counter guard break has little to no reward | Forums

[Camemberto]

I had this happen yesterday when fighting a Valk with my Orochi.

I am actually pretty bad at counter guard breaking and she spammed it all the time, so it was a good practice match for me. There were a lot of things I discovered from that match, that I would like to have some confirmation on.

Counter guard breaking has little to no reward.
A couple of things that happened:

She gb's, I cgb, I immediately dodge backwards, get caught by the next gb.
She gb's, I cgb, I do a light attack, get hit by her attack before mine connects.
She gb's, I cgb, I do a heavy attack, get caught by her gb.

It seems like counter guard breaking is pretty useless right now, other than not being hit in the face with a chair.

For how hard the guard break is to counter on the console, I feel like there is no reward for successfully doing so.
I am not saying it should have more rewards, like guarantied damage, but it should be easier to pull of and leave you with some kind of an advantage other than being back to neutral at best.

Also I dislike guaranteed guard breaks for they just generally slow down the pace of any fight, like STOP . . . HAMMERTIME! (top heavy)

[Camemberto]

I just read up on this topic. I found that at one point you had it changed to where you would have to cgb right as the gb connected instead of right when it started, but you changed it back to how it was in the beta? why?
Parrying requires exact timing, why shouldn't cgb'ing?
Super fast reaction times is just not a thing on consoles, be it for the 30fps framerate or input lag due to the TV. I think if the cgb would be changed back to how it was AFTER the beta, it would even out the playing field between PC and Console players in regards to cgb'ing and not make it such a safe move on the consoles.

[Camemberto]

It might even be this way right now, I can't really tell. counter guard breaking feels so inconsistent, that I can hardly learn from successfully doing so, because it might just as well have been by accident. Weirdly enough, the only guard break I can pretty consistently counter is the ranged guard break from the Shinobi.

[ChampionRuby50g]

Counter guard breaking has little to no reward.
A couple of things that happened:

She gb's, I cgb, I immediately dodge backwards, get caught by the next gb.
She gb's, I cgb, I do a light attack, get hit by her attack before mine connects.
She gb's, I cgb, I do a heavy attack, get caught by her gb.

It seems like counter guard breaking is pretty useless right now, other than not being hit in the face with a chair.

For how hard the guard break is to counter on the console, I feel like there is no reward for successfully doing so.
I am not saying it should have more rewards, like guarantied damage, but it should be easier to pull of and leave you with some kind of an advantage other than being back to neutral at best.

1. GB is a direct counter for dodge
2. I don't know about timings, by maybe Valks attack she used comes out quicker than your used attack, or the player simply attacked first after you CGB.
3. Getting GB through heavy start up has been a issue for a while now, it happens frequently with heroes who have slower heavy's, and is bloody annoying.

CGB will never be "useless" as you don't get GB and have damage done to you, get you put into compromising positions, or thrown of a ledge by a Warlord.
CGB is not hard on console. Just Spam GB button when you see the indicator pop up, or go into advanced training and practice is against the bot.

[Camemberto]

CGB will never be "useless" as you don't get GB and have damage done to you, get you put into compromising positions, or thrown of a ledge by a Warlord.
CGB is not hard on console. Just Spam GB button when you see the indicator pop up, or go into advanced training and practice is against the bot.

A CGB is way harder to pull off than a parry, still it leaves me to a completely neutral position as opposed to the relatively easy parry, which opens a whole range of punishes.
The fact you have to spam the GB button just stinks. I don't spam the heavy attack button on a parry as well. There should be one button press at exactly the right time IMO.

Too early -> eat it.
Too soon -> eat it.

This would make it more skillful and less dependent on hardware...

[Anarnam]

Parry is insanely hard to pull off against hardcore player due to sick feinting strategies. cgb will always be the same no matter the player.

I was actually thinking about punish after cgb in terms of how fast your light attack would start after cgb. It could be slightly faster perhaps? But still I'm not too convinced about that because some classes have fast attacks by default.

[ChampionRuby50g]

A CGB is way harder to pull off than a parry, still it leaves me to a completely neutral position as opposed to the relatively easy parry, which opens a whole range of punishes.
The fact you have to spam the GB button just stinks. I don't spam the heavy attack button on a parry as well. There should be one button press at exactly the right time IMO.

Too early -> eat it.
Too soon -> eat it.


This would make it more skillful and less dependent on hardware...

I disagree completely. CGB is far easier to do than parry. Parry, you have to focus a lot more, what direction the attack is coming from, is it a heavy or a light. But GB is one action and one direction, so to speak. The GB mechanic is this way in the first place because it's easier for the General population of the game.

[Camemberto]

I don't know...

In my experience I can parry pretty consistently and I know when and why I messed up, if I do.
But with guardbreaks, even if I know for 100% that one is coming and I am completely prepared more often than not, I cannot seem to get it right.
I also get parried alot more, than counter guard broken... then again, I attack more, than I guard break, so it might just seem this way.

You mustn't forget, I play on console, so frame rate and input lag do matter a lot.
This argument is easily dismissable by PC players, because they don't get to experience it, so they can't tell the difference obviously.

Unless you also play on console, in which case, I might just have to live with the fact, that I'm just too incompetent... which I doubt, though

[Ackturi]

What about people spamming gb putting you into neutral while another just hits you since you can't move.... I play 4s and any 1v2-1v3 someone tries to spam gb so i'm unable to stop other attacks.

[ChampionRuby50g]

I don't know...

In my experience I can parry pretty consistently and I know when and why I messed up, if I do.
But with guardbreaks, even if I know for 100% that one is coming and I am completely prepared more often than not, I cannot seem to get it right.
I also get parried alot more, than counter guard broken... then again, I attack more, than I guard break, so it might just seem this way.

You mustn't forget, I play on console, so frame rate and input lag do matter a lot.
This argument is easily dismissable by PC players, because they don't get to experience it, so they can't tell the difference obviously.

Unless you also play on console, in which case, I might just have to live with the fact, that I'm just too incompetent... which I doubt, though

I'm also a console player, so we are in the same boat more or less. I wouldn't say that your incompetent, more that your skills are highly invested elsewhere in the game 😏 You could probably parry a lot better than I as a result of this.
But alas, I still believe that CGB is easier than pulling of a parry, and that there shouldn't be any more rewards for successful CGB.