Little buff for Valkyrie | Forums

[Sweaty_Sock]

I would rather choose only 2 options but which works. Without a doubt.

There is alot I could say but i'll just highlight this - because this is what you will end up with. A one move into potential softeint shallow character. Valk will be a warden.

Valks current strength is her depth, I'm not going to comment on your skill but if you make the right decision only 25% of the time maybe review the decisions you are making?

[Siegfried-Z]

There is alot I could say but i'll just highlight this - because this is what you will end up with. A one move into potential softeint shallow character. Valk will be a warden.

Valks current strength is her depth, I'm not going to comment on your skill but if you make the right decision only 25% of the time maybe review the decisions you are making?

If you dont want to comment on my skill then dont do it, no?
Anyway, i've explained to you many Times already why Valk is not a strong pick. I could say to you just go in training mode if you have problem with her ? But doesnt matter.

It is not about do i make the right decision or not. The fact is when Valk is in this mix up position over her opponent, a good one would just do nothing and wait to see what the Valk player decide to do because EVERY options she has are 100% reactable .

Sweep = Dodge on reaction for free GB
GB = Cgb
Heavy finisher = dont parry unless you got your opponent pattern and be ready to Dodge her bash
Light finisher = try to parry if you feel confident or just block for safety

100% possible to counter every options on reaction.

Of course sometimes your opponent makes mistakes.
But no man, you cant hide your biased opinion about this mix up poor efficiency behing my good or not skills.
This is irrelevant and just show a lack of argue.

[Sweaty_Sock]

100% possible to counter every options on reaction.

= every action in the game. The only one questionable at present is the BP and thats a giant flaming storm of argument right now. Give me an attack, I will give you the reaction response.

EDIT: hell give me a character, and action, and the character you want me to do 'best response with'

The reality is you condition your opponent to a move, then break that mold. Valk is THE BEST at that

EDIT EDIT: you are the one leading the charge against BP?!

[xIBlacKmaNIx]

Give her all of her shield perks back from before the rework. Ask any Valk vet that has put more than 50 reps into her, what made her unique was her shield perks. I use to play duels with her and enjoy a good fight with other high rep hero's. But now i cant compete against someone who is in the top 1% like i use to... she just doesnt have the kit to fight someone who can parry, evade and cgb at the top level.

Take the shield knock down for example, i use to perfectly time that punishing my opponents missed attack, same with the dodge lights from full lock. I also remember the devs classed this as too powerful in 4v4 fights but tiandi has his kick?? but this is not OP as hes a new character?? BS!!

CHANGE HER BACK.. or at the very least give her her shield perks back! all of them!

[Sweaty_Sock]

CHANGE HER BACK.. or at the very least give her her shield perks back! all of them!

Just... no

Old valk shield was a crutch move excusible when she was weak, if you want it back just play warden with his new shoulder and you have it

[Dry.Fish]

Just... no

Old valk shield was a crutch move excusible when she was weak, if you want it back just play warden with his new shoulder and you have it

Why not...
BP has a counter all move. At least her shield tackle back then didn't counter unblockables. I would take old Valk back any day with her updated chains and wall splat light finishers, maybe keep her deflect a chain starter.

Any way her heavies need a buff at the very least.

[Siegfried-Z]

= every action in the game. The only one questionable at present is the BP and thats a giant flaming storm of argument right now. Give me an attack, I will give you the reaction response.

EDIT: hell give me a character, and action, and the character you want me to do 'best response with'

The reality is you condition your opponent to a move, then break that mold. Valk is THE BEST at that

EDIT EDIT: you are the one leading the charge against BP?!

1/ dont talk to me as you could give lessons. You cant . Unless you're ranked GM.
2/ BP mix up isnt reactable ? The strengh of BP isnt an unreactable mix up. This is his recovery which means you cant punish him while you correctly react to his bash.
Plus i am not leading anything against BP and it has nothing to do in this thread. Dont skip on something else this is irrelevant and even more while making wrong statments.
3/ How could Valk being the best at conditionning your opponent without strong pressure tool ?

At the end i gess we are never going to agree and i dont care.
You dont want a buff for Valk, fine thats your opinion.

But dont put my skills in the balance while i just show you by A+B why Valk isnt a strong pick and you dont have Real argue on your side.
You only quote a single sentence of my post each time and try to avoid my points which is funny.

I and most decent players have this opinion about Valk.
Just look at how low she is in any mode in the competitive tier list made by the best players all arround. Or maybe you should give advices to Barakyeet, Clutch or Setmyx.. yep.

[MCBooma16]

I didn't necessarily have a problem with the devs removing the bash that knocked people down like Tiandi's kick, but right now she feels like she's missing something.

The thing I think every good Valk player should be doing are the nice 35 damage deflects and superior lights on would-be heavy parries. Not necessarily in ganks all the time but if it can be performed well enough constantly it helps a lot damage-wise.

Off a deflect, Valk can perform the shoulder pin or GB. I think going for the GB is absolutely useless unless you want an execution.

Performing a superior light attack on the enemy's heavies typically catches them off-guard, confusing them long enough for you to continue the chain and hit them with another light.

The thing with Valk is she has a lot of depth. I honestly do not see good Valkyrie players struggling, I think every single one of her tools work at every level. Perhaps not the sweep 100% of the time, but definitely not 40% or less of the time like LB's neutral shove. The soft feint bash from a heavy has a higher success rate than what others might think.

The key is to use absolutely everything in her kit. Everything. She has every chain available to her, and eventually the opponent will have to take a risk and try to parry. The opponent could make a mistake, they might not. That's what the game is, and Valkyrie can almost dictate how you respond. That's just the kind of pressure see has, and I think it works.

Of course, like others have said, too, I would like an increase in the damage of her heavies, and tweak to her sweep recovery (So OOS opponents can't GB) and a tweak to her throw distance/speed of throw. This is debatable because it shouldn't be too easy to get the 35dmg wall punish, respectfully so.

However, if I GB someone mid gank and I need to wall splat them, sometimes I wish she would smack them just a little harder with the shield. I get interrupted with how slow it is.

Other than that, I think Valkyrie is a good hero.

[Sweaty_Sock]

1/ dont talk to me as you could give lessons. You cant . Unless you're ranked GM.
2/ BP mix up isnt reactable ? The strengh of BP isnt an unreactable mix up. This is his recovery which means you cant punish him while you correctly react to his bash.
Plus i am not leading anything against BP and it has nothing to do in this thread. Dont skip on something else this is irrelevant and even more while making wrong statments.
3/ How could Valk being the best at conditionning your opponent without strong pressure tool ?

At the end i gess we are never going to agree and i dont care.
You dont want a buff for Valk, fine thats your opinion.

But dont put my skills in the balance while i just show you by A+B why Valk isnt a strong pick and you dont have Real argue on your side.
You only quote a single sentence of my post each time and try to avoid my points which is funny.

I and most decent players have this opinion about Valk.
Just look at how low she is in any mode in the competitive tier list made by the best players all arround. Or maybe you should give advices to Barakyeet, Clutch or Setmyx.. yep.

firstly calm down, its all just words, no need for the rage

1) Wasnt trying to teach you, more highlight that WHATEVER you put as an attack has a correct counterplay, and in the 'ideal' paper world of a forum its very easy to say 'just dodge it' 'just parry it'. As was well put by another post in this thread "you make a play, sometimes they make a mistake, sometimes they don't, thats the game"
2) I Threw BP in there as an olive branch because i was genuinely confused by the idea that something being reactable to was bad for the game. BP safe bash was the closest move I could seem to think of in terms of nothing the enemy can do (while something like a full warden bash gives 'unreactable' heavy thats not really true, given avoiding the bash on reaction ends it...
3) I didnt want to mention skill but did as you said you have a 75% fail rate on combo finishes. This means of 10 combo finishes you attempt you land abit over two. this is worthy of comment?
4) I did say buff her GB damage and light punish. Just don't want to see her kit 'streamlined' into a 50/50 softfeint and lose one of the few true unique characters that seems left
5) stuff the top 1%, they can play the same game as the rest, they aint royalty mate. The day players who take one trade in their favour and then sit there to wait the timer out dictate this game is the day it truly dies. EDIT: alot of 'pros' are simply players willing to do what others would consider boring, unfun, cheesy for the sole purpose of winning in a recreational activity

In summary im all for bringing Valk up to speed with her existing kit, but the powercreep in this game is getting increasingly silly. More and more characters are melding into each other or losing their identity for the purpose of their time at the top of a tier list... and each new character at that top of that list drops another lower. They can't all be S tier & perfect balance is all but impossible.

Some characters are unique and harder to win with. Thats just a good game giving players options of who and what they want from the game

[Siegfried-Z]

firstly calm down, its all just words, no need for the rage

1) Wasnt trying to teach you, more highlight that WHATEVER you put as an attack has a correct counterplay, and in the 'ideal' paper world of a forum its very easy to say 'just dodge it' 'just parry it'. As was well put by another post in this thread "you make a play, sometimes they make a mistake, sometimes they don't, thats the game"
2) I Threw BP in there as an olive branch because i was genuinely confused by the idea that something being reactable to was bad for the game. BP safe bash was the closest move I could seem to think of in terms of nothing the enemy can do (while something like a full warden bash gives 'unreactable' heavy thats not really true, given avoiding the bash on reaction ends it...
3) I didnt want to mention skill but did as you said you have a 75% fail rate on combo finishes. This means of 10 combo finishes you attempt you land abit over two. this is worthy of comment?
4) I did say buff her GB damage and light punish. Just don't want to see her kit 'streamlined' into a 50/50 softfeint and lose one of the few true unique characters that seems left
5) stuff the top 1%, they can play the same game as the rest, they aint royalty mate. The day players who take one trade in their favour and then sit there to wait the timer out dictate this game is the day it truly dies. EDIT: alot of 'pros' are simply players willing to do what others would consider boring, unfun, cheesy for the sole purpose of winning in a recreational activity

In summary im all for bringing Valk up to speed with her existing kit, but the powercreep in this game is getting increasingly silly. More and more characters are melding into each other or losing their identity for the purpose of their time at the top of a tier list... and each new character at that top of that list drops another lower. They can't all be S tier & perfect balance is all but impossible.

Some characters are unique and harder to win with. Thats just a good game giving players options of who and what they want from the game

Its not about rage. I just dont get why you keep jumping in any Valk threads saying how strong she is.
Because it is wrong.

Dont get me wrong, i dont want Valk to become another S tier annoying heroe. Really.
As i dont want her sweep mix up to become a nightmare to deal with.

A tier is a good target for all heroe Imo. And atm she isnt .
As her sweep mix up is incredibly easy to react to for her opponent. Regardless of my skills.

I agree top players tier list are not the end of all. But at least, you can find a logic in their list. Thats why at the bottom with Valk you have some heroes like Musha or Cent and at the top BP, Warden, JJ or Zerk.

Even if we forgot a bit these list, i would not put Valk higher than the very bottom of B tier at best in 1v1 and of course among the weakiest in 4v4, just like them.

She needs more than a heavy opener dmg buff.

Again, she needs all heavies to be buff, a better zone, a shield tackle buff, better stam and an improvment in her sweep mech.

It would only makes her on par with almost all others heroes in terms of dmg, stam and zone.

Would only make possible to use again a moove they litterally killed during her rework.

And at the end it would only makes her main mix up a decent tool as it should be and not the joke it is atm.

These buffs would only be a fair adjustment.