Creative Orochi Buff | Forums

[SPYSEY_NOCHOS]

Hello, Rep. 14 Orochi main here. The Orochi and PK are now the worst characters on the game but for the purposes of this thread, I will be focusing on Orochi. The Orochi playstyle no longer fits into this game with the parry changes. The Orochi is all about baiting the enemy and getting the counterattack. But you can no longer bait anyone because there is almost no reason to go for the parry. And on the off chance you do bait out a heavy, his moveset does not work well enough to counter attack effectively. I do not believe that buffing the lights to their pre-nerf state will fix anything aside from lowering the skill ceiling, but there are some other changes that would definitely benefit the Orochi playstyle. For one, the Storm Rush needs a buff and I think that it can be buffed in one of multiple ways.

Storm Rush Buff (Option A)
Add Hyper Armor and increased damage. To balance this, you could remove the free top light attacks after a successful Storm Rush. Since people have realized that parrying the storm rush will only get them a free light attack, they have started to throw out a heavy that would connect before the Orochi connects with his Storm Rush. If given this option, the Orochi would be able to get a trade that would benefit the Orochi more than the opponent. This option would be used to make the Orochi use this attack as a true counterattack much like the Riptide Strike is supposed to be used.

Storm Rush Buff (Option B)
Make the attack Unblockable, increase damage, and the soft-feint into GB window and the hard-feint window larger. Again, in order to balance this, remove the free top lights after a successful Storm Rush. These changes would pressure the opponent into either parrying or dodging. This will give the Orochi some actual mixup potential since he could GB the dodging or parrying opponent, and the hard feint could be used to parry an OOS opponent, giving him a more effective way of reaching his OOS punish (Riptide Strike while the op is on the ground). In all, this option would make the Orochi have some more mixup potential and could be used much like the warden's Shoulder Bash. Plus, it would help crack those who turtle. *COUGH* LB mains *COUGH*

Storm Rush Buff (Option C)
This Option will change the most about this move. It will act much like the Highlander's dodge attack (I forget the actual name). When you move back into your charging stance, it acts just as normal, but when you start the actual attack, you will have three options, don't move the right stick, move the right stick to the opposite side, or move it to the top. If you don't move the right stick, then you will have hyper armor, increased damage, and it will count as a combo opener. If you move the right stick to the opposite side, then the Orochi will spin to the side for an Unblockable attack. This will be slightly slower than if you were to not move the right stick and you would not get the two free lights. If you move the right stick up, then the Orochi will soft-feint into his advancing slash (I believe that's the name of it). This attack will be faster than not moving the right stick and will be undodgeable. This final Buff Option would make the Orochi use this attack as an opener and as a mix up device. Additionally, it would serve to meld together the two previous options into one iconic attack.

Now while any of these changes would vastly improve the Orochi, he would still need some additional changes to his other attacks. While Riptide strike does a great amount of damage now, it is still not very usable except on very few occasions. To further buff this attack, he would need to step back further so that moves such as the Warden top heavy do not reach him. Additionally, this attack needs to be faster and/or feintable. Just yesterday, I effectively baited a Shugoki into going for a parry on my top heavy but when I used the riptide strike to counter his attack, he had enough time to feint his incoming heavy and then parry my riptide strike. At the moment, the only uses I can find for the Riptide strike are for when an opponent is on the ground, when a highlander uses his dodge attack, and the warden's should bash.If you use it at any other time, the attack is either too slow, too telegraphed, or doesn't step far enough back.

The final thing that I feel needs to be changed are the Orochi deflects. The deflects are not bad right now except that they cannot be used against Shugoki, Berserker, or Highlander. Each of these characters have uninteruptable attacks that can be used through the deflect attack. I understand that a deflect and a parry are meant to be different which is why the deflect allows combos to continue, but what I am asking is for the Wind Gust to act like most other unblockables in the game, such as the Hurricane Blast (although to a much lesser extent). This would only work to end a combo, not to make the opponent free to extra attacks mind you, but just so that the deflect can be used against these characters. After all, The whole point of the deflect is for assassins to use that rather than parries, but in these situations, parries beat deflects everytime.

Thank you for reading this massive wall of text. If you would be so kind as to participate in the poll, that would would be great. Good luck on the battlefield!

[Duskmare]

Hmm. I would chose none of the above. His storm rush is a viable move because it has a good reward. It does its own damage but also leaves the enemy open for at least another light attack. I don't play orochi but it might even get you a heavy. I'm not sure.

The deflect not being able to work on certain attacks sounds move like a bug than a deliberate weakness.

You're right on Riptide strike. It's too easy to hit the orochi when they go for it. I would actually suggest they add invincibility frames to it, like when dodging. Making it similar to the Nobushi's hidden stance, which, if you can time it right, you can enter to dodge an enemy attack and riposte.

I think what the orochi really needs is faster side light attacks, more chaining options, an unblockable attack, melee or otherwise, and the ability to combo from his dodge attacks.

[SPYSEY_NOCHOS]

I see where you are coming from on the Storm Rush, but at the moment, you almost never hit it because it gets parried. If they want the attack to be used as a counter attack, then it needs hyper armor, to let you move further back (the highlander can hit you when you are in the stance), remove the 2 free lights, and add damage to the attack itself. While this would make it an effective way to counter attack, I don't think that this is what the developers intended for it. I feel like the counter attacking move was meant to be Riptide Strike. For this reason, I feel that it needs some kind of change to how the move works, such as adding more mixup options to the attack.

You maybe right about the deflects being a bug. If so, I really hope it gets fixed, and if not, then it needs to be changed because at this point, I'm better off just parrying.

I never even thought about how they could give the Riptide Strike Invincibility frames. That would work very well as long as it worked just like the Nobushi's Hidden Stance. The only bad thing is that it may get abused on certain occasions (such as against the Shinobi's kick).

I disagree with increasing the speed of the Orochi's side lights. As a console player, I already have to deal with Gladiator's crazy fast lights and I don't think it would be best for any other characters to work in that way. As for more chaining options, I don't think that there are any real ways to give him more efficiency unless they increased the speed of his heavies. And at the moment, I believe he can combo from dodge attacks.

[Red_R0nin]

Sorry guys, a little off topic:
I connected a Storm R against a Aramusha and i did not be rewarded with a free light (he blocked). Was it a lag problem or Aramusha is simply a legal bug? XD

[RLTygurr]

I think honestly he could be much better with an upgrade to riptide strike (Invincibility frames could be a solution, or hyper armor throughout the attack). Or, you could argue that it should be allowed to be soft feinted into a storm rush before the strike comes out.

Storm rush is pretty strong as it is, since it rewards its own damage as well as a double top light. I don't think it should be relied on so heavily since it's more of an engaging tool than a counter attacking one, which is what Orochi is supposed to be. Counter attackers aren't supposed to have multiple aggressive options, in theory. They should have maybe two or three decent ones and a load of parry or deflect options.

I think he could do with more moves out of deflect. Although they buffed the damage numbers for his current deflect moves, they aren't exactly spectacular for a counter attacker, especially when you consider characters like Aramusha or Lawbringer, who both have multiple options out of their respective defensive moves (parry, all block deflect). I think giving Orochi a wider variety of deflect moves would solidify his position as "the deflector" character. Give him moves that can both be useful in teamfights as well as in 1v1. For example, off a deflect he could have something similar to Tozen's kick which knocks someone down. However, because of recovery, the Orochi doesn't actually get anything besides two top lights for it. That move would be more useful for knocking someone off a ledge or making a target vulnerable in a teamfight.

[DemonKing1528]

to add, centurion can just burn through the deflect with a punch which is enraging when i play against him as a punch comes after literally every attack.

[DemonKing1528]

and about orochi, he cant do anything to a turtle, ive explained everything here and included a poll, please give an opinion

https://forums.ubi.com/showthread.ph...st-a-Conqueror

soon to be rep 10 orochi main needs this! XD

[SPYSEY_NOCHOS]

Sorry guys, a little off topic:
I connected a Storm R against a Aramusha and i did not be rewarded with a free light (he blocked). Was it a lag problem or Aramusha is simply a legal bug? XD

The way this attack works is that if it connects, it sends the opponent into recovery for a certain amount of time. For most characters, that recovery state ends just before your light attack. This means that if they were blocking top when you landed the storm rush, they will block the 2 lights, but if they were blocking to the side when your storm rush connected, then (for most characters) you will get the free lights. The point is, this is not a bug.

[SPYSEY_NOCHOS]

So from what I am seeing, everyone in this thread can agree on 3 things: The Riptide Strike needs a buff in some way, the Orochi needs some way to open up a turtle and the deflects need a buff. The way I see it, every move in a characters kit has to have some kind of use, and if you only buff the riptide strike, then the Storm Rush will be near useless since it would not be the best option for counterattacking. This is why I feel that the Storm Rush needs some kind of change. I would love to see it be buffed, but if necessary I think it would be best for it to be replaced by some other move entirely.

[Red_R0nin]

The way this attack works is that if it connects, it sends the opponent into recovery for a certain amount of time. For most characters, that recovery state ends just before your light attack. This means that if they were blocking top when you landed the storm rush, they will block the 2 lights, but if they were blocking to the side when your storm rush connected, then (for most characters) you will get the free lights. The point is, this is not a bug.

Thank you! Now i understand.
Yes i agree!v let's collect all of this, what you think? I wrote a post on the same topic:
https://forums.ubi.com/showthread.ph...23-Orochi-nerf