Member
I've had problems with hit stun while in ganks before. Some one will get one hit on you and suddenly it becomes this huge domino effect of getting hit by attack after attack and it's completely free because all attacks are free during hit stun. So hit, stun, hit, stun, hit, stun, etc. until you die. And you can die this way by getting hit once in a gank.
This is something that needs to be addressed, not only for 4v4's but also for individual characters, or should i just say 1 character I know of. IT'S KENSEI. If kensei gets swift strike to hit, his follow up light is almost always confirmed because it's sped up and hits during the first attacks hit-stun. This a huge problem because kensei already undermines the dodge attack ability for most assassins having a dodge heavy attack, which does more damage and is less punishable on a parry, but now it confirms a light and does a total of 40 damage just from a dodge attack.
Let me just say that kensei's damage is overturned. He should not be doing 20 damage on light attacks. His light chain adds up to 60 damage, and every attack in his chain can be soft feinted with hyper armor at 400ms. Kensei's zone should be 15, his lights should be 15 and not have hyper armor. maybe his top light could be 17, but 20 all around except side lights which you don't have to use anyways, that's pretty ridiculous. Kensei is the new PK right now.
But as for fixing this hit-stun issue on kensei right now, I think there is a reasonable solution that will solve the issue in ganks and with the character.
SOLUTION: ALLOW PLAYERS WHO ARE HIT-STUNNED TO PARRY OUT OF THE ANIMATION.
This will fix the issue of ganks where you just take hit after hit for free while stunned, and it won't allow kensei to get that follow up light for free, but hit-stun should still take down your ability to block. So it will open you up for attack and the ONLY way to opt out, is to parry. So it will provide a good risk/reward for kensei to use his follow up light for high damage after a hit, knowing that you can't block and have to parry and could even mix it up with a heavy for more damage if he know you will parry. But if kensei want's that free follow up light during a hit-stun, he should have to risk getting his light attack parried so that players can actually punish him and not just eat 40 damage on every dodge attack.
That being said, kensei does need that light damage to be reduced. so 20 swift strike and the light reduced to 15, so he should have an opportunity to get 35 damage on the combo. or get 20 damage, get parried and lose a trade. Or have them both blocked or parried if used incorrectly.
Anyways, I think this is a great solution that will fix issues with ganks as well as with kensei. And I forgot to cover it in my last post addressing gaps in the defensive meta that are allowing the offensive meta to completely take over and leaving defensive turtle meta character at the bottom of the tier list.
P.S. Orochi still needs an opener. He is shut down simply from external block. Not even an orochi main, just watching Hmmmmm1 and he's struggling a lot with that in brawls. The other team just locks on to his teammate, and ignores him until they can gank him. Speed itself is not a reliable pressure when you can opt out of guess guard directions. Kensei is still immensely better than orochi in every way by the way.
Anyways. Thanks for all the improvements with the game, but I hope to hear some feedback and addressing these issues. I'll be watching warriors den.
Senior Member
Hit stun is definitely a thing but it mostly affects characters with reflex guard rather than static guard heros. In 1v1s only two characters so far can actually stun lock their opponent into being unable to bring up their guard in time to block the next attack and neither one of them is the Kensei. They are Aramusha via his infinite light chain and Orochi via hitting you in quick succession with his 400ms lights. Both of these characters can put you into a stun lock situation if you fail to block the first hit.
Kensei does not get a confirmed light after landing swift strike. His side light after swift strike comes out fast but it can always be blocked even by reflex guard characters provided they don't make a mistake.
Now let's address the other factual innacuracies you made:
- Kensei's dodge attack damage was not changed when he was reworked. It still does 20 damage as it has always done. The only changes made to swift strike was the input and recovery was changed to that of a heavy attack and its stamina cost went up to 12 (from 6).
- Only his light finishers and his side heavy finishers have hyper armour. He cannot generate hyper armour out of thin air from feinting, that's the Beserker's thing.
- None of Kensei's attacks are 400ms. Even his zone is only 500ms.
- Kensei cannot put anyone in a stun lock because none of his chains are fast enough including his light after swift strike.
Kensei has always had the highest damage light attacks in the game because it compensates him for having some of the slowest and most telegraphed heavies in the game and the lowest health pool out of all 3 Vanguards - he only has 5 more health than an assassin. You really should try to understand everything about the character and how he fits into the roster before making uninformed suggestions on changing him. Case in point: to call Kensei the new PK is frankly nonsense and only shows that you have not bothered to put any kind of facts based research into your opinion.
Member
Hit stun is definitely an issue with kensei, I'm pretty sure the second light in his chain is 400ms, and I thought his soft feint lights were also 400ms. And his zone does come out a lot faster than it should most of the time.
He's basically the new pk because the zone has little startup frames, making it jump out faster than it should, and does 20 damage, top light is 20, and he can soft feint lights from any direction those also do 20, so the fact that his side lights are 12 is irrelevant because there's no need for him to use them.
But it's been confirmed from multiple people that if kensei lands a swift strike, half the time that follow up light is confirmed, especially when it hits when he switches targets and it has the sped up unlock effect. You don't have to talk down to me. His follow up light after swift strike doesn't need to be 20 damage, especially when he can get that for free most of the time. His regular heavy soft feint lights don't need to be 20, his zone doesn't need to be 20, even his top light doesn't need to be 20.
His side lights should be 15 instead of 12, his top light should be 17, his zone should be 15, his soft feint lights should be 15, unless it's the unblockable chain finisher soft feint, that can be 20. But he doesn't need way to constantly do 20 damage on every light and zone and get away with 40 damage on swift strikes. I'm not saying nerf him into the ground, be reasonable.
They did a good job with a rework and he's near perfect but he needs minor changes. 20 across the board for lights and 40 on swift strikes that hit are ridiculous. Everything else is fine, but 20 damage lights is overturned. All of that goes up to 25 with gear and then it's basically a fast heavy attack. If they made those number changes he would still be fine.
Even long time Kensei mains aren't playing him because he feels too cheesy when you only have to use top light and zone and you can deal out 100 damage in 4 hits. Kensei lights are doing more damage than Orochi's storm rush heavy.
Member
Member
when it comes to the hit stun issue,I find on console it happens more often like how he described it being a domino effect. on PC while it does happen it’s not nearly as severe and I’m able to recover. Playing on console I find it harder to go off reaction with a lot of character and their light attacks, which causes this domino effect to happen because I miss one then I’m trying to block or parry the other attack.
