It is true her continual heavy into light heavy into light both with HA is frustrating. But the 800ms ha is very very easy to stop. Spend some time in the training arena playing as her or against her with a lvl three bot and ypu will very quickly see her flaws that you can exploit.

500ms lights are definately staying.
HA lights exist on many characters now. And tho i agree the game is too HA heavy if they belong anywhere its on a HEAVY unit.

[Cyroy95]

The light finisher is stupid, because its done on reaction and is 18 damage (?!) a light light combo = 36 damage. Thats INSANE

The standardisation of lights to 500 ms was stupid if you are then adding effects to those lights. Hyperarmour light should be slower than a non hyper armoured assassins light

To be honest %*^& her identity if its hyperarmour on everything, it makes the game breakdown whereby you cannot act aggressively or you will be outtraded and lose.

Saying her weakness is she is forced to backout of things for stamina cost is not also not a good point.. most characters would be forced to follow through with theirs and be punished, others are just in the same boat. What you should be thinking is for some stamina you can cover your misread...

The problem is the HA is so early that shes not a trader in the sense of correctly throwng attacks at the same time. She can react late (when should be getting hit) and still pull off the trade. IT is terrible design (warlords hyperarmour for example is good, you need to get it timed correctly to trade)

You seem to be missing the most serious point here, HER ENTIRE OFFENSE CAN BE BACK-DODGED OUT OF. She has no pressure, she has no guessing game, no 50/50 or viable guaranteed damage. All she has is those trades and those trades only work IF YOU'RE THE ONE THAT IS ****ING Up since all you have to do is BACK-DODGE and you're save. This forces her to feint, which costs a lot of stamina and if you have any sort of viable bashing offense (which also counters her hyper-armour) like Conq, BP, Warden, Tiandi and some others, you'll have her OoS in no time which gives you pretty much free reign.

She punishes aggression and loses big-time to defensive play and bash game. If you remove her ability to punish aggression all you've got left is some mediocre damage that's easily avoidable.

[Knight_Raime]

The light finisher is stupid, because its done on reaction and is 18 damage (?!) a light light combo = 36 damage. Thats INSANE

The standardisation of lights to 500 ms was stupid if you are then adding effects to those lights. Hyperarmour light should be slower than a non hyper armoured assassins light

To be honest %*^& her identity if its hyperarmour on everything, it makes the game breakdown whereby you cannot act aggressively or you will be outtraded and lose.

Saying her weakness is she is forced to backout of things for stamina cost is not also not a good point.. most characters would be forced to follow through with theirs and be punished, others are just in the same boat. What you should be thinking is for some stamina you can cover your misread...

The problem is the HA is so early that shes not a trader in the sense of correctly throwng attacks at the same time. She can react late (when should be getting hit) and still pull off the trade. IT is terrible design (warlords hyperarmour for example is good, you need to get it timed correctly to trade)

And her 500ms light finisher is easily reactable and baitable unless she delays the input every single time. Which you absolutely will not fight consistently unless you play skrims/tourny level players.

There are plenty of heros who can play aggressively against her. As long as you have armor and/or bashes of your own you can absolutely fight her aggressively. Her UB heavies are actually super easy to react to on the sides because she doesn't gain forward momentum until she can't feint it anymore. And if she's constantly charging it up decently a GB or bash will beat it and discourage her from blindly charging in your face constantly. She also entirely relies on having a health advantage to trade. Once she loses that she can't safely trade. Meaning her offense becomes even more limited.

She's incredibly predictable with near useless bash moves, terrible hitboxes, and no range. The ONLY thing she has going for her is the ability to trade easily from neutral. Which is super easy to play around. Complaining that you can't go on the offense against her is silly because there are plenty of other heros that you don't do that against. Lawbringer, Shugoki, berzerker, conq, etc. It's not new and there's nothing inherently wrong with having heros that demand you to approach them differently.

Yes, having easily accessible HA from neutral is terrible design. What I and others are saying is it's ALL she has. And that unless the devs massively buff her kit else where you can't nerf the HA from neutral. Warlord is not a trader. The only 2 heros in the game that can be called that are Hitokiri and Shugoki. This last part is mostly nonsense. you're not offering any legit reasons on what seperates a person with HA from someone who's designed to be a trader. you're merely stating you think Warlord is a good trader because his HA is hard to captialize on. That doesn't seperate what is and isn't a trading hero.

[MuscleTech12018]

It's the most op hero ingame. 90 secons cooldown for 1 kill shot feature ))) Only idiotic canadian developers could master this one )

[Vendelkin]

It's the most op hero ingame. 90 secons cooldown for 1 kill shot feature ))) Only idiotic canadian developers could master this one )

If you are being serious i cant tell for sure.... but im not going to try to explain the numbers again

Go try and compare her feat 4 to catapault, spear storm, even arrow storm, fireflask etc and then come offer a logical numbers based argument for why hitokiris move is better.

Ill save you the trouble. Its not. Numbers aside to confirm a kill with hitokiri fourth requires a gank or an oos/revenge knockdown. You can confirm multiple kills with same methods with catapault, and can often hit at least 1 person safely while they are mid combo. Point is since it can be dodged, in the context of the games other tier 4 feats hitokiris is actually super weak.

[ArchDukeInstinct]

It's the most op hero ingame. 90 secons cooldown for 1 kill shot feature ))) Only idiotic canadian developers could master this one )

The tier 4 was definitely a big mistake. It's often completely useless but becomes insanely annoying during a gank. It simply shouldn't exist, but then again neither should a lot of tier 4 feats.

[Vendelkin]

The tier 4 was definitely a big mistake. It's often completely useless but becomes insanely annoying during a gank. It simply shouldn't exist, but then again neither should a lot of tier 4 feats.

That is completely true

[Knight_Raime]

The tier 4 was definitely a big mistake. It's often completely useless but becomes insanely annoying during a gank. It simply shouldn't exist, but then again neither should a lot of tier 4 feats.

I'd have to disagree about her tier 4 feat personally. Plenty of gank setups can nearly kill you. I realize that the ones that can require more setup and timing compared to Hitokiri's.
But I think that's okay. I'm approaching it as her feats complete her kit. Normally when you have multiple heros going on there's an aspect about the kit that gets spammed that is mega annoying to deal with. For her it's her tier 4. So I don't really find it more or less annoying esp since it's tied to a cooldown.

What I enjoy about it the most is that it makes revenge not a safe get outa jail free card. Plenty of times someone gets revenge and runs to revive or helicopters and almost kills the team to cap the point and make a rebound from breaking. But with her presence of that tier 4 feat you can't simply pop it and go hog wild because she can trade into your hit and more than likely kill you.

The only annoying part about it for me at the moment is the bug that lets you kill multiple people with it.