For Honor's proper Reward System - Discussion & Suggestion | Forums

[bob333e]

I think we can all agree we're being bottlenecked and not rewarded proper Steel and XP for our gameplay, let alone rewarded properly for individual performance in matches. Everything is over-inflated and more often than not, you feel at a great loss when you skip/miss orders. Especially given that they keep adding new content, while not altering/improving Steel gain at all.
The following is a compiled suggestive list that covers every gameplay aspect of For Honor (I think) and how it should be re-addressed from a fresh perspective; one that favors the player, and rewards individual gameplay. Most of these changes address proper Steel gain for every aspect, more fair Steel expenditures across the board, and better XP rewards where they make sense.

- Reputation leveling: We should get 1,000 Steel for each new reputation level gained. Outside of random colors, engravings and patterns (half of which are downright depressingly wrong-looking), this is the best incentive to encourage a player to level up more and more, and this cements a clear leveling goal in the player's mind. Sure, I want an outfit at rep30 for its patterns and symbols, but that's rep30. It's still far off. Give me rewards that I deserve in the meantime, simply for just playing and enjoying the game with the heroes I like using the most.

- Dominion & Skirmish: In PvP Dominion and Skirmish, Steel gain should match how much renown you've stacked. Say, you've stacked 650 renown, you'll get 650 Steel. You've stacked 1123 renown, you get 1123 Steel. This is fair and it adequately rewards the player based on personal performance. Regardless of match outcome. In PvAI you should initially be able to choose bot difficulty in PvAI when matchmaking is off. 'Casual' or 'Hardcore', with Casual setting you up with level 1 and level 2 bots, and rewarding Steel gain at half the renown gained, whereas 'Hardcore' matching you strictly with level 3 bots, and Steel gain is same as PvP, matching renown gain.

-- EDIT -- : I've been told through feedback that renown = Steel gain is a bit too much. I will dedicate more thought on how renown plays a role in end-match reward for both Dominion and Skirmish.

UPDATE ON DOMINION

For PvP Dominion, I came up with an improved suggestion concerning how you should earn Steel and XP:

The amount of objectives/captures you register count towards 50% of the added end-match XP gain, with a 33x multiplier. Half of the amount of total renown you accumulate will form the other 50%, with a 3x multiplier.

The total amount of takedowns you register count towards 50% of the Steel gain end-match, with a 25x multiplier. Half of the amount of total renown you accumulate will form the other 50%, without multipliers.

This goes as following:

- For XP: If you did 8 captures and have accumulated 600 renown, that will be 264XP on the captures (8 x 33), and 900XP on half the renown (300 x 3), netting you 1164XP end-match.

- For Steel: if you did 9 registered takedowns and have accumulated 600 renown, that will be 225 Steel on the takedowns (9 x 25), and 300 Steel on half the renown, netting you 525 Steel end-match.

For PvAI Dominion, it retains the same values as PvP Dominion if you choose 'Hardcore' when matchmaking is off (strictly level 3 bots), and it halves the values of PvP Dominion if you choose 'Casual' when matchmaking is off (level 1 and level 2 bots).

UPDATE ON SKIRMISH

For PvP Skirmish, the calculation is rather simpler than that of Dominion, and takes a bit of a different route. If your team won the round, you receive in Steel half the amount of renown you've stacked, and you receive in Salvage the same amount of renown you've stacked. If your team lost the round, you receive in Steel the amount of renown divided by 2.5, and you receive in Salvage half the amount of renown you've stacked. The same amount of XP gain calculation is retained as-is in the current ongoing system. This goes as the following:

- If your team won and you accumulated 650 renown: You get 325 Steel (650/2) and 650 Salvage.
- If your team lost and you accumulated 650 renown: You get 260 Steel (650/2.5) and 325 Salvage (650/2).
- Whether your team won or lost: Same XP gain as the current ongoing system.

For PvAI Skirmish with matchmaking set to off, it halves the values as PvP Skirmish for Steel and Salvage if you choose 'Hardcore' (strictly level 3 bots) and your team won the match, and it divides those values by 3 if you choose 'Casual' when matchmaking is off (level 1 and level 2 bots) and your team won. Upon choosing 'Hardcore' and your team lost, it divides the values of PvP Skirmish by 3. Upon choosing 'Casual' and your team lost, it divides the values of PvP Skirmish by 4. This goes as the following:

- Hardcore setting, your team won and you accumulated 650 renown: You get 325 (650/2) Steel and 325 (650/2) Salvage.
- Hardcore setting, your team lost and you accumulated 650 renown: You get 216 (650/3) Steel and 216 (650/3) Salvage.
- Casual setting, your team won and you accumulated 650 renown: You get 216 (650/3) Steel and 216 (650/3) Salvage..
- Casual setting, your team lost and you accumulated 650 renown: You get 162 (650/4) Steel and 162 (650/4) Salvage.
- Any setting, whether your team won or lost: Same XP gain as the current ongoing system.

What this does is specialize Skirmish as an ideal mode where you can farm Salvage, should you need a bigger Salvage pool, while still not bottlenecking your Steel gain, and adequately rewarding you for your personal performance. This also complements the newly added XP Boost mechanic as of Season 5. Should you need to purchase a lot of XP Boosts with Salvage, you're gonna need to farm Salvage for that. It's only logical, and reasonable, to have a mode where you can farm Salvage while XP gain remains somewhat sub-par, but in exchange you can buy XP Boosts with the accumulated Salvage, should you not need to upgrade or Change Look a lot of times.

- Duels, Brawls, & Eliminations: For Duels, Steel gain should be like 100ish if you won, and half of that if you lost, for both PvP and PvAI. For Brawls it should be 1.2x the amount of Steel gained in Duels, full amount if your team won, half if your team lost. For Eliminations it should be 1.5x the amount of Steel gained in won Duels (that's 200ish Steel) regardless of match outcome.

- Dance of Death: Dance of Death Brawls should reward Steel based on the number of registered takedowns (both 1v1s and kill assists) per match. 50 Steel per takedown. Executions do not increase Steel gain.

- Tribute: For Tribute, it should be based on how much teamwork you've done. Calculating renown, takedowns, claims, and blocks all at once. Each having a percentage in the calculation.

- Community event orders: They should happen once a month and be hard enough to span a week, and reward 5,000 Steel if the target is reached.

- Double XP weekends: They should happen at every new season release (meaning it should happen on Feb 16th with the coming of S5), and during every special event (like the Frost Wind Festival and Halloween), and should happen on the official launch of the dedicated servers.

- Season rewards: First place 20,000 Steel, second place 10,000 Steel, third place 5,000 Steel. A season is 4 months long. We can 'farm' 20,000 Steel in like 3.5 weeks. I don't see why we shouldn't be rewarded 20,000 Steel for winning 1st place after 4 months of constant banner-planting and troop-deploying. Season rewards should also include 'special' crates that can only be obtained if you place 1st or 2nd, with 1st place netting you 3 special crates, and 2nd place netting you one. These special crates reward XP on whichever character you choose. Like, one special crate holds 2,500XP.

- Faction Loyalty Bonus. Throughout a season, if you remained true to your Faction and never switched, you get added bonuses when the season ends, after 4 months. 10,000 Steel, two special crates, and 5,000 Salvage. This reward stacks with the season rewards if your Faction won 1st, 2nd, or 3rd place. You also get a troop deployment boost for the first campaign of the next season.

- Scavenger crates: They should include some Steel and some Salvage, along with the loot, when you open them. Range of 25-200 Steel and range of 100-500 Salvage, depending on character tier.
Common Tier: 25 Steel, 100 Salvage
Rare Tier: 50 Steel, 200 Salvage
Heroic Tier: 100 Steel, 300 Salvage
Epic Tier: 150 Steel, 400 Salvage
Legendary Tier: 200 Steel, 500 Salvage

- Change Look: Should cost between 10 and 50 Steel depending on gear tier, and between 150 and 1000 Salvage depending on gear tier.
Common Tier: 10 Steel, 150 Salvage
Rare Tier: 20 Steel, 250 Salvage
Heroic Tier: 30 Steel, 500 Salvage
Epic Tier: 40 Steel, 750 Salvage
Legendary Tier: 50 Steel, 1000 Salvage

- Gear upgrades: Should cost between 50 and 250 Steel per level depending on gear tier, and between 100 and 500 Salvage per level depending on gear tier.
Common Tier: 50 Steel and 100 Salvage per level
Rare Tier: 100 Steel and 200 Salvage per level
Heroic Tier: 150 Steel and 300 Salvage per level
Epic Tier: 200 Steel and 400 Salvage per level
Legendary Tier: 250 Steel and 500 Salvage per level

- Star weapons: Weapon pieces that have a star icon (extremely rare) cost a bit more Steel and Salvage to upgrade, but Change Look cost remains constant.

- Refine Gear: The new 'Refine Gear' option coming in S5 should cost 750 Steel and 750 Salvage on armor pieces, and 1,000 Steel and 1,000 Salvage on weapon pieces. Refinement nets a +1% boost across the board on any positive stat, and a +3% improvement on any negative stat. If you wield a fully refined weapon (3 pieces), you may equip a weapon effect. If you wear fully refined armor (3 pieces), you may choose a faint, non-intrusive 'aura' which remains active even during movement and combat. This aura follows the same pattern as whichever effect you have equipped under "idle". This aura also can be augmented based on your rank (Bronze, Silver, Gold, Platinum, Diamond).

- Ranked Duel Tournament: Steel gain per each match is same as normal duels (listed above). 1st place nets you an additional 3,000 Steel. 2nd place nets you an additional 1,500 Steel.

- Ranked Tribute: I don't know yet. It's still a failed concept as-is. But it should certainly reward more than normal Tribute.

- Emotes, Executions, & Effects: All emotes should be locked at 5,000 Steel each, all executions at 7,000 Steel each, and all effects at 5,000 Steel each.

- Mythic & Mask Outfits: Considering all of the above, Mythic Outfits are 20,000 Steel each, and Mask Outfits are 30,000 Steel each. To retain their sense of importance and rarity, and not be that easily farmed for. Mask Outfits get discounted at 20,000 Steel for a brief period during respective special events. Mythic Outfits get discounted at 15,000 Steel at Ubisoft's discretion, whenever they decide to discount Mythic Outfits, like they did in the Dance of Death event.

- DLC Cast: Considering all the above changes, DLC heroes are 30,000 Steel each, if you don't own the Season Pass. They should remain somewhat pricey. Season Pass is another matter and is (and should be) the company's right to ask for more $, outside of the game's full retail price. And there is no single hero/item/outfit/thing worth more than 30,000 Steel in the entire game.

Now that, is a reward system that I, and I'm sure most of the playerbase, would be happy with, without the devs having to overhaul the entire framework around which For Honor has been built (F2P MMO bottleneck model dominated by RNG and infested with microtransactions, where they keep adding more content that costs Steel while not modifying Steel gain at all).

Would love to hear feedback and thoughts. And thanks for reading.

[Alustar.exe]

I really don't think we are bottle necked that badly. The problem is that most players who don't venture out to learn new heroes to effectively compete all orders are never going to get the gains. Top help give an example, I play almost exclusively assassin characters. I have the season pass so I didn't have to worry about characters and could focus on pretty outfits. I barely collect steel in excess of 10k unless I'm specifically working for it.
My close friend however plays all class types and is very rarely without uncompleted orders. About a week ago he purchased shaman to learn her move set, about two days ago he had 14k and some change and decided up but an outfit for berserker at 7k without batting an eye because he knew he would have that back in less than a week.

I really don't think we need rewards for anything outside of match performance. I wouldn't mind the from match gains being increased to help nudge up the players who don't dip into every class, but outside that I think the rewards we get from orders are enough.
Maybe add more diverse options, other than the standard ones we have.

[bob333e]

I really don't think we are bottle necked that badly. The problem is that most players who don't venture out to learn new heroes to effectively compete all orders are never going to get the gains. Top help give an example, I play almost exclusively assassin characters. I have the season pass so I didn't have to worry about characters and could focus on pretty outfits. I barely collect steel in excess of 10k unless I'm specifically working for it.
My close friend however plays all class types and is very rarely without uncompleted orders. About a week ago he purchased shaman to learn her move set, about two days ago he had 14k and some change and decided up but an outfit for berserker at 7k without batting an eye because he knew he would have that back in less than a week.

I really don't think we need rewards for anything outside of match performance. I wouldn't mind the from match gains being increased to help nudge up the players who don't dip into every class, but outside that I think the rewards we get from orders are enough.
Maybe add more diverse options, other than the standard ones we have.

Thank you for your input.

I play daily for like 3 hours and never miss a single order, I play any hero I have to, to complete all orders (except the one that requires co-op, which I cannot, as I play solo). I don't care which hero I must play so long as I earn all the Steel gain from all the orders combined.

Even then, I barely save up 9K-10K a week, that's if I never did any Change Look or gear upgrade. And considering the influx of weekly content, you're pretty much set for something new every week. If you have a backlog checklist to clear, such as mine (I started For Honor early November, so you can guess how much stuff I have on my checklist), then all the additional weekly and seasonal content become a drag and an added unfair grind just so you can catch up with the newest released stuff.

It doesn't stop there. As you learn more than one hero, and want to diversify and rep up several heroes, you'd naturally want to take care of their looks and gear. Keep in mind my aforementioned checklist is solely for my main (Warden), I haven't been buying anything for any other hero, save for an ornament for Valkyrie because it looked better than the default horns. And so far I've spent somewhere around 80K Steel ever since I started playing, 98% of it being just on Warden, between outfits, ornaments, effects, executions, emotes, Change Look, and gear upgrades.

80K of daily grinding for 3 months in a row now, and I'm not even done with one hero. How is this fair? of course not looking to buy everything, many of his stuff suck anyway and are downright ugly, I'm just acquiring the best there is. I still have a few effects, two Mythic Outfits, and the Tundra Gryphon Outfit. That's around 65K left to clear.

I know 10 bucks sounds like a snack's value if I ever decide to throw 10 bucks at buying some Steel to help myself out, but I despise and boycott microtransactions with a deep, intense hatred. It makes no sense at all that I have to grind daily for 3 months, and also throw 10-20 additional bucks, to finally unlock the stuff I desire on one hero (keep in mind I'm customizing all three loadouts, each having different effects and outfits). Should I miss one order, that's at least 800 wasted Steel and 500-750 wasted XP, which is the equivalent of 10 hours straight of gameplay (!!!!!!)

I also never was able to afford a Champion Status. I only have Champion Status from compensations and Open Test rewards. I have a checklist to clear, can't afford to throw Steel on Champion Status.

This system downright sucks and we deserve a lot more than this. There is no player progression at all. It's a forced grinding and you're severely punished when you miss orders because of irl circumstances.

[BlowHard74728]

I really do like these ideas especially the dominion mode one. Playing a 20 min match for 50 steel is rather ridiculous. 40 min of game and you get 100 steal in all yeah no i dont agree with this. Unfortunately i dont think anything will be done with this. They probably make too much money with people buying steel to actually raise rewards. I also like the idea of the faction war steel rewards but instead would say maybe 15,000 for 1st and 5,000 for 2nd and maybe 0 for 3rd that way its more of an encouragement to drop some troops and participate in the war. But like i said i love the more end match reward ideas so far the rewards are kind of meaningless

[ChampionRuby50g]

You’re right Fady. We are deserving of a more fair treatment in terms of steel and XP gain. I personally really like your list, but I also think that for Dominion and Skirmish your renown should not be the Steel you earn. It isn’t fair on the new players and players who are less than average who will now be inherently earning less steel than everyone else just because they aren’t good or experienced players. Knowing how little steel you are getting compared to the rest of your team will surely leave a sour taste in their mouths. In saying that, I do think that renown from in game should contribute in someway to your end of game steel rewards. Playing well does deserve better rewards, but not to the extent where you get 1000 steel a game.

[BlowHard74728]

You’re right Fady. We are deserving of a more fair treatment in terms of steel and XP gain. I personally really like your list, but I also think that for Dominion and Skirmish your renown should not be the Steel you earn. It isn’t fair on the new players and players who are less than average who will now be inherently earning less steel than everyone else just because they aren’t good or experienced players. Knowing how little steel you are getting compared to the rest of your team will surely leave a sour taste in their mouths. In saying that, I do think that renown from in game should contribute in someway to your end of game steel rewards. Playing well does deserve better rewards, but not to the extent where you get 1000 steel a game.

True about them getting less then the rest of the team would suck but itd be a hell of a lot better then just 50 steel. But if not the amount of renown being transformed to steel then something else could hopefully be done.
Maybe 500 if you win and 150-100 if your team lost

[bob333e]

I really do like these ideas especially the dominion mode one.

Hey, thanks for hopping in!

Playing a 20 min match for 50 steel is rather ridiculous. 40 min of game and you get 100 steal in all yeah no i dont agree with this. Unfortunately i dont think anything will be done with this. They probably make too much money with people buying steel to actually raise rewards.

I know. And this thread will likely go ignored by the representatives. Just like my dedicated servers launch Steel giveaway thread got ignored, in Suggestions & Feedback. Still, it's worth to take it off my chest and see whether others share the same stand as mine concerning this issue.

I also like the idea of the faction war steel rewards but instead would say maybe 15,000 for 1st and 5,000 for 2nd and maybe 0 for 3rd that way its more of an encouragement to drop some troops and participate in the war.

Well a season is 4 months long. Throughout 4 months, you can farm hella on your own, without even the existence of Faction War. What's the point of Faction War? if it doesn't give us really nice and shiny rewards just for participating in it, why even participate in it, what's the incentive? As it is, the rewards are a joke, and Factions get mixed up in matches, instead of matching Faction members with each other, against other Factions, like the Faction War should be. Faction War is completely detached from your gameplay, save for when you complete a match, earn some troops, and deploy them somewhere. Giving rewards for each position is bound to encourage participation on a wide spectrum, instead of "oh Vikings are gonna win this one, no point deploying more troops, my Faction won't make it 1st place anyway".

You’re right Fady. We are deserving of a more fair treatment in terms of steel and XP gain. I personally really like your list, but I also think that for Dominion and Skirmish your renown should not be the Steel you earn. It isn’t fair on the new players and players who are less than average who will now be inherently earning less steel than everyone else just because they aren’t good or experienced players. Knowing how little steel you are getting compared to the rest of your team will surely leave a sour taste in their mouths. In saying that, I do think that renown from in game should contribute in someway to your end of game steel rewards. Playing well does deserve better rewards, but not to the extent where you get 1000 steel a game.

Thanks for your feedback! you have a point, but this is the matchmaker's problem, not ours. The matchmaker shouldn't match low-level players against veterans. This would cause all sorts of problems, not just in terms of end-match rewards. I also thought, since renown = Steel gain, it would encourage everyone to actively participate in everything in a given Dominion / Skirmish (zones, takedowns, revives, assists, executions, honorable kills...) instead of people camping at safety, or people attempting AFK for free XP and Steel, etc. I just thought it would hit 2 birds in 1 cage.

If someone got 490 renown and his teammate got like 540 renown, it's not a big difference by any means. The real gaps would be if someone got like 200 renown and his teammate got like 970 renown, but again, maybe the 970 guy is just a much better player, and he should be rewarded accordingly. Also, constantly hitting 1000 renown on each Dominion and Skirmish is hard af. For me anyway. I imagine most good players stay in the 500-750 range on average. 1000+ is hard.

[BlowHard74728]

I believe one of there biggest problems with people participating more often with the faction war is lack of incentive and steel rewards could truly push up the percentage of players that are going to compete in the faction war. And i agree it would push people to fight the war to the end instead of just handing the champion title over to the lead faction.

[bob333e]

Yup. exactly my thoughts. Everyone's a 'winner', there are no penalties. You only need to participate. Faction War isn't even the core gameplay of For Honor, so at the very least it should be a pleasant experience all around, not a chore, not a punishment, not a grind. And for the excuse to span 4 months per season, it should compensate people for keeping them engaged for 4 entire months, deploying troops and whatnot.

[Aidames]

Yup. exactly my thoughts. Everyone's a 'winner', there are no penalties. You only need to participate. Faction War isn't even the core gameplay of For Honor, so at the very least it should be a pleasant experience all around, not a chore, not a punishment, not a grind.

While I do agree that increased Steel rewards would be most welcome and most of what you suggest makes perfect sense, I do not understand this last post. In what way is Faction War a "punishment"? There really are no losers, everybody gets rewards. Even if you don't look at the war map all season long, you'll still get some extra Steel. The only point where this is problematic is where the "ignorant" player gets just as much Steel as the one who faithfully deployed troops for 4 months. That definitely should change, but that's not a punishment, it's simply a lack of a merit-based reward system.

As a side-thought, I really think they should give us a separate window where we can deploy the Troops we've collected so far. There are so many things crammed into that 30 second in-between-matches window that it's really frustrating, at least for me. I have 30 seconds to:
- Look through my loot/earned colors/symbols, see if there's anything that's better (I also like to look at the "XP up" animations, but that's just me)
- Deploy troops in a way that's meaningful
- Vote for the new map
- Ready up

I never vote for a map because I never have time. Oftentimes I hastily deploy my troops just so they wouldn't be auto-distributed. Really, I think we should just have a separate screen on the actual war map (outside of queues) where you can deploy all the Troops you have collected during your login session.

But I heavily digress, I apologize.