Sam Fisher Mission needs CHECKPOINTS | Forums

[DexLuther]

Slipping in is not the problem, I can assure you. It's the frustrating difficulty, the trial and error and the cheesing tactics that are needed to get in. It's not fun.
And like I said, a Ghost - a member of the Ghost Recon Spec Ops unit - would not spare a second in sniping sentries if it increased the chances of success. The mission doesn't make sense from both a narrative and gameplay perspective.
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No Ghosts have missions where they have to slip in, complete a mission and then slip out. Leaving a trail of dead bodies behind you would lead the enemy to know someone had been there, which may lead them to uncover whatever it is the Ghosts did.

If the mission was to plant a bomb to take out some important person, then taking out enemies would tell them that someone had been there, which would cause them to search the base and possibly discover the bomb you planted. The bomb would fail to take out that important person.

If the mission is to get information of someone's location, hen taking out enemies would tell them that someone had been there, which would cause them to search the base and possibly move the target's location. Goodluck taking out that VIP when they change their location as a precaution to your suspected intrusion.

The mission is hard, yes, but it's completely doable if you make use of your tools like the diversion lures.

[SnW-Heartbreak1]

No Ghosts have missions where they have to slip in, complete a mission and then slip out. Leaving a trail of dead bodies behind you would lead the enemy to know someone had been there, which may lead them to uncover whatever it is the Ghosts did.

If the mission was to plant a bomb to take out some important person, then taking out enemies would tell them that someone had been there, which would cause them to search the base and possibly discover the bomb you planted. The bomb would fail to take out that important person.

If the mission is to get information of someone's location, hen taking out enemies would tell them that someone had been there, which would cause them to search the base and possibly move the target's location. Goodluck taking out that VIP when they change their location as a precaution to your suspected intrusion.

The mission is hard, yes, but it's completely doable if you make use of your tools like the diversion lures.

[tbtstt82]

I did find replaying the stealth section a little frustrating given how hectic the firefight is but, as said above, this is supposed to be a Ghost Recon game so I appreciate them making it a bit of a challenge.

There did seem to be slight variation in the movement pattern of the soldiers in the base, but the infiltration can be done very quickly once you got that figured!

[shobhit7777777]

No Ghosts have missions where they have to slip in, complete a mission and then slip out. Leaving a trail of dead bodies behind you would lead the enemy to know someone had been there, which may lead them to uncover whatever it is the Ghosts did.

If the mission was to plant a bomb to take out some important person, then taking out enemies would tell them that someone had been there, which would cause them to search the base and possibly discover the bomb you planted. The bomb would fail to take out that important person.

If the mission is to get information of someone's location, hen taking out enemies would tell them that someone had been there, which would cause them to search the base and possibly move the target's location. Goodluck taking out that VIP when they change their location as a precaution to your suspected intrusion.

The mission is hard, yes, but it's completely doable if you make use of your tools like the diversion lures.

You're missing the point.

It's not the Ghost's job to be doing spy stuff or Splinter Celling around. Realistically all of this is achieved through Human assets - Spies. Undercover professionals, people who've been bribed, a person who believes in 'the cause'....not a team of US Spec Ops whose primary job is 'Direct Action'.

Slipping in and out is a cool fantasy and all but it's not what Ghosts - modeled on real world SOF units - do. Sure, there are some missions where they have to gather intel, but it's not the same as Sam Fishering around. The majority of the No-Kill restrictions in Splinter Cell arose not only from OPSEC requirements but also from not causing a diplomatic incident.
The Ghosts are Commandos, not Spies

And all the examples you've given are idiotic beyond belief. I'd target the VIP while he is most vulnerable - when moving from one location to another. Intelligence gathering isn't the Ghost's mandate. Even the in-game premise makes it plenty clear -Destabilize the Cartel

The Insta-fail missions in the game are indeed flawed because missions aren't failed because of arbitrary nonsense - if you get detected then guess what...the mission changes. The Ghosts aren't pulled out of country and sent home.

Keeping a small footprint is indeed important and stealthy is KEY...but no-takedown and detection limitation makes no sense if it leads to mission failure. A trail of bodies is irrelelvant if the objective is met.

Furthermore, the Sam Fisher mission also doesn't place emphasis on WHY you should not kill. It makes no sense from a realism or gameplay perspective. The truth is, when a unit like the Ghosts would be tasked to infiltrate a compound they'd likely try to keep the body count low but would not pack up and leave IF they had to drop a few sentries in order to create an opening. It doesn't work that way.

The tactical, smart way to do it would be to sneak in, take the immediate threats like the Snipers and lone sentries out. These are COVERT operations not CLANDESTINE operations. Ghost Recon is not Splinter Cell.

Lastly, the mission is indeed doable (Finished it way back, thanks) but that's not the point of contention here. It's implausible, not fun and idiotic in design.

[GiveMeTactical]

Perhaps there is yet hope that the Devs will revise it at a later point and finished with the concept they started with? I am saying this since it appears they are sticking around for year 2.

[BERTANDERNY]

This mission most definitely needs checkpoints. To finally get through to sam without killing anyone just to be swarmed and kikked and have to do it all over again is frustrating. The comments above to "slip on and slip out again" and "use your tools" are irrelevant. You are specifically tasked with not using your tools. You cant kill. And then you essentially get jumped. Its the lack of a checkpoint right there thats daft.

Also, we need a non lethal takedown option. If we could actually knock people out, this wouldn't be a thing.

[DanHibikiFanXM]

No Ghosts have missions where they have to slip in, complete a mission and then slip out. Leaving a trail of dead bodies behind you would lead the enemy to know someone had been there, which may lead them to uncover whatever it is the Ghosts did..

lol what? The end of the mission leaves the entire camp destroyed along with several attack helicopters and whatever reinforcements that came to stop Sam and the Ghosts. It’s a scene of absolute carnage which completely renders the stealth portion of the mission pointless and meaningless. It’s stupid.

There have also been exactly zero missions in the main GR titles that have ever required total, non-lethal stealth. There have been missions or portions of missions that require the player to not raise alarms, but never with a non-lethal caveat.

[jmlaneCA]

I managed to get this done after a few failed attempts, so I understand the frustrations.

I believe a checkpoint after stage 2 would be a good compromise, but it is certainly doable without one.

[BERTANDERNY]

Im very early in the base game so im coming up against it a bit. The amount of times though that i would have managed if the ai team mates were slightly less ******ed. Or whent where I actually told them a bit more precisely. A checkpoint at the mid stage would remove all the frustration though. Hopefully the devs see this and keep it in mind in the future.

I just realised that the forum word guardian police bot thing has "blanked" out ******. Thats a bit ridiculous. A bit funny. And also a bit sad.
It is/was a real word in the medical profession not to long ago. Just like idiot and moron before that. Not only are people offended by normal descriptive non swearing words now, but so are the computers we use.
I just foond the comedy worth a comment.