Hitokiri unpopular Opinion | Forums

[Siegfried-Z]

Her HA opener is definitely to soon it pushes you into a turtle meta where I feel she actually excels at breaking people...

I don't just throw lights but the outcome is better than if I try and throw or feint heavies as an Orochi... every time I actually try to play against properly her I come off worse imo...

Rewarding simple play seems to have taken the lime light from turtling GG

Like I said she doesn't need a nerf just tweeking and in a few weeks I am sure she will die down cause her model is terrible, animations are pretty poor and she's not really that fun...

generally pissed off with the state of assassins atm and she does add to that fire so apologies for being short ****

I would not be against her HA on the opener to come a bit later.

But then she also need more ability to get in her chain. Thats why some proposal as possible chain after her zone or Dodge heavy are good.

Her bash mix up is her only real threat and should be slighly improved too and then the dmg she get after the kick should be reduced.

So more or less only some tweaks.

About is she fun or not, it depends, this is very subjective.
To me she is, enough to main her or play her a lot? No. I will just play her Times to Times.

PS : i agree assassins state is terrible atm despite some are still very good as Zerk or Shaman. But this is because of the overall game standardization, not Hitokiri

[Klingentaenz3r]

Glad most people seem to think she's fine at the moment (at least in this thread).

Is she fun to fight against, as well?

In my eyes she is not that much fun to fight against. More on the boring side of things. Lack of an interesting and innovative kit. Instead not much depth in my opinion atm and strong similarities to shugoki's playstyle (but hey, BP is kind of a similar story when compared to conq with the difference that bulwark counter is really really something entirely new) which we already have and therefore is not an addition to the game at all (the feats are basically the only really innovative things here on this character) but a weird backstep as early hyper armor on startup promotes turtling while the overall direction of the game is that characters should be able to attack.

The animations are all sluggish and don't give me the feel to fight somebody wielding a double headed axe. Also the sound on hit does not really sell it well and doesn't sound too fitting in my ears.

Will I ever play her? No. She is not appealing in any way. BTW I also bought BP only because he is a knight with sword and shield. but I find him also quite boring and lacking kit-wise apart from his bulwark options.

[Knight_Raime]

I really like the two suggestions I indicated in bold. Imo her zone attack seems fairly weak considering it's not really fast and can't be used in chains/as a chain starter. There isn't really much use to it as of right now. Backdodging shouldn't negate her mix ups, neither for other heroes *cough* Aramusha *cough*. one thing I didn't read in your post are any improvements to her hitboxes which apparently are awful (in multi-man matches).

I can't really say anything about the other suggestions because I haven't really played her yet (only in training mode), but so far these seem like really good suggestions. 25 damage for heavies looks fairly low though, but what if her semi-charged heavies did 30 damage while non charged do 25? Would that work? I'm pretty sure she has 3 timings right?

Looking forward to Thursday when I can finally unlock them.

Not to turn this into a BP thread but I disagree that Bullwark gives him depth. It gives him an interesting gimmick and some nice variety but at the end of the day his optimal playstyle is still highly centralised around his shield bash. Take out his shield bash and his entire offense crumbles to near dust. That's what I mean about a lack of depth. But perhaps it is more accurate to say that it is his playstyle that lacks depth rather than the mechanics of his kit.

In Hitokiri's case her playstyle absolutely lacks depth but so does her kit.


Fair enough. It would make her more interesting and complex but they'd probably need to do more work than it'd be worth to them. What with 2 new heroes and existing character reworks, tweaks and balancing adjustments I can see why the dev's wouldn't want to/cannot be spending time giving Hito a psuedo-rework's worth of effort so soon.


I agree with pretty much all of this. I mean just the zone attack change, like you said, would be a massively positive change for her. If the devs would only do one of these things I'd want it to be the zone attack change. The only one I'm cautious of is the nerf to her neutral heavy damage. For 2 reasons:

1) We have a Raider in the game with monstrous damage numbers currently. He already has a much better mind game and much better mixups than anything Hitokiri can muster even with all of your proposed changes and yet he gets to have a 40 damage standard heavy. His dodge GB and various GB soft feints allow him to threaten with that huge damage way more potently than Hito can with her kick. Until either Raider's damage is looked at and/or dodge GB is removed I don't feel it fair to be cutting into a character for 30 damage when she has no where near the same threat levels.

2) Most characters who get hyper armour on their standard heavies get on average around 30-40 damage on those bad boys. Given that context It wouldn't sit right with me to take away from Hitokiri's potential as a viable trader.

Just quoting you both to mention the only reason I slated damage nerfs is because it's been rather popular decision for UBI to buff the viability of mix ups at the cost of damage. Obviously raider goes against this. But yeah. I personally don't think the damage changes are needed. I probably need to stop trying to make adjustments like that before receiving feedback first.

[Knight_Raime]

All you people calling for Buffs are you serious ?!

someone said it above an " attempt to make an aggressive counter attacker " and I can see that but seriously she's not healthy for the game in her current form.

I am not saying she needs a nerf but shes a pretty safe simple character to play....

As an assassin you are honestly ruined with nothing to do but watch and look for parries while playing so so so safe (Far safer than you need to against shug) on silly fast lights and quick heavies trying to avoid getting 4 hit / 5 hit by her !!

It's so difficult to damage without eatting damage yourself all she has to do is start throwing attacks and the window for you 2 damage is gone.

Her GB on heavy window is TINY (not sure if something has changed since the patch)
Her HA kicks on to quickly especially on her Unblockable
She is the most effective use of HA in the game Imo...

I hope they slackener her HA which I think they will tbh once they have bled everyone of season passes.

She's such a safe bet and easy character to play, probably some of laziest design work out of them all....

TBH I am so disappointed that UBI with this character, Shug and now raider they are just turning this into a Slug fest... Dominion is a disaster

They can't really change when her HA comes out as a nerf without redesigning her. She's designed to be a trader and nothing else in her kit lets her be offensive from neutral.
If they wanted to go that route that's fine with me. But I also don't care if she stays in this role and polish up her kit. As I believe the kit has the bones in it to make for a viable hero that's not only based around trading. Even though you're 100% right about assassins for the most part i'd still blame the design of assassins over blaming the new hero. Assassins for the most part don't have an answer to armored moves. And their deflects are basically useless outside berzerker. I'd much rather UBI address the health of assassins as a class than try to reverse direction on the game at this point.

she really promotes turtling and thats why i don't love hyper armor characters. you really can't attack vs them. less hyper armor in the game = better game imo.

You're slightly off. It's characters who have access to armor from essentially neutral that promote turtling. Armor in chains isn't the biggest problem because chains for the most part are not really strong in the game. Chain finishers in particular usually have hefty recovery periods. Hitokiri wouldn't have to be turtled against if she didn't have armor on her uncharged neutral heavies. But the way she's currently designed removing that without heavily changing her would kill her.

Beating a Hitokiri is rather simple for most of the heros if you have a bash that is. Just getting the health lead in general though is the way to go. Means she can't make those trades often.

[Klingentaenz3r]

FYI

it seems our discussion about the hyper armor is also held elsewhere

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sq3vEQRxwSA

[Faithly88]

I've read most of the comments (essays, brain is burning :P)

I don't feel like changing her HA to attach later would be a bad thing most characters work like this but yes if you want a "trader" : / then I suppose it does.
A " trader " it's a shame this game has turned into that tbh

Her build, her current form, her HA, infinite this infinite that.... it's not healthy for the game and promotes safe 0 skill play.

yes you can adjust to fighting her but seriously the above statement still stands.

Ubi is usshhhheerrriiinnggg in a new meta of "Simple Jack" players and tbh it sucks.

[Siegfried-Z]

Ubi is usshhhheerrriiinnggg in a new meta of "Simple Jack" players and tbh it sucks.

Solid agree on this last sentence.

I dont like it either. It began with the Wulins.

Best skills Gap closer heroes are still Tiandi, JJ and Shaolin Imo.
But BP and Hitokiri are easy to play too.

Cant remember how many Times i saw players ending with a solid score at the end of a 4v4 match while they were bad at the game (no mind game, easy to bait etc).
Sometimes i wish these players had to play Shinobi, HL or Valk to understand they are bad lol

[High-Horse]

I like playing as and against her so far. I like parrying, so the variable timing and possiblity of either a charged UB or an UB kick/sweep mixup keeps me on my toes.

Fighting as her is very aggressive, if maybe a bit lazier as far as not caring about mistakes. As Hito, you can practically parry on red indicator and react afterwards, like if they feint to light, you just trade through it, or if they dodge, charge it to second or third level. Hito's defense is super safe while offense is both oppressive and a little risky. I think it's more fun than turtle duels.

If they push the HA on opener Heavy back 100 or 200ms, they would need to increase the speed and tracking of forward dash heavy (it can be parried after a roll, which is ironic for a roll catcher), chain it and zones to Mugen stance, maybe reduce chained heavies to 25 or 28 dmg and improve kick's speed and/or tracking. Just a few tweaks.