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  1. #1

    I guess I'll be the only one holding out.

    Let me start by saying that I hate making a post like this. (inb4 then don't make it)
    Simply put: I think that unless Ubi fixes it, the MP lobby system will cripple the game just like FC3; I think that no amount of amazing editor will save it from that.
    (inb4 then don't buy it) Well that's my point exactly; I'm not going to. Not until I've seen decent evidence that it's actually worth buying.

    I'm guessing there's a decent chance someone will just delete this thread.

    In some of my recent post, I think I've made it abundantly clear that I don't think FC5 will survive very long. But listen, I really want to buy this game, and it's frustrating as hell that things look so bad.

    To reiterate: FC:IP and FC2 were the only games that gave proper options for hosting. FC:IP lasted a long time, though I'm not sure its current status. But FC2, which released nearly ten years ago, is actually still alive. I recently (this week) played in a few full lobbies, including hosting one of my own (until the game froze.) That's impressive, especially since FC2 is an absolute crap game.

    "But wait!"

    No, FC2 is a crap game. I love it, but it's crap. The controls are garbage, the movement is garbage, the netcode is garbage, the framerate is garbage, the weapon balance is garbage; weapon degradation, malaria, countless other minor issues. All in all, it's really bad. But we loved it, and some people still love it enough to keep playing it nearly a decade later.

    FC3 on the other hand, did a great job of fixing nearly all of the above-mentioned issues. It was great. But the lobby system was useless, and the random playlists didn't work. Last I checked(a few days ago), people are only playing battle mix (which is just stock maps) and literally no one was playing any of the custom map playlists. Despite all of its massive improvements in every other area, it's essentially dead. (and also only six years old)

    FC4... oh yeah, that didn't even have multiplayer worth mentioning.

    Now remember all the complaining surrounding FC3? Remember how Ubi fixed it?
    They didn't.

    Remember the deceit about FC4's lack of mp?
    Remember how Ubi never addressed that at all, despite hyping the map editor and even deceitfully hyping the addition of co-op in a later patch?

    FC5's system will not work. I said it even before the map editor announcement that I knew Ubi would foul something up. I'm still prepared to eat my words, but I'm still standing by them. Hell, I'm prepared to buy a whole new PS4 pro, just to play FC5...

    ...if it's worth playing.

    Which unless they make some major fixes, it won't be.
    FC5's system removes all control from the player as to what they actually want to play. I don't just want to play my own maps; they're garbage anyway. I want to play other people's maps, because I can't even remember all the people who are so talented at this that they should be given money for their efforts. But I don't want to play junk. I want to be able to join a host I know has good taste in maps and play with them all day/night/weekend. I want randoms to be allowed to join, because I think they should experience the fun of a good lobby as well.

    FC5's system won't allow that. It just won't.
    It's essentially random, with only the illusion of control. It is and will be abused by morons/griefers. What little I played of the Halo series made it evidently clear that if people don't get the map vote they want, they'll just quit. If they quit it'll unbalance the teams. If people are dropped in mid-match to balance the teams, they're likely to be joining a losing team playing on a junk map. Sounds like fun.
    I could go on for pages about why it won't work, but I already have, and so has everyone else. Moving on.

    Private matches.
    Without proper hosting and host control/options, this will die too. FC:IP showed that good private match options can make a game last for a long time. FC3 showed that without them, it won't.

    "But I've tested it; it works, trust me." "You haven't played it, you don't know."
    Sorry to anyone who's playtested any of the multiplayer, but you've only played in a very closed environment with the specific goal of testing. No one has actually gotten to played the finished game in a real world environment. In the real world, even private matches will be horribly clumsy at best. Also, I still fail to see how anyone who's played around with such a system could ever imagine it actually working. I'm sure there's some level of restriction for what you can say about it; I understand that. But unless there are some massive elements that simply aren't being told, I still fail to see how it could ever work.

    I see a lot of complaining threads, I see a lot of feature request threads, I see a lot of wishful thinking threads.
    What I don't understand is why it sounds like everyone has this game preordered or why it sounds like everyone will buy it day one.
    Why would you do that?

    For me, I only give a flip about the map editor + mp, so the SP/co-op/whatever else isn't worth the purchase for me.
    If I buy this game before I know it's any good, then Ubi gets what they want, and no longer has any incentive to make any changes to attract me and my money. I refuse to give them money on the hope that they'll support the game or fix it. Ubisoft has one of the worst track records for QA, patches, or general support. May I refer back the the stinging irony of Vaa's "Did I ever tell you the definition of insanity?"

    Simply put, there's no reason (unless you actually care about the SP) to buy the game until it's been made clear that the mp and it's features are functional to the point that they will last more than a month.
    If it turns out to be crap, no money spent, no time wasted, no expectations/hopes crushed.
    If it turns out to be great/gets fixed, then the game will last for years! No worries about missing the launch if the game is good enough to support this community. The community is dedicated enough that it stuck with FC2 despite its massive flaws. I just don't see FC5 being that good.

    But I'm alone in this mindset, right?
    Is there anyone else who's gotten sick enough of Ubi's nonsense that you don't trust them to even release a functioning game?
    Is there anyone else who will look past how much they want the game to be great and see that all signs point to it being another complete waste of time?
    Is there anyone else who will only buy a game after they see it's good?

    I guess I'm the only one.
    I guess Ubisoft making $60 less isn't enough to sway their minds.
    Oh well.
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  2. #2
    I don't know how you can say that you are the only one after seeing all these complaints here. I have been holding out since FC2 for a functional lobby system/MP.

    This map editor sounds simply amazing. From what it seems to be, the lobby system is definitely not perfect and could use some improvements. But it definitely is an improvement from previous versions (from what I hear). Now is this one worth holding out on again? I simply don't know. Like you, I probably will wait to see if ubi gives proper custom lobbies like in Fc2, or every other decently made game, with match options to the player. I also have more of a push to do this because I cannot play 12 player escape maps as it seems right now. If this is not possible, I don't know.

    For players designing dm and tdm, not having true custom lobbies are an inconvenience, but I don't think it will kill the MP. I'm just bummed that it seems that I cant do what I want to do from the get go, or it may be difficult to do it.

    But I am really, really on the fence of buying this one. All we can hope for is that ubi patches these truly player hosted lobbies into the game. If they do that I'm alllll in. And I don't think there is anything that can make us doubt that, after all they have added to this game already, there won't be any updates to the mp lobby system. I hope and I think ubi is on the ball this time around.
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  3. #3
    As someone who has been nothing but critical of Ubisoft for about a decade now (I was a forum member far longer than this profile suggests) and who skipped 3 and 4 until they were cheap I've bought in despite being HUGELY skeptical of the lobby system. The system as it stands will almost certainly fail as FC3 did. BUT... don't forget that FC2 didn't ship with it's beautiful hosting tools. They were patched in after backlash. Also Ubisoft as a company seems to be shifting into a "support our games extensively post launch" type of company. Case in point: Rainbow Six. So I have hope that they will see that this system is terrible post launch and patch it.

    Honestly I'm just too much of a mapper. I skipped both 3 and 4 and I miss mapping SO FREAKING MUCH! Even if it stays a terrible terrible system I need to get my map making fix.
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  4. #4
    Ol Barakus's Avatar Far Cry 3 Elite Member
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    I totally get what youre saying OP! Totally...
    But i took a jump, and pre-ordered...even after i said i would never do that after the FC3 lobby fail.

    If all goes south once again, at the very least, i'll have a wonderful time making maps, and thinking..."what if?, or, if only?"
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  5. #5
    Hey Neg, its been a while buddy!

    Im sure youve read all my posts, along with the others it seems.

    Trust me I fully understand you POV.

    If I am honest, If I hadnt been testing it, I would only be getting it for the SP. But since I have, I am pretty excited overall for the whole IGE, mp and sp maps.

    But take it with a grain of salt, thats my opinion.
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  6. #6
    I can see where you are coming from. Ive been let down ever since the removal of MP maps/ vehicles/ lobbies/ etc..

    Although, I did pre order it for the sp/co op before I even heard about the IGE's return.. Wow, the return of mp, vehicles, and the asset library alone.. Luckily, I have a few friends that are willing to test each others maps. Plus I am rather savvy at social media and finding communities to get involved with. I mean it's 2018.. I can find a lobby for games on my dreamcast. no bull ****.

    Also, I dropped 60 bucks on a steak tonight.. It was overcooked. I will digest it and pass it soon. The amount of fun I will have creating/playing maps (not to mention sp/co op) will be a sound investment imo. for me. personally.

    I am here because I am very excited for this game and am eager for any information. I hope you find the game that you do want to buy.
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  7. #7
    I am as depressed and mad as the guy that is posting this thread. They arent able to make multiplayer enjoyable for me and all their fans typed like the same things for years in like about 200 threads, and no I dont find that really hilarious to type and type words until Ubisoft wake up after ten years of failure.
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  8. #8
    Originally Posted by usmovers_02 Go to original post
    BUT... don't forget that FC2 didn't ship with it's beautiful hosting tools. They were patched in after backlash.
    I've seen this mentioned a couple times, care to explain?
    I know they added some options. What exactly was missing at launch?

    Originally Posted by usmovers_02 Go to original post
    Also Ubisoft as a company seems to be shifting into a "support our games extensively post launch" type of company. Case in point: Rainbow Six. So I have hope that they will see that this system is terrible post launch and patch it.
    I hope so too.

    Originally Posted by akilyoung Go to original post
    Hey Neg, its been a while buddy!

    Im sure youve read all my posts, along with the others it seems.

    Trust me I fully understand you POV.

    If I am honest, If I hadnt been testing it, I would only be getting it for the SP. But since I have, I am pretty excited overall for the whole IGE, mp and sp maps.

    But take it with a grain of salt, thats my opinion.
    Indeed, it has been a while.
    And yeah, I've read some of your posts. I'm kinda steering away from the AMaA thread because I've no doubt Ubi made a great editor, that's always been their strong suit. No sense me seeing all the potential if it also looks like it'll be short lived.

    I do hope to join you guys at some point, but so far Ubi has not sold me on this game.
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  9. #9
    Spawn camping comes down to the quality of the mapper. Exchanging deaths comes down to the quality of the player.
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  10. #10
    Fallen-Champ's Avatar Senior Member
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    Originally Posted by Negrumir Go to original post
    I've seen this mentioned a couple times, care to explain?
    I know they added some options. What exactly was missing at launch?
    When Far Cry 2 launched with user made maps you started with zero diamonds every time, the longer you stayed in the game you ranked up but you didn't keep that only playing in Ranked Mode allowed you to keep your stats.

    So they patched in an option where you could start with diamonds enough to unlock everything if you wanted.
    There were other issues I don't fully remember as it's almost 10 years ago now - unsure if one only let you keep a set number of maps then it would delete them as you downloaded more.
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