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  1. #1

    How about NO AI teammates?

    I think I get where they are coming from with removing AI teammates. First off, friendly AI is always janky. I mean, look at wildlands, teammate AI is wildly unpredictable, has clunky movement, responds to orders in a very confusing manner (not to say these mechanics can't be learned), and scoot around enemies without being spotted.

    If the enemy AI is going to be top of the line, that could also cause problems with friendly AI. AI doesn't know how to flank and maneuver around patrolling enemies, enemies that are searching for them, and drones without just walking right by them invisible like.

    Also with the injury mechanics, that would force the friendly AI to heal, but when would they do this? On order? When they are safe? Or would the injury system not apply to them, and take you right out of the experience. I hate the wildlands friendly AI for all these reasons, they completely break the immersion in order to keep you fighting.

    Oh, I almost forgot target acquisition, how would they prioritize hostiles? Would they shoot the rushers first, the snipers, the attack drones? Would they be insta killing machines? Would the player have to tell them who to shoot? If so, why not have the player shoot them themself. I think that until there are major breakthroughs with teammate AI interacting with advanced enemy AI, this is kind of old tech we are using. Friendly AI usually works because of how bad the enemy AI is or by breaking the game rules.

    These are just only a few examples, I wouldn't really enjoy having a friendly AI that could figure all of this out, and buggily navigate the dynamic terrain. They would be too OP, or too useless. This is all just my opinion and questions, feel free to respond and prove me wrong.

    I think the drones are a simple answer to these questions, but I can see how they can be viewed as a lazy fix.
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  2. #2
    Originally Posted by evan5338 Go to original post
    I think I get where they are coming from with removing AI teammates. First off, friendly AI is always janky. I mean, look at wildlands, teammate AI is wildly unpredictable, has clunky movement, responds to orders in a very confusing manner (not to say these mechanics can't be learned), and scoot around enemies without being spotted.

    If the enemy AI is going to be top of the line, that could also cause problems with friendly AI. AI doesn't know how to flank and maneuver around patrolling enemies, enemies that are searching for them, and drones without just walking right by them invisible like.

    Also with the injury mechanics, that would force the friendly AI to heal, but when would they do this? On order? When they are safe? Or would the injury system not apply to them, and take you right out of the experience. I hate the wildlands friendly AI for all these reasons, they completely break the immersion in order to keep you fighting.

    Oh, I almost forgot target acquisition, how would they prioritize hostiles? Would they shoot the rushers first, the snipers, the attack drones? Would they be insta killing machines? Would the player have to tell them who to shoot? If so, why not have the player shoot them themself. I think that until there are major breakthroughs with teammate AI interacting with advanced enemy AI, this is kind of old tech we are using. Friendly AI usually works because of how bad the enemy AI is or by breaking the game rules.

    These are just only a few examples, I wouldn't really enjoy having a friendly AI that could figure all of this out, and buggily navigate the dynamic terrain. They would be too OP, or too useless. This is all just my opinion and questions, feel free to respond and prove me wrong.

    I think the drones are a simple answer to these questions, but I can see how they can be viewed as a lazy fix.
    I’m no expert. But I have same ideas to answer your questions that I think are probably doable.

    This is about the team AI avoiding enemy AI.
    Assume the enemy AI has some sort of sight cone. This is how we get visually detected in Wildlands. Now assume that the team AI has the same thing, but a cone that allows them to see farther than the enemy. Once the team AI cone hits the enemy sight cone, they steer clear of it and make an audible note to the player and marks that target. If the team AI is unable to get clear for some reason after alerting the player, and the player doesn’t intervene, the team AI will get into a prone position to make themselves harder to spot and use a silenced weapon to eliminate that target.

    Now for team AI injury.
    I’d say that the team AI should have the same injury system as the player. If they go down in the fight, the other team AI and player can revive them. If they survive the fight and are in an all clear status, they automatically tell the player they are providing aid to themselves and they will go through the same animations the player would have to do. I’d say that for the sake of gameplay, they have an unlimited amount of first aid equipment.

    Target acquisition
    In stealth, they only fire at targets assigned by the player(sync shots). In Wildlands, the enemy AI gives off a warning sound when they’re about to spot the player. At a certain moment during that warning period, the team AI that has line of site and is closer will use a silenced weapon to kill that enemy. When give the order to open fire or when already actively engaged, the team AI shoots the nearest enemies. If the player wants them to shoot a specific target, then they mark that target for a sync shot just like how it is now. To answer your question if they would be instant killing machines, in stealth they would be. Just like how the player is. When actively engaged, it should take perhaps twice as many rounds to kill the target than the player, to keep them from being OP.
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  3. #3
    How about having the option like the last game?

    You don't like it, but I do. Why should only you get what you want?
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  4. #4
    How about just adding a toggle like in Wildlands? Those that want the teammates (like me) can have them, and those that don't can simply turn them off. Why is this even a discussion?
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  5. #5
    Those are some good ideas EP5116, obviously some flaws like having the friendly AI killing enemies without being asked to, but good ideas all around. I think the biggest problem really is the meds and injury system. We all know in wildlands AI teammates walk slowly through open spaces and get killed, so imagine that happening in Breakpoint, but this time the other AI teammates decide it's a good idea to go for that body in the open and get shot down. Now you have 2 downed teammates in the middle of an open area. Then, what happens if you go down a hill, will the other AI teammates follow you and take enormous damage if they are injured. That seems to be the key theme with AI teammates: Do they follow the same rules as us?

    I really think that this game is a game meant for those who looking for immersion, a challenge, and realism. As many immersion breaking instances (such as bugs and mechanics) that may exist in the game, I have never ever had an AI teammate that felt like they played the game by the same rules as I did. I hope that Ubisoft knows it is ok to break boundaries (not in the usual microtransations way) and give the player a true challenge. This game could be something huge, and I think that making it more casual is not the right way to go. I play like a complete moron in Wildlands when I have AI teammates because I know they can just murder everything and pick me up in a blink of the eye and I DO NOT want the same in a game such as this.
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  6. #6
    Originally Posted by TouristMcGee Go to original post
    How about just adding a toggle like in Wildlands? Those that want the teammates (like me) can have them, and those that don't can simply turn them off. Why is this even a discussion?
    Exactly.
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  7. #7
    Originally Posted by evan5338 Go to original post
    Those are some good ideas EP5116, obviously some flaws like having the friendly AI killing enemies without being asked to, but good ideas all around. I think the biggest problem really is the meds and injury system. We all know in wildlands AI teammates walk slowly through open spaces and get killed, so imagine that happening in Breakpoint, but this time the other AI teammates decide it's a good idea to go for that body in the open and get shot down. Now you have 2 downed teammates in the middle of an open area. Then, what happens if you go down a hill, will the other AI teammates follow you and take enormous damage if they are injured. That seems to be the key theme with AI teammates: Do they follow the same rules as us?

    I really think that this game is a game meant for those who looking for immersion, a challenge, and realism. As many immersion breaking instances (such as bugs and mechanics) that may exist in the game, I have never ever had an AI teammate that felt like they played the game by the same rules as I did. I hope that Ubisoft knows it is ok to break boundaries (not in the usual microtransations way) and give the player a true challenge. This game could be something huge, and I think that making it more casual is not the right way to go. I play like a complete moron in Wildlands when I have AI teammates because I know they can just murder everything and pick me up in a blink of the eye and I DO NOT want the same in a game such as this.
    I get what you’re saying. I was just throwing out possible solutions. But I really dont know anything about game development. That’s why I figure it safe to assume that the professionals would know how to handle it. But as the other folks on this thread and many other threads have said, just have a toggle like Wildlands.
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