Parry got nerfed, so what? | Forums

[Morpheus256]

Parrying got nerfed to be less powerful against heavy attacks and that's great. This change should've been made ages ago. Being rewarded with an insta-kill or a guaranteed heavy (in most cases) for parrying a heavy is completely unjustified, right? So what about all other defensive tools that guarantee huge damage off heavy attacks?

Why has parrying been nerfed vs heavy attacks but deflects/deflect-like mechanics still guarantee overly high amounts of damage vs heavies? One character got a move that guarantees 30 damage off a heavy block (Conq), Kensei still gets a GB off heavies with his foward dodge > GB and most assassins have guaranteed deflect attacks that deal as much damage as other characters' heavies.

Nerfing parries vs heavy attacks was a much needed change. Leaving defensive tools that are just as powerful as parries completely untouched is something that is incomprehensible to me.

Once the parry rework goes live players can just pick heroes that still get huge damage for low-risk. Examples for such characters would be Berserker (GB off deflect), Orochi (35 damage off deflect), PK (30 damage off deflect) and Kensei ( GB off deflect). The parry changes didn't affect these charcters at all while others get considerably less damage for countering enemy heavy attacks.

This is an issue that should be addressed at some point.

Inb4 "but deflects are harder to do than parries". No, they are not. They are just as easy/safely to do as parries if performed against heavies.

[S0Mi_xD]

You answered it yourself with the point you deny - Deflects are harder and more risky.

[David_gorda]

Yeah i think deflects needs nerfs to, assassin are already the best classes so nerf to parries but not deflect buffs the best classes even more.

[PDXGorechild]

Yeah it’s justified due to being more risky. The thing about parry is that someone skilled could use almost any class and use the same turtle and parry > gb tactic to win, making everything a bit monotone I think. Deflects are unique to certain classes, mostly ones with lower health pools who risk dodging into a heavy.

[PINKmattconnor]

in my honoest opinion, assassin shouldn't have the parry sys in his kit. they have the deflect and all heroes (except for ororchi and berseker 1.0), have many offensive kit.
They are fast, they do a lot of dmg,they have fast good dodge used, for take distance in OOS situations.
So,in the end, if they just give the ability to defelect Unblokcables, they no need parry abilities anymore XD

[Vrbas1]

Deflect window is tighter and less consistent than parry window. The risk is eating huge damage from a heavy. Deflects are infinitely less common than parries so the way I see it there's not "a problem". Not to mention nearly all characters (and after patch ALL) require user input following a deflect. Even then the damage isn't guaranteed depending on the match up (glad skewer vs shugoki hyper armor, anyone vs orochi - just dodge, etc).

[S0Mi_xD]

in my honoest opinion, assassin shouldn't have the parry sys in his kit. they have the deflect and all heroes (except for ororchi and berseker 1.0), have many offensive kit.
They are fast, they do a lot of dmg,they have fast good dodge used, for take distance in OOS situations.
So,in the end, if they just give the ability to defelect Unblokcables, they no need parry abilities anymore XD

Taking away parry from Assassins would be really stupid.
Parry is a core mechanic, especially for 4v4 modes - without parry your chance to survive a gank as an assassin is practiacally Zero...
Deflect isn't as easy to use as Parry in a fight situation - it is MUCH more dangerous - one deflect bait and you can't do anything against it = free GB for the enemy.
Against a parry bait you can feint the parry attempt ... on a deflect there is no turning back.

[Vakris_One]

Parrying got nerfed to be less powerful against heavy attacks and that's great. This change should've been made ages ago. Being rewarded with an insta-kill or a guaranteed heavy (in most cases) for parrying a heavy is completely unjustified, right? So what about all other defensive tools that guarantee huge damage off heavy attacks?

Why has parrying been nerfed vs heavy attacks but deflects/deflect-like mechanics still guarantee overly high amounts of damage vs heavies? One character got a move that guarantees 30 damage off a heavy block (Conq), Kensei still gets a GB off heavies with his foward dodge > GB and most assassins have guaranteed deflect attacks that deal as much damage as other characters' heavies.

Nerfing parries vs heavy attacks was a much needed change. Leaving defensive tools that are just as powerful as parries completely untouched is something that is incomprehensible to me.

Once the parry rework goes live players can just pick heroes that still get huge damage for low-risk. Examples for such characters would be Berserker (GB off deflect), Orochi (35 damage off deflect), PK (30 damage off deflect) and Kensei ( GB off deflect). The parry changes didn't affect these charcters at all while others get considerably less damage for countering enemy heavy attacks.

This is an issue that should be addressed at some point.

Inb4 "but deflects are harder to do than parries". No, they are not. They are just as easy/safely to do as parries if performed against heavies.

Deflects and the Kensei's superior block into forward dash GB are both riskier and harder to pull off than a parry. The timing to initiate one properly is slightly tighter than for a parry and most importantly you cannot feint out of a deflect/superior block dash attempt whereas you can cancel your parry attempt when you see it was a bait. Dashing for a deflect that was then feinted leaves you exposed to a free GB or hit ergo it is much riskier than a parry attempt.

[Knight_Raime]

The difficulty of something is always subjective and never really something that should be a cornerstone of an argument.
What is factual is superior blocked GB's (sans conqs from neutral pre rework) and deflects are inherently riskier than a parry.

You can easily feint your failed parry attempt and block/react to most of the opponents responses.
You can't make your dodge for an attempted deflect and falling for a heavy feint opens you to a free GB.
Same goes with superior block dodges.

Also I absolutely do not agree that it's easier/safer to attempt to deflect heavies. as heavies can be feinted. and heavy timings vary a LOT more than light attacks.
Light attacks also do less damage and most people in the cast can't feint/cancel a light. So I would argue it's actually safer/less punishing to attempt a deflect on a light than a parry.

[Knight_Raime]

Yeah i think deflects needs nerfs to, assassin are already the best classes so nerf to parries but not deflect buffs the best classes even more.

Oh yeah good idea. lets nerf an inherently risky move to further discourage it's use. Good idea.

in my honoest opinion, assassin shouldn't have the parry sys in his kit. they have the deflect and all heroes (except for ororchi and berseker 1.0), have many offensive kit.
They are fast, they do a lot of dmg,they have fast good dodge used, for take distance in OOS situations.
So,in the end, if they just give the ability to defelect Unblokcables, they no need parry abilities anymore XD

"they are fast..." if this is a reference to light attacks than no. Nearly every hero in the game has a 500ms light attack.
"they do a lot of damage.." So lets forget about shugoki's ability to OHK someone. Lets forget about centurions cutscene combo. lets forget about raiders max punish. etc.
"they have fast good dodge" pk and shaman are the only ones with 500ms dodges. other assassins have pretty much the same dodge recovery as most other heros in the game. there are only a few who have 700ms dodge recoveries. The back dodge is the only good dodge assassins have over most heros. and we all agree back dodging is insane and needs fixing.