When will you learn | Forums

[Vendelkin]

Thoughts? I like this thread. Seriously tho characters without dodge attacks or the skills you mentioned are frustrating to play right now. Ive been wanting a dodge attack for ages on aramusha (heavy assasin hybrid who has 1 hyper armor attack, no regular bash and absolutely nothing that makes him assasin like either except his soft feint chain game) i mean really who is the aramusha but a glorified infinite chain? Full block doesnt ever work in competent pvp. Sorry mild hijack, but yeah i seriously agree with you.

[LedgeAllegiance]

Bashes aren't the issue in and of itself. We need to look at the bigger picture: How other heroes can respond to them.

On one hand, Players who use Heroes with dodge attacks/bashes, dodge GB (raiders) or HidS/BulC/SeifS, will not see it as an issue.
If they read correctly, they can avoid damage, and even counter with their own attacks.

On the other side, Players who chose to play Heroes without these moves will be frustrated because they have no way to counter/break out of the vicious cycle of bash, light, or worse.
If they read correctly and dodge, they receive zero reward and everything goes back to neutral, where in the bash cycle can continue. (Stamina cost is miniscule on bashes)
Frustration will mount, causing them to voice their opinion on the forum and then get told to Git Gud" by the former group of players because we're all toxic.

How do you balance that? Not up to me really here, but you know who's bash isn't so annoying?
The good ol Nobushi.
Manage to dodge the kick? There's a free GB...unless she qued up a light, then you eat that in the face.
Read her like a book and saw the light coming? Free parry for ya! Everyone is happy.
Make all bashes like that. 50/50 is still there, fair no? Thoughts?

I made a suggestion to fix a lot of issues with all the characters would be to make any ub of any type only be guaranteed follow up if it lands but gb light/heavy punished if missed. Example: valks sweep if missed has large recovery time and punishable by dodging attacks or gb.

I play raider and cant dodge gb BP sb or a lot of new heroes due to light that follows the missing ub. Not sure how much would be involved to make this change but would fix all the no risk, high reward attacks going on. Just my opinion though. Let me know what you think.

[RiceComboA]

I made a suggestion to fix a lot of issues with all the characters would be to make any ub of any type only be guaranteed follow up if it lands but gb light/heavy punished if missed. Example: valks sweep if missed has large recovery time and punishable by dodging attacks or gb.

I play raider and cant dodge gb BP sb or a lot of new heroes due to light that follows the missing ub. Not sure how much would be involved to make this change but would fix all the no risk, high reward attacks going on. Just my opinion though. Let me know what you think.

A guaranteed punish may not be the best solution. We will just roll back to the defensive meta with staring matches to see who gets bored and make the first stupid move.

I agree that there should be enough recovery on a missed to give the other party some form of retaliation so it doesn't feel like highway robbery for some of the picks. I think that would encourage some sort of mind game/mix up plays other than just spamming a simple bash over and over till it works. As I mentioned earlier, the nobu's kick comes to mind, allowing a missed basher to cancel the recovery with a qued follow up attack to ward off a GB. Counter plays and just out witting your opponent is way more rewarding for me than just picking the cheapest Hero.

I've never played Raider, but I think you're somewhat safe from the bash/GB mix up no? If you know they've qued a light after they missed, then you should anticipate it and wait to parry.

[LedgeAllegiance]

A guaranteed punish may not be the best solution. We will just roll back to the defensive meta with staring matches to see who gets bored and make the first move.

I've never played Raider, but I think you're somewhat safe from the bash/GB mix up no? If you know they've qued a light after they missed, then you should anticipate it and wait to parry.

I can agree there didnt think of that causing more turtle meta. Problem is with most assassins is BP is able to block the attack even after missing bash or lights. BP is able to block valks superior light. Will get proof in a video next time I record.

I still struggle with raider dodge/parry but know it is possible. I havent been able to dodge bash and light to get a gb yet but may be possible. BP is able to block dodging stun tap from raider even after missed bash.

Why I believe he needs his recovery times needs looking into especailly from missed bashes.