Raider rework vs hitokiri release | Forums

[Sweaty_Sock]

1) Most people think the raider buff went to far (outside a FEW raider mains) - all give any no take (other than fix a broken move that should have been patched a year ago)
2) The faction of a new hero should be irrelevant if you are trying to objectively judge their power. I think the new hero is not a healthy step & your descriptions of her are inaccurate at best (feinting loses momentum when the followup heaavy startup attacks get HA???). The fact you want a softeint for her unfortunately shows you don't understand the kit properly and just want a (more) broken character to ruin everyone's day

[UbiInsulin]

Like my initial post says i dont want a buff to her other than maybe in a few weeks giving her the ability to soft feint heavies into her bashes (make her bash potentially useful against good players)

And i also dont want her OP

I do want her to be stronger than the raider such that she is not overshadowed. That is correct. Which there is nothing wrong with that desire. Samurai are arguably the weakest faction right now and have been for most of the game. Samurai have noob stompers. Especially if you exclude the weirdness that is shinobi.

Also.... i clearly got what you were asking.

Here is your question "Why do u think that new hero should be more powerful than lets say Centurion who is trash?"

I answered your question. Perhaps you were not being clear with what you wanted to ask?

Is there really anything wrong with me wanting samurai to have the spotlight during the season that was precisely advertised for that purpose?

So essentially, you want Hitokiri to be stronger because it's her time to shine, and other heroes have gotten their times to shine. I can kind of understand that, but this idea is not likely to motivate any balance changes from the fight team. Heroes release in different states and we don't always know how things are going to go in the live game.

I think this might tie into the canard that the team is deliberately releasing post-launch heroes in an OP state. That's obviously not the goal, and while it's often the narrative I see, it doesn't always play out that way in terms of balance. Your own assessment of this current update is that the Raider rework is outclassing the post-launch hero.

Any extra shine that Hitokiri gets will be purely in terms of marketing, same as with the other post-launch heroes. If there are actual gameplay problems that she has, or there's something you feel is missing when you play her, that's obviously valid feedback that I'm happy to take a look at.

[Vendelkin]

So essentially, you want Hitokiri to be stronger because it's her time to shine, and other heroes have gotten their times to shine. I can kind of understand that, but this idea is not likely to motivate any balance changes from the fight team. Heroes release in different states and we don't always know how things are going to go in the live game.

I think this might tie into the canard that the team is deliberately releasing post-launch heroes in an OP state. That's obviously not the goal, and while it's often the narrative I see, it doesn't always play out that way in terms of balance. Your own assessment of this current update is that the Raider rework is outclassing the post-launch hero.

Any extra shine that Hitokiri gets will be purely in terms of marketing, same as with the other post-launch heroes. If there are actual gameplay problems that she has, or there's something you feel is missing when you play her, that's obviously valid feedback that I'm happy to take a look at.

This is a wonderful response. Your part about my assesment is spot on. It feels like the raider rework has outshined the hitokiri release. And you are right its a good thing ubi isnt feeding into the pay to win woth new character stuff.

This being said i would be lieing if i told you i didnt feel trampled as a samurai. Ive played samurai faction since the games release and i honestly feel like weve been the most neglected faction for the duration of the game by both ubi and the community. Now i could be wrong obviously. But this release just made me feel like that wasnt going to change anytime soon even more. Lawbringer, raider have been the reworks thus far. Next is cent. Our most recent was shugoki. And that was nice, but before him it had been a very long time since any of our guys recieved significant changes.

[Vendelkin]

The fact you want a softeint for her unfortunately shows you don't understand the kit properly and just want a (more) broken character to ruin everyone's day

soft feint in her kit would bring it more in line with how many heroes play (most have soft feints somewhere for mixup) additionally it wouldnt add too much as a parry attempt from the opponent would hit her out of her kick. It would just give her another option for tricking out the opponent. I mean really think about the interactions there. It wouldnt give her very much at all other than an alternative way to break mid combo full blocks with gb immunity.

Currently when hitokiri feints a heavy the only optiona are gb which misses if the person backdodged, or another heavy (as opener light is not worth mention here) which players have enough time usually to react to defensively or parry or gb. Adding the kick in would give her a way to on prediction prevent people from gbing her or on missed prediction she would eat a hit from the opponents parry attempt. It really wouldnt be an op addition at all.

I get that you think shes strong. And i know you and i disagree about that. But objectively looking at this suggestion it wpuld not make her in any way more unbearable.

[Siegfried-Z]

My turn to chime in. Too many of these threads being thrown around. So instead of responding to 5 of them ill just place my opinion once here.

Raider's rework has completely overshadowed hitokiri's release. This is the biggest problem to me. Balance aside (which i do talk about further down) the overshadowing samurais time to shine is exceedingly upsetting to me. BP was a holy god on release because of his uniqueness, style, and releative power. Hitokiri is still being hated on but feels like an afterthought to me in some ways.

Noobs are complaining about hitokiri's actually kind of average feats.

And im sitting here upset because the moment the samurai were finally supposed to come into the light instead the entire focus of the forum right now is noobs from other factions wanting hitokiri wrongfully nerfed while being completely bullheaded about how strong the raider rework is.

Aspects of the rework were needed. He did need a buff, but even pre buff because of how ridiculously strong his dodge gb is good players could decimate with raider. And in 4v4s his grabs of any kind were a death sentance. Fact is he needed a buff, but he was always viable.

Now he is too strong. I, nor anyone i know of, is asking for a complete reversal on his kit, but he should not have gotten at least one aspect of it. No nerfs were given. This is the first complete buff instead of sideways change weve seen in ages. And it isnt healthy.

Hitokiri on the other hand has some new combinations of old tricks that people need to learn. Her bashes are not very useful. Feinting them is still hard to use right. Her charged heavies will eventually be parriable with practice and even then back dodging works surprisingly well in most situations. Her hard feints break her out of her special stance making it tricky to maintain momentum. Her bash cannot be used on dodge.

And btw im not saying she is weak. Just no where near as strong as some claim. My placement is probably B+ or A-

Back to raider. Maintains his utility on dodge gb that by itself is stronger than hitokiri's whole bash game with much less effort. Hyper armor (which im fine with). Sped up stunning taps, and ridiculous damage around the board. Soft feints that are useful in a situation that gives him 4+ decent options (let it fly, stunning tap, feint dodge gb, feint gb, feint and counter parry,) Something needs to be reigned in. To me he feels S or S- to me.

My proposal is this;
In a couple of weeks (give things time) make the following changes:

Hitokiri gain the ability to softfeint heavies into her bash mix ups.
Raider loses ONE AND ONLY ONE of the following: -dodge gb
-speed ups
-dmg buffs (not accross the board but to his lights and to his finisher heavy.)


Raider has completely overshadowed the release of hitokiri, and thats upsetting.

After that we let things sit. Also i agree with many that lawbringer needs at least one hyper armor move... i mean really full plate. But his rework is decent imo.

Its funny how some people here ask you some questions you already answer in your OP.. ahh

Anyway i 100% agree.

As you said i feel Hitokiri is a A atm and i am pretty happy with that. I dont wanted another S tier heroe.

But the problem is Raider .. he is a beast now. He outshine Hitokiri release AND LB rework together (While LB rework was good imo).

I was rep 1 Raider only before his rework with a bad KD. I am now close to rep 3 with him and am literally destroying anyone .. Hitokiri, old Raider main, BP, Warden, Conq, Zerk .. doesnt matter.
I feel godly while playing my rep 2 Raider and weak while playing my rep 30 Kensei this is funny lol

I am fine with his new chains, his 500ms lights, his softfeint and his HA.
But the dmg buff was not necessary. It should be remooved and his chain zone should be nerfed. If this happen i am fine with him keeping his Dodge gb.