1. #21
    The whole tomb thing: I would like to think that would get explained through some way as being Aya takes on a protťgť or has a daughter. A shrine is built dedicated to Aya (as Amunet), but, whether in death or retirement, she returns to Bayek to be buried along side her husband. Meanwhile, her protťgť takes on the Amunet persona; and it is her that gets placed in the tomb instead.

    To the part about motivations of becoming an Assassin for our protagonist. We have had an Assassin turn Templar (Both protagonist and Side: Shay, Vali, Duncan, Lucy, Daniel). Another possibility is a Templar turning Assassin. There are other possibilities, besides revenge too; Birth, Higher Calling (Think, Connor's message from Juno; I've always thought Connor's "reason" was misunderstood because of just this; a God/Spirit told him to protect the land his people protected, that's what made him seek out the Assassins), duty (as in; someone not actually being overly aware at why they are doing what they are doing; a soldier following orders), an anti-hero; someone actually doing it for power or a position of power.

    I would argue Ptolemy didn't need much screen time. He was literally a puppet, Bayek knew this from the very start; he was the clueless face behind which the real powers hid.

    Shadiya really was a great arc; it really knocked me for 6 when she died.

    I agree about the Ancients. Most of them were very, lacklustre and very forgettable. They should have been built up better. Personally I think the story should have started before Khemut died. Have the first scene be Aya and Bayek; closely followed by Khemut... at HOME; build them up; introduce Hepzefa AND Rada. Have opening missions including teaching Khemut how to hunt, and Bayek doing his job as Medjay. While doing these very Ezio/Connor opening missions have him notice members of the Ancients strolling around Siwa looking shady (they would be investigating the Vault and how to open it). Bayek would have to investigate these shady strangers, because he is Medjay. and go from there. I probably wouldn't have the Ancients being responsible for Khemut's death either. While Bayek is sneaking around working out who these people are (also a better way to introduce them too; see some of their personality (Like with how we kept seeing The Spaniard or Torres), he doesn't meet Khemut for some mission (how to track a predator or whatever); while waiting for Bayek, Khemut is killed by whatever means.Its Bayek not being there, because he is too busy being Medjay and not father, that causes Khemut's death. WHICH better explains the supposed distance between Aya and Bayek; and eventually why she forsakes Bayek and her name.

    I also couldn't help but feel... Where was all of Brutus' meetings, and armour that he did (according to the scrolls) before killing Caesar, Brutus and Longinus felt very shoehorned (Side not: "RIP Caesar" was a beautiful call back to Cesare).

    I thought the story was decent: but wasn't gut wrenching or as satisfying as others. But side stories were the best since Black Flag IMO.

    Going forward; I'd be surprised if the next game wasn't with Amunet as the lead during the Second Triumvirate up to the forming of the Roman Empire.
    Share this post

  2. #22
    Joshua0892's Avatar Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Posts
    1,136
    Well to be honest when I heard Bayeks backstory of being a Medjay I was already pumped damn Egypte could use a damn police officer murdering all those criminals could be good for that country I see that as a good enough reason it was not like the goverment would change anything really... Still not happy with the revenge though -_-
    Share this post

  3. #23
    LoyalACFan's Avatar Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    8,481
    Originally Posted by SixKeys Go to original post
    What else would you suggest as a strong enough impetus for someone to start killing people if not revenge for someone's death? I get that the revenge trope is a tired one, but there are few other options that would drive someone into becoming a murderer "for the greater good". The only other option really is being brainwashed into the assassin cult from a young age and we did that with AltaÔr and arguably the Fry twins. The assassin lifestyle pretty much guarantees there will always be casualties in one's family.

    Unlike superhero stories where just getting awesome powers is enough reason to turn into a vigilante, the assassins' "superpower" is killing people. It's understandable for Superman to want to use his powers even without a dead family member to avenge, because Superman doesn't kill. His powers are being able to fly and being really strong. Pretty harmless stuff.
    An assassin's superpower is murdering people they disagree with. He/she needs a relatable reason to use his/her "power", otherwise it's hard for the audience to sympathize with them. Like it or not, revenge is one of the only motivators strong enough to excuse a murderous spree without losing audience sympathy.
    Fair points, but I think that's also a bit of a cop-out. IMO audiences are actually pretty damn forgiving of onscreen violence, especially in video games. I hate to use yet another Witcher comparison, but once again, it's appropriate; Geralt kills people just because he's in a rough line of work and the world of the Witcher is a pretty unforgiving place. That could have been motivation enough for Bayek, too; he's in a rough line of work and Egypt is a pretty unforgiving place. It actually works even better for Bayek, since he would have a vested interest as a Medjay in taking down a mysterious bunch of criminals like the Order. Granted, Geralt's ultimate end goal (finding Ciri) is personal rather than professional, but it isn't in any way a vengeance quest. The "end goal" for Bayek could have just been figuring out who the head of the Order was, and if it had been played right, that would have been enough for the player, too.

    Actually, an even better example is Horizon: Zero Dawn, where the central driving force of the plot is solving a big mystery about Aloy's past. Even though I wasn't a fan of the game, I was really drawn in by the breadcrumb trail of clues in the main story, and pleasantly surprised with most of the twists and turns concerning the Zero Dawn project. Contrast that with the hokey, tacked-on vengeance plot that was coupled with that excellent mystery. It sucked to see some of those characters die, but hunting down their killer wasn't enough to sustain a 30-hour story.

    So, basically, if the mystery angle of the Order of the Ancients had been emphasized rather than the cliche revenge plot, I might have liked the story much better. But, if I'm being brutally honest, none of the characters in this game were well-written enough for me to become invested in them anyway.
     1 people found this helpful
    Share this post

  4. #24
    Funny, because Origins actually DOES have a good and well written story and is one of the best games in the series. The story isnít bad nor disappointing and it does work. I also shake my head at the logic of those who somehow think the modern day stuff is bad when itís not. People who think the series should be purely historical really shouldnít. They donít have the series best interest at heart. The new character Layla is interesting, well written, and I like that they are planning to use her for future games like they did Desmond. The modern day stuff is an interesting story and itís effective in Origins.
    Share this post

  5. #25
    Originally Posted by SixKeys Go to original post

    As for the "dead child" trope, I believe it was a deliberate choice to have that theme repeat throughout Bayek's journey and not for arbitrary reasons as you suggest. All the people who had lost children dealt with their loss in different ways and Bayek took away different lessons from them. The Hyena was perhaps closest to Bayek in that she was ready to go to extremes to avenge her child, but her anger was all-consuming and made her sacrifice innocents to get her revenge. Shadya's death showed her mother and father dealing with their grief in different ways, parallelling Bayek and Aya. The father withdrew into depression and distanced himself from his wife, while the mother used her grief as motivation to fight for justice. In the end Bayek had to bring them together through their shared loss (if he was just a stranger who had never lost a child, he wouldn't have been able to relate so well) and the realization that they could turn their loss into strength. I actually found it one of the stronger aspects of the writing that Bayek came into contact with children many times - dead or living - and that there were several characters connected by the loss of a child. The repeated throwbacks elevated loss and grief into an actual story theme, instead of a superficial one-off event that throws the plot in motion but never comes into play afterwards (like Ezio's family or Connor's mother, arguably).
    I mean, that's great that you see the intricacies of this theme. As my earlier post said, I also believe that the concept behind the story is solid. But sadly these themes and meaning behind child loss were not presented in the game with adequate finesse to convey the depth that you just described. The Hyena, for example, is to me such a wasted potential. The shared experience between her and Bayek could lead to great discussions about to what extent does revenge go. She may tempt Bayek with resurrecting Khemu via first civilization magic, thus setting Bayek up for a painful moral triumph. But instead, we got one brief dialogue between them where they basically just state their different opinions, then a boss fight, the end. Shadya's line was done better, and both of her parents got some good screen time and good lines, I agree. But that is not the norm throughout the game. I want to believe that the child loss theme was deliberately included to resonate with Bayek and draw out deeper reflections, but when some potentially great encounters are rushed over, it is difficult to remain optimistic about why such a theme is repeated.
     2 people found this helpful
    Share this post

  6. #26
    Joshua0892's Avatar Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Posts
    1,136
    Originally Posted by seekerslegacy Go to original post
    Funny, because Origins actually DOES have a good and well written story and is one of the best games in the series. The story isn’t bad nor disappointing and it does work. I also shake my head at the logic of those who somehow think the modern day stuff is bad when it’s not. People who think the series should be purely historical really shouldn’t. They don’t have the series best interest at heart. The new character Layla is interesting, well written, and I like that they are planning to use her for future games like they did Desmond. The modern day stuff is an interesting story and it’s effective in Origins.
    ultimate ****head comment incoming (because I am selfaware).

    Sorry sweety the critical people are talking
    But also second note WHAT story in the MD? no really what story?
     1 people found this helpful
    Share this post

  7. #27
    Sooxzay's Avatar Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Location
    Germany
    Posts
    395
    I mainly agree on the story and MD parts since I felt almost the same!

    They can make a good looking open world full of life. Now please work on the story telling!
    Share this post

  8. #28
    Joshua0892's Avatar Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Posts
    1,136
    You know guys we still have a change to fix the mistakes if Bayek get's a sequel I really hope the leaks are true that he has a trilogy so we can expand more on the hole Origins and give Layla actual character development and story so she has something to do, if I had to fix one thing now is the hole Time Travel aspect in the Isu messages in the open world need to be incorporated into the main story and in Bayeks story to.
    This hole Time Travel aspect is so big that it can't be put on the sideline now without screwing with the established lore.
    Share this post

  9. #29
    Originally Posted by Kiroku Go to original post
    I mainly agree on the story and MD parts since I felt almost the same!

    They can make a good looking open world full of life. Now please work on the story telling!
    That's exactly my thought. Ubisoft is the leader in the industry in term of world building and action system. If only they can tell good stories and write complex characters, they would have the power to make some of the best games the world has ever seen.
    Share this post

  10. #30
    Sooxzay's Avatar Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Location
    Germany
    Posts
    395
    Originally Posted by kissybyc Go to original post
    That's exactly my thought. Ubisoft is the leader in the industry in term of world building and action system. If only they can tell good stories and write complex characters, they would have the power to make some of the best games the world has ever seen.
    You totally got me! The fun fact about that is that they COULD write good stories with much complexity even for characters.

    But I dont know why they dont go for it. Maybe still because its a triple A title from a company which has high ranked people that just want to see the money at the end of the year. Who knows..
    Share this post