A Comprehensive Opinion on Perks. | Forums

[VolatileKnight]

Please don't lump this in with the Sticky, I want the devs and players to be able to get a really good look at this system, and why players may not like it. I'm going to go through why the system itself doesn't quite seem to fit the game and how it was initially built almost 2 years ago and what parts of this system could be considered problematic. Not the whole system Ubi, just parts. I want to clarify that.

Gale Storm - I genuinely feel this shouldn't have been added at all. We had movement speed stats at release, but they took it out because 1, it did not pertain to the overall game style and 2, not many people used it. It was a dead stat that didn't give any meaningful boost. Now you have to kill a fellow player late-game to even activate it, and it's temporary.

Devourer - Upon kill you gain health, which I don't have a problem with. I have problem with it being locked in this perk tier system that progresses through the game. That mechanic itself makes the perks themselves feel clunky, it feels like they don't fit in For Honor at all. It's more like a second set of feats, which to me seems counter-intuitive. We need to nerf and look at feats, not essentially add more.

Shields Up - You get a small shield bonus (similar to what you would get in deathmatch) that only activates once you spawn, or are revived. This feels like it has a niche use, since the only optimal time you can use it is when you are revived, that's the only time it actually has a use. Again, locked behind the progression system. I've already explained how it makes the game feel, but I will elaborate more at the end of my post.

Radiant Rebound - Similar to Gale Storm, except that parameters to activate it are similar to shields up. You get another movement speed boost after you spawn or are revived. Again, movement speed was removed once because it felt clunky in the game, and didn't offer any individuality, or a boost that the player would grind to get.

Aegis - All shields are increased by 20%. So that applies to Shields Up or boosts that you pick up in deathmatch. These defense stats won't make a difference I feel, as they are locked behind a progression system similar to feats. Not to mention, the only time this can be effectively used is when you get revived and have Shields Up applied. It's not exactly rare to get revived, but it's uncommon. Most of the time the fight just rages on, and you spawn back in your area. Yes, revives do happen, but these perks feel as if they apply to a very small niche in the game. These perks won't have much use time because of that, I feel.

Remedy - Player health on kill. I feel like executions were something special in the game, because it was a kill that healed you. You had to work for it, by somehow opening up a heavy on your opponent. Afterwards, you rewarded with cool animations and effects, along with your newly regained health. I feel this perk detracts from that special feeling quite a bit. Executions were something unique to this game, something that really caught the eye of players since the start. I feel that this seems to nullify that. Not saying that executions are now useless, but this seems to encroach on their place in the game, and I don't think that fits how For Honor should be.

Endurance - Stamina cost reduction (3% for a maximum of 4 gains) per renown level. I believe this was for Shugoki, so he ends up panting at the start, and can only unlock his stamina build in a similar manner to feats. Again, I wouldn't have a problem with this if Perks weren't for some reason locked behind a progression wall mid game, like feats. Feats are powerful enough to warrant that, perks and gear stats don't impact enough of the game to justify them being locked behind progression.

Damage perks - Okay now these ones are a bit weird, since they give a massive attack boost on the next attack after killing a player, or respawning. It makes the perk itself feel clunky and unfinished.

Now I know that I haven't listed every perk, but I didn't want to have too much of a wall of text. So, back on track.

This progression system for perks that are tied in with Renown disrupt the flow of the game in my opinion. Imagine if in Call of Duty, your weapon didn't do full damage until you got a kill, and then the next bullet fires and the full damage is applied, but it resets to half power after. That's kind of how these perks are. Granted, I know this isn't Call of Duty and that's comparing apples and oranges, but the basic logic can still be applied.

Perks feel almost like weak feats, not really a replacement for Gear Stats. Gear Stats had flat boosts that you could work for, and be proud to have on your character. You noticed the difference when switching from something damage oriented to stamina oriented with a heavy. Alternatively, you would notice damage made all the more difference on your assassin than it did with stamina stats.

Some of the perks are even recycled Stats that didn't fit into the game, but now they are locked behind pre-requisites and other parameters, even if it's currently equipped on your character. They feel clunky and unfinished, almost as if they imported from another game.

The problem players have with your perks is that the boosts don't feel like they impact gameplay at all, as they are locked behind said parameters but they also seem to have very niche applications, which hurts the system a lot more rather than balance the game.

Gear stats could have used tweaks, yes, but these perks just don't feel like they belong in the game. Thank you to anyone who took the time to read my breakdown and why I myself do not agree with perks. I've left out talking about the compensation or how the transition was handled because I feel that's not our core issue. A lot of the perks feel like a "filler" of sorts, something to push out so that the system is fleshed out. Take for instance the movement speed or attack boost perks. They don't seem to properly work with the flow of the game, or the flow of a match.

I hope that Ubisoft will read this and take into consideration.



TL;DR --- Perks themselves seem to have niche applications for the most part, either the parameters that need to be met to activate them or the inherent Perk's effect itself. You can't really notice them while they are there, and the moments in which you can notice them are immensely narrowed down. I don't feel the Perk system itself is inherently bad, or not beneficial to the game. The Parameters pushed onto Perks and the Perk effects themselves are the problem.

[Saratoya29]

Please don't lump this in with the Sticky, I want the devs and players to be able to get a really good look at this system, and why players may not like it. I'm going to go through why the system itself doesn't quite seem to fit the game and how it was initially built almost 2 years ago and what parts of this system could be considered problematic. Not the whole system Ubi, just parts. I want to clarify that.

Gale Storm - I genuinely feel this shouldn't have been added at all. We had movement speed stats at release, but they took it out because 1, it did not pertain to the overall game style and 2, not many people used it. It was a dead stat that didn't give any meaningful boost. Now you have to kill a fellow player late-game to even activate it, and it's temporary.

Devourer - Upon kill you gain health, which I don't have a problem with. I have problem with it being locked in this perk tier system that progresses through the game. That mechanic itself makes the perks themselves feel clunky, it feels like they don't fit in For Honor at all. It's more like a second set of feats, which to me seems counter-intuitive. We need to nerf and look at feats, not essentially add more.

Shields Up - You get a small shield bonus (similar to what you would get in deathmatch) that only activates once you spawn, or are revived. This feels like it has a niche use, since the only optimal time you can use it is when you are revived, that's the only time it actually has a use. Again, locked behind the progression system. I've already explained how it makes the game feel, but I will elaborate more at the end of my post.

Radiant Rebound - Similar to Gale Storm, except that parameters to activate it are similar to shields up. You get another movement speed boost after you spawn or are revived. Again, movement speed was removed once because it felt clunky in the game, and didn't offer any individuality, or a boost that the player would grind to get.

Aegis - All shields are increased by 20%. So that applies to Shields Up or boosts that you pick up in deathmatch. These defense stats won't make a difference I feel, as they are locked behind a progression system similar to feats. Not to mention, the only time this can be effectively used is when you get revived and have Shields Up applied. It's not exactly rare to get revived, but it's uncommon. Most of the time the fight just rages on, and you spawn back in your area. Yes, revives do happen, but these perks feel as if they apply to a very small niche in the game. These perks won't have much use time because of that, I feel.

Remedy - Player health on kill. I feel like executions were something special in the game, because it was a kill that healed you. You had to work for it, by somehow opening up a heavy on your opponent. Afterwards, you rewarded with cool animations and effects, along with your newly regained health. I feel this perk detracts from that special feeling quite a bit. Executions were something unique to this game, something that really caught the eye of players since the start. I feel that this seems to nullify that. Not saying that executions are now useless, but this seems to encroach on their place in the game, and I don't think that fits how For Honor should be.

Endurance - Stamina cost reduction (3% for a maximum of 4 gains) per renown level. I believe this was for Shugoki, so he ends up panting at the start, and can only unlock his stamina build in a similar manner to feats. Again, I wouldn't have a problem with this if Perks weren't for some reason locked behind a progression wall mid game, like feats. Feats are powerful enough to warrant that, perks and gear stats don't impact enough of the game to justify them being locked behind progression.

Damage perks - Okay now these ones are a bit weird, since they give a massive attack boost on the next attack after killing a player, or respawning. It makes the perk itself feel clunky and unfinished.

Now I know that I haven't listed every perk, but I didn't want to have too much of a wall of text. So, back on track.

This progression system for perks that are tied in with Renown disrupt the flow of the game in my opinion. Imagine if in Call of Duty, your weapon didn't do full damage until you got a kill, and then the next bullet fires and the full damage is applied, but it resets to half power after. That's kind of how these perks are. Granted, I know this isn't Call of Duty and that's comparing apples and oranges, but the basic logic can still be applied.

Perks feel almost like weak feats, not really a replacement for Gear Stats. Gear Stats had flat boosts that you could work for, and be proud to have on your character. You noticed the difference when switching from something damage oriented to stamina oriented with a heavy. Alternatively, you would notice damage made all the more difference on your assassin than it did with stamina stats.

Some of the perks are even recycled Stats that didn't fit into the game, but now they are locked behind pre-requisites and other parameters, even if it's currently equipped on your character. They feel clunky and unfinished, almost as if they imported from another game.

The problem players have with your perks is that the boosts don't feel like they impact gameplay at all, as they are locked behind said parameters but they also seem to have very niche applications, which hurts the system a lot more rather than balance the game.

Gear stats could have used tweaks, yes, but these perks just don't feel like they belong in the game. Thank you to anyone who took the time to read my breakdown and why I myself do not agree with perks. I've left out talking about the compensation or how the transition was handled because I feel that's not our core issue. A lot of the perks feel like a "filler" of sorts, something to push out so that the system is fleshed out. Take for instance the movement speed or attack boost perks. They don't seem to properly work with the flow of the game, or the flow of a match.

I hope that Ubisoft will read this and take into consideration.



TL;DR --- Perks themselves seem to have niche applications for the most part, either the parameters that need to be met to activate them or the inherent Perk's effect itself. You can't really notice them while they are there, and the moments in which you can notice them are immensely narrowed down. I don't feel the Perk system itself is inherently bad, or not beneficial to the game. The Parameters pushed onto Perks and the Perk effects themselves are the problem.

It is obvious they rushed the perks system. The deadline for MF was coming up and they had no better idea for replacing the gear stats. Perks are clunky and meh overall but still better than gear stats which was hurting the game.

[VolatileKnight]

It is obvious they rushed the perks system. The deadline for MF was coming up and they had no better idea for replacing the gear stats. Perks are clunky and meh overall but still better than gear stats which was hurting the game.

I still personally fail to see where they hurt the game. I can see where they might have hurt your opinion of the game, but they haven't hurt the game.

7% flat attack bonus and flat 12% stam reduction is a lot better than getting 20% attack once or 16% at late game.

20% once allows for a Lawbringer to do 54 damage from 45. As opposed to 7% of 45 which would make the damage 48. Keep in mind, that's his regular heavies. Not unblockables. Also the 16% seems far too unbalanced at the moment. As it stands, while they are niche they can essentially be abused in much the same way stats were. So Stats were never the problem.

If they revert to flat boosts, the game will have a much more even playing field. If they kept the perks system, but kept the old Stats themselves instead of perks and made it a flat boost, the game would play out more even and feel no where near as clunky, unfinished and rushed as it does now.

They do need to tweak some stuff, but as it stands Perks can abused far more on paper than stats ever could. You also have the option of stacking shields and purposely dying in a place then getting revived by your team mate to get the buffs, which would equal out waaay more defence than stats ever could have.

I understand that Stats weren't perfect and needed to be checked up on. The core of this system could have really helped out Gear stats and put players on quite the even playing field.

But this current system creates even more of a gap between newer players such as yourself and high ranking veterans. Because they can abuse perks in just those ways to get more out of it than Stats ever could have.

But as it stands, perks are not better than Gear Stats, and the reasons I'm stating in this post as well as the OP are the exact reasons why. Tweaking numbers and bringing back the basic core of stats (damage, stamina, defense) while fleshing out other stats and doing away with Revenge stats would put this game back into a healthy state, where new players and veterans can play alongside one another. The determining factor would be skill.

Both systems can be abused, albeit differently. Something I hadn't initially noticed and is quite worrying.

[yfkutfui]

They have ruined this game for me, utterly ruined it. i cannot stand it anymore,its boring and tedious, oh look im OOS?

[VolatileKnight]

They have ruined this game for me, utterly ruined it. i cannot stand it anymore,its boring and tedious, oh look im OOS?

Yeah I know, they kinda goofed up the system by locking everything behind odd parameters and prerequisites.

[Ubi-Lucipus]

Since you also posted this in the main sticky thread I shall close this thread.

Please keep to the sticky.